Fallen Footwear

[RollingThunder]

Ride the Sky was / is fucking gnarly.

[Zurg]

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Why is this such a big deal to you guys? Reading this is a giant headache. I am honored Nike (biggest sports brand on earth) wants a part in skateboarding, won't buy em myself but still! �

Do whatever you want, so long as it's legal no-one is getting screwed.

[close]

But people are getting screwed �
Dudes just lost their jobs and sponsorships so what you said doesn't make sense.
Plus, shops are closing because of Nike. Which I know people will argue that shops are responsible too, but still there is a lot evidence that Nike interference correlates with shops closing.
The way I see it, no one should be honored that Nike is in skateboarding unless you're getting their paychecks. Even then you know the checks come with a grain of salt.

So it would be better if Nike shut down its skate program and fires it's 30 person skate team and large staff including some skating legends than fallen cut its 8 team members or whatever and presumably small staff? Not to mention the 100s on flow. I don't think fallen sponsors anyone in my area.

I don't like how people equate the demise of a crap company to the demise of skating. Surely this won't affect our want/will to skate

[2000]

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They need to come out with some tech shit that actually competes with lunarlon

[close]

Lunarlon is for running, it's not gonna make you skate any better unless you buy in to the whole placebo effect. I'd rather have System G2 or STI Evolution foam which have already been in skating since before the nike Koston 1. I agree about the lynx though, that reissue was ass.

[close]

system g2? Isn't that the shit they used in es shoes in the early 2000s? I haven't skated the new sti foam, and probably never will. �There isn't a single shoe from emerica or etnies I'd buy. Same for lakai and dc. �A couple years ago I had a pair of chuck taylors with lunarlon, and a pair of dc kalis centrics at the same time. Even though the dcs' had a fucking air bubble in the heel like all the shoes from the early 2000s, I still couldn't skate for more than an hour without getting sore. Every session with the cons was more enjoyable. Definitely not placebo effect.

g2 was in the reynold 3's and I had about 5 pairs of them and they skated amazing. I had koston's first shoe and the lunar gatos and I wasn't really impressed. I never skated suede lunar cons though but I don't see why every nike cupsole except dunks feature some kind of bullshit that makes them cost $130

[Main]

Tommy and Dane will probably end up on Dekline or Vans if lucky.

Dekline has been dead for awhile now dude.

[straight]

[Iceman]

if you buy any of the big corpo brands, you have blood on your hands. if you ride/work for them, you're drenched in it.

[Casey Jones]

It took me 7 pages to realize Jamie Thomas himself started this thread. Obviously to see what everyone says about it.

[HoudiniXLogic]

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Tommy and Dane will probably end up on Dekline or Vans if lucky.

[close]

Dekline has been dead for awhile now dude.

Im fucking slow on news. Ah well.

[DGKALIS]

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Why is this such a big deal to you guys? Reading this is a giant headache. I am honored Nike (biggest sports brand on earth) wants a part in skateboarding, won't buy em myself but still! �

Do whatever you want, so long as it's legal no-one is getting screwed.

[close]

But people are getting screwed �
Dudes just lost their jobs and sponsorships so what you said doesn't make sense.
Plus, shops are closing because of Nike. Which I know people will argue that shops are responsible too, but still there is a lot evidence that Nike interference correlates with shops closing.
The way I see it, no one should be honored that Nike is in skateboarding unless you're getting their paychecks. Even then you know the checks come with a grain of salt.

[close]

So it would be better if Nike shut down its skate program and fires it's 30 person skate team and large staff including some skating legends than fallen cut its 8 team members or whatever and presumably small staff? Not to mention the 100s on flow. I don't think fallen sponsors anyone in my area.

