Author Topic: Another Mass Shooting At A School  (Read 2012 times)

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S.

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Re: Another Mass Shooting At A School
« Reply #30 on: May 25, 2022, 11:50:27 AM »
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Of course guns should be better controlled but America is a sick country. That's what happens when your priorities are making as much money as possible with no regard for human life and starting wars - at least those are the priorities of the ruling class and we don't have much of a say in the matter.
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I agree. The availability of Guns are probably a big factor, but it can‘t be the only one.
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Easy access to guns is the biggest issue. But, a lack of universal healthcare (including mental health) leading to limited access for people truly in need of mental health help is a contributing factor.

Banning/putting stronger legislation on guns won't ensure this never happens again (Toronto had incel drive down as many people as he could, a guy in Nova Scotia killed a bunch of people on a rampage, Norway had Brevik), but I believe it would strongly reduce the frequency this shit happens. No other Western nation has a murder rate approaching the United States.

One of the saddest aspects of this is (once you get past 19 kids who went to school and never came back, or the teachers who were killed doing their job). When school shootings happen (especially prior to gofundme's etc), not only were the survivors burdened with PTSD and Survivors' guilt. But absolutely massive medical bills that could easily bankrupt a middle-class family.

I agree one hundred percent. I haves lived in the US and I think I understand some things about the country, but your relationship to guns has always been really strange from an outsider‘s perspective. It is not just the availability of guns, but also people‘s relationship to them. Even on this board people were writing that their first response to the pandemic was to stock up on guns. WTF were you thinking? So You were gonna shoot the virus straight in the balls?

I grew up in a (for Germany) bad town and I saw illegal guns and it probably would not be extremely difficult to get one, but I (and 98% of Germans) don‘t really feel that it is necessary to own one. If you are caught with an illegal gun you face a serious charge, plus It is highly implausible I would ever need it. I also feel like if I ever drew a gun I would probably have to use it. I just had a beer with a police officer last week watching a football match and he told me that most German police officers retire without ever firing their gun on the job.

I know two people who have been murdered. One was my football coach at an American high-school in Bailey Colorado, who was shot and killed as a deputy police officer, while trying to arrest a man at his home for some minor charges. The other one was a skater I knew from Bogota Colombia who was shot an killed by two teenagers trying to rob him while he was at the skatepark. Fuck guns!

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Re: Another Mass Shooting At A School
« Reply #32 on: May 25, 2022, 01:29:52 PM »
2 weeks in a row I've got to talk to elementary and middle school students about mass shootings. The 5-8 graders are very emotional right now. We had some powerful conversations about things I never had to consider as a child.
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Velcro Wallet

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Re: Another Mass Shooting At A School
« Reply #33 on: May 25, 2022, 01:36:54 PM »
We had a mass shooting in 96 and that was that. No more guns. The gun amnesty was a great success. Go Australia.

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Re: Another Mass Shooting At A School
« Reply #34 on: May 25, 2022, 01:48:25 PM »
The 5-8 graders are very emotional right now.

God damnit. This is not what is supposed to be on their minds. This is so heartbreaking. This has got to fucking stop.
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DaleSr

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Re: Another Mass Shooting At A School
« Reply #35 on: May 25, 2022, 01:49:32 PM »
This is what happens when a country built on the blood and graves of its previous owners runs out of frontier to conquer. Many of the young alienated men that you would send off to die in some campaign in pursuit of spoils, glory and treasure instead get their brains cooked online and wonder why they don't measure up to the vaunted men they are marketed to in cowboy, soldier and cop films and tv shows. They find some community of other nihilistic shut ins who convince them it's some combo of the Jews, communists, gays and immigrants who are responsible for why their life doesn't fit into a John Wayne script. So they arm up and look for a soft unarmed target because they don't have any desire to do something hard or attack someone who has any chance of fighting back. They want guaranteed success in their sick quest. And it happens in states with the heaviest gun control as well as states with the most lax. Even if gun control were enacted on a large scale, it will do nothing to stop the 500 million guns already floating out there legally, not to mention the amount of guns that people acquire through less than legal means. This is a fundamentally sick country. And no one in power wants to help you or has a path to change things

ice nine

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Re: Another Mass Shooting At A School
« Reply #36 on: May 25, 2022, 01:52:43 PM »
Not to take a side in the exchange between dingus and serious, but on a similar note.. I do find it astonishing that there’s been no successful, or even publicly known, attempts on the lives of the depraved and shameful public leaders/figures that have been making the world an increasingly evil place. 