I don't like how people equate the demise of a crap company to the demise of skating. Surely this won't affect our want/will to skate

Yup... then divide up the 30+ PRO's on the squad... back into skate shoe companies. Now you have multiple brands on the shelves.. pushing multiple PRO shoes per brand. Way more people eating, way more doors opening, and a lot more glass ceilings breaking for pro skaters. How long is Ishods name going to be on that dunk, or Coreys name on his shoe? These guys going to have longevity within Nike? Multiple shoes? 10-15 different shoes through out the years? who's next, Luan, Shane, Theotis, Guy, Malto, Bobby, Alex..... who's next? Years are flying by... There is a bunch of people on that team that deserve a pro shoe. Not a color way, not "name on a shoe for a year"...
Some of these dudes need to be the icons of brands and products that carry their names for a long time. Instead they are sitting waiting patiently... false hope.

[Hercules Rockefeller]

boom.

even though i get Zurgs point, both with fallen being kind of out of the loop and not that important anymore (their last 2, 3 lines majorly increased in quality though), Kalis kind of hit the nail on the head.

i doubt that a regular pro model on another brand would make those guys as much money as a colorway on nike though. might be wrong here, but kidna feels that way.

[OrangeVHStapes]

wasn't the don't do it campaign started by consolidated? I'm drunk and could be wrong but Im pretty sure they were the ones who started it, which is amazing because Consolidated is the shit.

[Krooked antihero]

wasn't the don't do it campaign started by consolidated? I'm drunk and could be wrong but Im pretty sure they were the ones who started it, which is amazing because Consolidated is the shit.

Yep.

[Esquivel]

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Why is this such a big deal to you guys? Reading this is a giant headache. I am honored Nike (biggest sports brand on earth) wants a part in skateboarding, won't buy em myself but still! �

Do whatever you want, so long as it's legal no-one is getting screwed.

[close]

But people are getting screwed �
Dudes just lost their jobs and sponsorships so what you said doesn't make sense.
Plus, shops are closing because of Nike. Which I know people will argue that shops are responsible too, but still there is a lot evidence that Nike interference correlates with shops closing.
The way I see it, no one should be honored that Nike is in skateboarding unless you're getting their paychecks. Even then you know the checks come with a grain of salt.

[close]

So it would be better if Nike shut down its skate program and fires it's 30 person skate team and large staff including some skating legends than fallen cut its 8 team members or whatever and presumably small staff? Not to mention the 100s on flow. I don't think fallen sponsors anyone in my area.

I don't like how people equate the demise of a crap company to the demise of skating. Surely this won't affect our want/will to skate

are you joking? this is the most pathetic logic ever! so in the same manner, macdonald's is a good thing to exist because they employ so many rad people and if they go out of business all these employees are going to lose their jobs. no mention on all the businesses that macdonalds shut down in the proccess (in the same way nike shuts down other brands), so that they could get to where they are now. fuck nike, their riders will surely be hired by some other company if they are that good. maybe macdonalds or starbucks can take them

[KoRnholio8]

Fuck Nike, Adidas and New Balance. That is all.

[Esquivel]

http://www.skate-the-planet.com/articles/dontdoit.html

i remember reading the last picture shown in this article when i was young af. it pretty much forged my political ideology. it made me feel good to be a skater and showed me how we (skaters) used to be different to generic sports jocks, by not falling into the corporate trap. this whole idea was decorated by amazing figures like koston, mariano and some others. i dont feel betrayed by those fags' life choices, i just feel disappointed because i thought skateboarding as the last fortress to hold against mainstream bullshit. skaters used to be punks in some sort of way. now, most are shauwn pooers copycats with a huge lack of eclecticism that is proven even more by the presence of trap in skate vids.
though  nike > trap

[Turtle Boy]

You want to keep seeing Soletec, DC or Lakai products in your local shop?
You'd better pass on those Nike sb/Adidas/Cons shoe sales that make you buy shoes that you don't even need in whatever online shop super deal.

Sure Nike SB/Adidas/Cons make shoes that last a while, have incredible teams and promote the shit of their products; but if you don't want to see other brands like Soletec, DC or Lakai disappear, you'd better buy less corporate shoes on sale and buy only shoes when you actually need shoes of a brand you actually want to push.

You guys complaining at Nike or whatever corporation are in fact complaining about savage capitalism.
It's not Adidas or Nike fault, they are playing the money game following the rules.
You should complain about the rules of the game instead of the players of the game.

What you see with those brand like Dekline, Fallen etc... is what is happening everyday within other industries: grocery shops Vs Wallmart; local restaurants Vs big fast food companies ; brick and mortar shops Vs Online shops ; Western factories Vs Asian factories.

We as consumers are the main responsibles of what is happening.


Nowadays the quality isn't even a big difference between Corporate Vs "Core" shoes, but yeah Lakai or Soletec cannot afford to run a skatepark in NYC or sponsor half of the NYC scene, or help cool brands like Polar (Cons), Magenta (Adidas) or Skate Mental (Nike). It's a marketing war, and when you see your favorite skaters wearing nikes 100 times a day while only seeing lakais once or twice, at the end of the day you want to buy Nikes.


I'm kind of hypocrite because I'm skating Adidas Superstar ADV at the moment (great shoes btw), but from now I'll try to pass on Nike/CONS and Adidas.

[TheAmericanAntique]

It's hard reading everyones stuff so sorry if this has been said, but I wear only Hufs at the moment and I think what keeps them around is having altamont group around....From what I read, they are just investors for Huf which means they put money into projects and ideas. Which inturn gives you a quality product....I've skated the galaxy for example which is a busenitz rip off, but it is a great rip off and lets me be able to support a skate company without destroying my feet, same with the classic, converse rip off, but again it actually preforms especially the latest ones with the new sole construction. People freakout over these investors, but we forget that Huf is not only smart, but would never let someone ruin his idea, or tell him no. Where Fallen, and many other core brands have cut corners, and released these shoes that imo should be ashamed of because they are thin as shit, and unglue so fast you can't even enjoy them. SO with the swoosh, Converse, NB, and adidas making these "great" shoes, we see everyone talking shit about rip off but I would much rather skate huf then nike. So hopefully for the core brands that are still around,  wake up and go to investors, make a good deal and when you  make good shoes if it is truly great it will show.

[SFblah]

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Why is this such a big deal to you guys? Reading this is a giant headache. I am honored Nike (biggest sports brand on earth) wants a part in skateboarding, won't buy em myself but still! �

Do whatever you want, so long as it's legal no-one is getting screwed.

[close]

But people are getting screwed �
Dudes just lost their jobs and sponsorships so what you said doesn't make sense.
Plus, shops are closing because of Nike. Which I know people will argue that shops are responsible too, but still there is a lot evidence that Nike interference correlates with shops closing.
The way I see it, no one should be honored that Nike is in skateboarding unless you're getting their paychecks. Even then you know the checks come with a grain of salt.

[close]

So it would be better if Nike shut down its skate program and fires it's 30 person skate team and large staff including some skating legends than fallen cut its 8 team members or whatever and presumably small staff? Not to mention the 100s on flow. I don't think fallen sponsors anyone in my area.

I don't like how people equate the demise of a crap company to the demise of skating. Surely this won't affect our want/will to skate

[close]

Yup... then divide up the 30+ PRO's on the squad... back into skate shoe companies. Now you have multiple brands on the shelves.. pushing multiple PRO shoes per brand. Way more people eating, way more doors opening, and a lot more glass ceilings breaking for pro skaters. How long is Ishods name going to be on that dunk, or Coreys name on his shoe? These guys going to have longevity within Nike? Multiple shoes? 10-15 different shoes through out the years? who's next, Luan, Shane, Theotis, Guy, Malto, Bobby, Alex..... who's next? Years are flying by... There is a bunch of people on that team that deserve a pro shoe. Not a color way, not "name on a shoe for a year"...
Some of these dudes need to be the icons of brands and products that carry their names for a long time. Instead they are sitting waiting patiently... false hope.

I have also thought of this too. How Shane, Luan, or Malto don't have a signature shoe is insane. It's as bad as Carlos Ribeiro being on Chocolate blackhole flow for years.

[Mcfctid]

Why is this such a big deal to you guys? Reading this is a giant headache. I am honored Nike (biggest sports brand on earth) wants a part in skateboarding, won't buy em myself but still!  