Obviously trying to fight violence with violence isn’t the answer, and those who oppose it in the first place won’t be likely to engage themselves.. but it’s interesting how there’s countless radical self-proclaimed martyrs for certain right-adjacent causes, but none for things like gun control, basic human rights, etc.
i don’t get how supreme court judges aren’t assisnated (or attempted at least) all the time.
I;m sure i;m not the only dc/monster/subaru type guy here

Frank

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Re: Another Mass Shooting At A School
« Reply #37 on: May 25, 2022, 02:05:22 PM »
a quick headsup: don't post any direct calls for violence against politicians and such. these posts will be deleted when we see em. they can put a target on this forum and us.

please keep the conversation as civil as possible. discussing the causes for violent uprising is totally alright of course. just don't write something like "someone should shoot so and so, that would be great."

also, violence sucks.

thank you

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Re: Another Mass Shooting At A School
« Reply #38 on: May 25, 2022, 02:13:27 PM »
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The 5-8 graders are very emotional right now.
[close]

God damnit. This is not what is supposed to be on their minds. This is so heartbreaking. This has got to fucking stop.

We were talking a lot about belief v action, WHY this might happen and how we need to work to not alienate peers, because if we do, if we don't listen or push away a peer due to a different belief, how can we affect a change in their belief system?

I've got kids stating they want cameras and security guards in schools. They want mental health support too. Its nuts
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Freelancevagrant

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Re: Another Mass Shooting At A School
« Reply #39 on: May 25, 2022, 02:24:19 PM »
This is what happens when a country built on the blood and graves of its previous owners runs out of frontier to conquer. Many of the young alienated men that you would send off to die in some campaign in pursuit of spoils, glory and treasure instead get their brains cooked online and wonder why they don't measure up to the vaunted men they are marketed to in cowboy, soldier and cop films and tv shows. They find some community of other nihilistic shut ins who convince them it's some combo of the Jews, communists, gays and immigrants who are responsible for why their life doesn't fit into a John Wayne script. So they arm up and look for a soft unarmed target because they don't have any desire to do something hard or attack someone who has any chance of fighting back. They want guaranteed success in their sick quest. And it happens in states with the heaviest gun control as well as states with the most lax. Even if gun control were enacted on a large scale, it will do nothing to stop the 500 million guns already floating out there legally, not to mention the amount of guns that people acquire through less than legal means. This is a fundamentally sick country. And no one in power wants to help you or has a path to change things

Were living in the twilight of an empire.

It’s hard to tell the difference between a whisper and a scream when the sounds of societal collapse drown almost everything else out.

The blood of the workers, the disenfranchised, and the marginalized are nothing more than numbers and data to these fucking monsters in suits. It’s all a power play. It’s almost like the democrats want gun control to ensure only the state has weapons, and the republicans want the masses to have weapons so they can slaughter each other, but only given enough access to these weapons so they can still be obliterated by a militarized police force.

That being said, this shooting hit really close to home, literally and physically. I can’t imagine the pain these families and this community is feeling. Love and solidarity to the families of those senselessly murdered.
Well I have like 9 Andy Anderson dated flight decks.

GardenSkater77

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Re: Another Mass Shooting At A School
« Reply #40 on: May 25, 2022, 02:59:31 PM »
I was impressed Beto confronted the TX governor and said what he said. How ironic one person on stage said that Beto was being political at a press conference being held by the governor to shift blame to mental illness.