Do whatever you want, so long as it's legal no-one is getting screwed.

[sleepypancakes]

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wasn't the don't do it campaign started by consolidated? I'm drunk and could be wrong but Im pretty sure they were the ones who started it, which is amazing because Consolidated is the shit.

[close]

Yep.

In related Consolidated shoe news, they're releasing another shoe poking at Nike.

[PC500]

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Why is this such a big deal to you guys? Reading this is a giant headache. I am honored Nike (biggest sports brand on earth) wants a part in skateboarding, won't buy em myself but still! �

Do whatever you want, so long as it's legal no-one is getting screwed.

[close]

But people are getting screwed �
Dudes just lost their jobs and sponsorships so what you said doesn't make sense.
Plus, shops are closing because of Nike. Which I know people will argue that shops are responsible too, but still there is a lot evidence that Nike interference correlates with shops closing.
The way I see it, no one should be honored that Nike is in skateboarding unless you're getting their paychecks. Even then you know the checks come with a grain of salt.

[close]

So it would be better if Nike shut down its skate program and fires it's 30 person skate team and large staff including some skating legends than fallen cut its 8 team members or whatever and presumably small staff? Not to mention the 100s on flow. I don't think fallen sponsors anyone in my area.

I don't like how people equate the demise of a crap company to the demise of skating. Surely this won't affect our want/will to skate

[close]

Yup... then divide up the 30+ PRO's on the squad... back into skate shoe companies. Now you have multiple brands on the shelves.. pushing multiple PRO shoes per brand. Way more people eating, way more doors opening, and a lot more glass ceilings breaking for pro skaters. How long is Ishods name going to be on that dunk, or Coreys name on his shoe? These guys going to have longevity within Nike? Multiple shoes? 10-15 different shoes through out the years? who's next, Luan, Shane, Theotis, Guy, Malto, Bobby, Alex..... who's next? Years are flying by... There is a bunch of people on that team that deserve a pro shoe. Not a color way, not "name on a shoe for a year"...
Some of these dudes need to be the icons of brands and products that carry their names for a long time. Instead they are sitting waiting patiently... false hope.

This is a great point. Monopolies generally aren't good for any industry. Definitely not skateboarding.

[Donkey Lips]

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Why is this such a big deal to you guys? Reading this is a giant headache. I am honored Nike (biggest sports brand on earth) wants a part in skateboarding, won't buy em myself but still! �

Do whatever you want, so long as it's legal no-one is getting screwed.

[close]

But people are getting screwed �
Dudes just lost their jobs and sponsorships so what you said doesn't make sense.
Plus, shops are closing because of Nike. Which I know people will argue that shops are responsible too, but still there is a lot evidence that Nike interference correlates with shops closing.
The way I see it, no one should be honored that Nike is in skateboarding unless you're getting their paychecks. Even then you know the checks come with a grain of salt.

[close]

So it would be better if Nike shut down its skate program and fires it's 30 person skate team and large staff including some skating legends than fallen cut its 8 team members or whatever and presumably small staff? Not to mention the 100s on flow. I don't think fallen sponsors anyone in my area.

I don't like how people equate the demise of a crap company to the demise of skating. Surely this won't affect our want/will to skate

[close]

Yup... then divide up the 30+ PRO's on the squad... back into skate shoe companies. Now you have multiple brands on the shelves.. pushing multiple PRO shoes per brand. Way more people eating, way more doors opening, and a lot more glass ceilings breaking for pro skaters. How long is Ishods name going to be on that dunk, or Coreys name on his shoe? These guys going to have longevity within Nike? Multiple shoes? 10-15 different shoes through out the years? who's next, Luan, Shane, Theotis, Guy, Malto, Bobby, Alex..... who's next? Years are flying by... There is a bunch of people on that team that deserve a pro shoe. Not a color way, not "name on a shoe for a year"...
Some of these dudes need to be the icons of brands and products that carry their names for a long time. Instead they are sitting waiting patiently... false hope.