I do not believe Beto’s team told him to do that and I am not so cynical to believe he thought he would score political points by interrupting a press conference. I believe he is just sick of this shit like the lot of us.

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Re: Another Mass Shooting At A School
« Reply #41 on: May 25, 2022, 03:04:13 PM »
your m1 with a jungled carbine is setting off the metal detector, stop shooting at once

whale

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Re: Another Mass Shooting At A School
« Reply #42 on: May 25, 2022, 03:19:30 PM »
Guns are supposed to be there for everyones protection, right?
But I’m not hearing any hero stories.

Ban all weapons.

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Re: Another Mass Shooting At A School
« Reply #43 on: May 25, 2022, 03:48:57 PM »
Someone please tell me the whole world isn’t as fucked up as our country. I’ve traveled a lot but you never see the real story until you live there. Every time this happens it makes me want to move out of country even though I know that’s doing nothing to fix the problem. But fuck man, I feel like I can’t take any more of this and need to get away. I am worried sick about the country my daughter will inherit and am afraid she won’t have any right to make any decisions for herself. How are we regressing?
I’d skin my knee and palms so bad on my buddy’s jump ramp with that thing.

DannyDee

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Re: Another Mass Shooting At A School
« Reply #44 on: May 25, 2022, 04:09:12 PM »
They might work as a deterrent, but let's not forget both of the high-profile recent shootings were engaged with by armed officers/security guards either before they entered the premises (Uvalde) or after they quickly entered the premises (Buffalo).

Someone with an AR15 and full tactical gear is going to leg up on any police officer/security guard unless that person is a perfect crack shot as they are one not fully expecting it, and two under equipped.

Its not really comparable to sporting events which are for-profit endeavors that can afford the massive security investment. That burden can't be passed on to local school boards. An NFL game with 50 or fully staffed cops and metal detectors is a huge deterrent, a school with a metal detector and maybe one armed cop isn't. We are talking about a school board in a city where the median income is about 66% of the average American household income and 15% of the city lives in poverty. These schools are already understaffed, have underpaid teachers and likely have kids who go to bed hungry. The solution has to come from higher levels of government (the feds and state). These schools have so many issues they have to address on a daily basis before even grasping the chance they could be one of the unlucky schools to have a psycho with easy access to guns show up. The more a local underfunded school district is asked to spend on security, the more it takes away from hiring quality teachers, new/up to date text books and meal programs. The solutions have to come from higher up government or adequate government funding passed down allowing them to finance high level security.
« Last Edit: May 26, 2022, 03:44:42 AM by Frank »

h00man

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Re: Another Mass Shooting At A School
« Reply #45 on: May 25, 2022, 04:21:05 PM »
How are we regressing?

Republicans, Conservatives, NRA, religious extremists, Fox News, Tucker Carlson, access to the internet, Donald Trump, etc.
she can ride dick ham ham no joke ham

TastyBurrito

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Re: Another Mass Shooting At A School
« Reply #46 on: May 25, 2022, 04:23:33 PM »
While metal detectors work in theory, one guard and some detectors won’t stop someone who is actively shooting.

Also, we expect schools to add the cost of and upkeep to their budgets? Some schools are poor as is and can barely afford the basic necessities for students.

If this were to be implemented, there would need to be an overhaul of budgets on the state level and as we all know, red states dont give a shit about public school systems.


BartHarleyJarvis

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Re: Another Mass Shooting At A School
« Reply #47 on: May 25, 2022, 04:28:53 PM »
The argument over "how do we make schools safer? Metal detectors, man traps, locking doors, bulletproof backpacks" is so fucking stupid. You could lock a school down and make it as hard a target as you want, those kids are going to have to come out at some point. You make the interior of the school impossible to access, the next guy is just going to wait until class gets out and shoot people outside instead of inside. This was true in 1966 during the UT Tower shooting, the columbine shooters started outside before going in, it's still true now. It's the Guns, stupid.

The real solution is that there is no solution. This country is fundamentally broken and there is no body count that is going to change anything.

BartHarleyJarvis

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Re: Another Mass Shooting At A School
« Reply #48 on: May 25, 2022, 05:08:10 PM »
I definitely didn't mean to target that at you directly, I apologize for that. It was more directed towards all the Fox news spin going on out there.

It's also just true that mass shootings are a very small fraction of the totality of gun violence in this country. Even if there was never another mass shooting, over 45k people a year die because of guns. The solution is and always has been that there need to be less guns but it's never going to happen.
« Last Edit: May 26, 2022, 03:45:38 AM by Frank »

DannyDee

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Re: Another Mass Shooting At A School
« Reply #49 on: May 25, 2022, 05:29:11 PM »
They might work as a deterrent, but let's not forget both of the high-profile recent shootings were engaged with by armed officers/security guards either before they entered the premises (Uvalde) or after they quickly entered the premises (Buffalo).

Someone with an AR15 and full tactical gear is going to leg up on any police officer/security guard unless that person is a perfect crack shot as they are one not fully expecting it, and two under equipped.

Its not really comparable to sporting events which are for-profit endeavors that can afford the massive security investment. That burden can't be passed on to local school boards. An NFL game with 50 or fully staffed cops and metal detectors is a huge deterrent, a school with a metal detector and maybe one armed cop isn't. We are talking about a school board in a city where the median income is about 66% of the average American household income and 15% of the city lives in poverty. These schools are already understaffed, have underpaid teachers and likely have kids who go to bed hungry. The solution has to come from higher levels of government (the feds and state). These schools have so many issues they have to address on a daily basis before even grasping the chance they could be one of the unlucky schools to have a psycho with easy access to guns show up. The more a local underfunded school district is asked to spend on security, the more it takes away from hiring quality teachers, new/up to date text books and meal programs. The solutions have to come from higher up government or adequate government funding passed down allowing them to finance high level security.
[/quote]
all valid points, i fully understand the overall funding issue and how we'll need government intervention. i wish i could be optimistic and say i believe that that's going to happen. i'm studying to be a teacher and it's definitely daunting thinking about the terrible funding on top of these mass shootings; there's so many problems at hand. i'm not tunnel visioned on the metal detectors yall, was just saying they could be one of many safety precautions.
my grandma is the perfect example of the kind of mindset we have to deal with. any time my dad tries to argue with her about how there should be background checks/training for guns, she instantly calls it socialism or that we're infringing on the second amendment.
[/quote]
Look, I get the desire of some people to try to think there are more reasonable solutions that don't require trying to convince ardent gun rights supporters and republicans that it's either serious gun reform or nothing will change. I just have a hard time seeing anything but serious gun reform changing this devastating pattern. Seems anything else is trying to stop a leak in a dam with ducktape. Canada and the United States are probably the two countries closest to each other culturally, yet have a dramatic difference in these types of instances and gun violence overall. We consume the same media essentially. Play the same violent video games, watch the same violent Hollywood films, listen to the same Nihilistic music, all things people blamed Columbine on, yet why does Canada have a gun violence rate of about 20% of the United States? I'd say its primarily gun control laws, but you could also look at better access to mental health experts and more overall social services. But, the difference isn't Canada's barricades it schools better and has armed guards.

As a Canadian, I know we have our issues too which I've pointed to (we've had our spree/mass killers too, just at a dramatically lower rate even when adjusted for population). No society is perfect or free from violence. But, as a frequent visitor to the United States, who used to love the idea of moving there at certain points, I'm now horrified but what I see on a frequent basis. Does that mean I won't visit anymore? No. Has it altered how I view the United States as a country? Absolutely.
« Last Edit: May 26, 2022, 03:45:59 AM by Frank »


IUTSM

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Re: Another Mass Shooting At A School
« Reply #51 on: May 25, 2022, 06:12:56 PM »
develop relationships with your students, get to know them. seriously, get to know them and you'll figure out the pulse of the school, who to watch, etc.

cops/security in schools set kids up to fail. I can't tell you how many kids I've seen profiled by SRO's or kids that are triggered by cops in schools. I had one kid, 11 years old, say to me today "white people don't mind cops in schools, but I'm Native American, and you don't want to be around cops when you're Native American."

these kids, in this rural trumpy as fuck place, man, most of em were saying we've gotta get rid of the AR platform, up age requirements, and do better background checks. On top of that they were saying they think we need to fix what's going on in the country, because it's the only way people will stop.

gotta listen to the kids on this one
« Last Edit: May 26, 2022, 03:46:47 AM by Frank »
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manysnakes

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Re: Another Mass Shooting At A School
« Reply #52 on: May 26, 2022, 05:41:46 AM »
This is an astonishing display of cowardice which would have, in the past, resulted in public humiliation and the loss of their jobs. If you haven’t seen the videos of the cops standing around doing nothing but threatening parents while their children are inside the school getting murdered, they’re all over the internet today but they are not for the faint of heart and maybe skip them if you have young children yourself.

https://www.wvtm13.com/article/uvalde-texas-robb-elementary-school-shooting/40108561
This is not my SOTY. I'm telling my kids there was no SOTY for 2021

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Re: Another Mass Shooting At A School
« Reply #53 on: May 26, 2022, 06:51:56 AM »
The real solution is that there is no solution. This country is fundamentally broken and there is no body count that is going to change anything.

The unfortunate truth. No one should need to be scared to go the grocery store for fear of not coming, no one should have to send their children to school terrified they may not come home. No child should have to deal with this.

But here we are, more shootings than days have passed this year. The news channels cover this and then a few days later have to move on to the next one.

Every time a mass shooting happens it definitely bums me out but, I've been really pissed / upset about this one. Thoughts are with all these families.

I feel for everyone who has children and has to sit there and explain this to them.

EdLawndale

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Re: Another Mass Shooting At A School
« Reply #54 on: May 26, 2022, 06:58:49 AM »
Pretty ridiculous that the response to an 18 year old with two guns shooting up a bunch of 4th graders by a state that prides itself on being armed to the teeth to ensure that the good guy with a gun can stop the bad guy with a gun is described as "unprepared."
"Was just about to say, wtf is up with this EdLawndale guy?"


TastyBurrito

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Re: Another Mass Shooting At A School
« Reply #55 on: May 26, 2022, 07:44:58 AM »
The Republican response it "It's not a gun problem, it's a mental health problem" yet Abbott recent cut funding from programs that would oversee mental health. Also, red states and red politicians are constantly against funding and providing healthcare access to those who need it.

Hell, they're already claiming it's because of the lack of God in school as well as rap music and violent video games. These fucks do a lot to avoid the actual problem.

HeavyAndExpensive

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Re: Another Mass Shooting At A School
« Reply #56 on: May 26, 2022, 07:59:49 AM »
I was impressed Beto confronted the TX governor and said what he said. How ironic one person on stage said that Beto was being political at a press conference being held by the governor to shift blame to mental illness.

Also, the idea that "being political" is inherently negative is ridiculous. Though these days being "too political" is a euphemism for "what you're saying offends my right-wing sensibilities."

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Re: Another Mass Shooting At A School
« Reply #57 on: May 26, 2022, 08:00:37 AM »
The Republican response it "It's not a gun problem, it's a mental health problem" yet Abbott recent cut funding from programs that would oversee mental health. Also, red states and red politicians are constantly against funding and providing healthcare access to those who need it.

Hell, they're already claiming it's because of the lack of God in school as well as rap music and violent video games. These fucks do a lot to avoid the actual problem.

“It is difficult to get a man to understand something, when his salary depends on his not understanding it.”
-Upton Sinclair

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Re: Another Mass Shooting At A School
« Reply #58 on: May 26, 2022, 08:01:17 AM »
There were 5 cops, a chief, and a security guard in the school. They did nothing.

https://theintercept.com/2022/05/25/texas-uvalde-shooting-school-police/

This is a good one to read if you want stats
Well-defined ambiguity, I'm already on somebody's list as a casualty