Playing devil's advocate here - so Nike releases it's 30 team pros, and they go back to "skate shoe companies"...how do these brands make room on the payroll for Koston, for Guy, for Corey, for Shane? What happens to the lesser knowns that are currently on these brands? Is DC going to find extra money just to take on more names? Or is DC going to make room by cutting riders with a less marketable name? It takes a ton of time to generate revenue off of a pro model shoe, out of an already over-saturated market, so please don't think they'll make the money up right away (if at all). What happens with all of the artificial sales from non-skateboarders when Nike pulls the plug?

Even releasing 10-15 of these big names back into the shoe market, would cause huge disruption for the rest of the team riders on the skate-owned brands. And what about the Nike riders that were encouraged to leave more established board brands for something more boutique? How do those guys offset the lack of the Nike check when they leave?

To address the Nike pro shoe dilemma, do you think maybe some of those guys just don't want their name on a shoe? Not like I know, but maybe Malto, Theotis and Shane are totally fine with just getting shoes, getting a steady payment, and skating without having to worry about whether or not their design/signature on a shoe performs. Maybe they aren't just sitting, waiting patiently, and that's a responsibility they don't care about.

This doesn't even touch the topic of staff, like Zurg mentioned. How many former Fallen, former Vans, former Lakai...etc. staff members have found employment with Nike? What happens if Nike pulls the plug? Is DC suddenly going to create new jobs for these designers, sales reps, and warehouse management?

[Charbroil]

SB makes more shops thrive than close, they set you up for success. If you are running a business and can't figure it out that's not SB's problem.

Not one of you would say shit to any of the team riders / employees face to face.

[DGKALIS]

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Why is this such a big deal to you guys? Reading this is a giant headache. I am honored Nike (biggest sports brand on earth) wants a part in skateboarding, won't buy em myself but still! �

Do whatever you want, so long as it's legal no-one is getting screwed.

[close]

But people are getting screwed �
Dudes just lost their jobs and sponsorships so what you said doesn't make sense.
Plus, shops are closing because of Nike. Which I know people will argue that shops are responsible too, but still there is a lot evidence that Nike interference correlates with shops closing.
The way I see it, no one should be honored that Nike is in skateboarding unless you're getting their paychecks. Even then you know the checks come with a grain of salt.

[close]

So it would be better if Nike shut down its skate program and fires it's 30 person skate team and large staff including some skating legends than fallen cut its 8 team members or whatever and presumably small staff? Not to mention the 100s on flow. I don't think fallen sponsors anyone in my area.

I don't like how people equate the demise of a crap company to the demise of skating. Surely this won't affect our want/will to skate

[close]

Yup... then divide up the 30+ PRO's on the squad... back into skate shoe companies. Now you have multiple brands on the shelves.. pushing multiple PRO shoes per brand. Way more people eating, way more doors opening, and a lot more glass ceilings breaking for pro skaters. How long is Ishods name going to be on that dunk, or Coreys name on his shoe? These guys going to have longevity within Nike? Multiple shoes? 10-15 different shoes through out the years? who's next, Luan, Shane, Theotis, Guy, Malto, Bobby, Alex..... who's next? Years are flying by... There is a bunch of people on that team that deserve a pro shoe. Not a color way, not "name on a shoe for a year"...
Some of these dudes need to be the icons of brands and products that carry their names for a long time. Instead they are sitting waiting patiently... false hope.

[close]

Playing devil's advocate here - so Nike releases it's 30 team pros, and they go back to "skate shoe companies"...how do these brands make room on the payroll for Koston, for Guy, for Corey, for Shane? What happens to the lesser knowns that are currently on these brands? Is DC going to find extra money just to take on more names? Or is DC going to make room by cutting riders with a less marketable name? It takes a ton of time to generate revenue off of a pro model shoe, out of an already over-saturated market, so please don't think they'll make the money up right away (if at all). What happens with all of the artificial sales from non-skateboarders when Nike pulls the plug?

Even releasing 10-15 of these big names back into the shoe market, would cause huge disruption for the rest of the team riders on the skate-owned brands. And what about the Nike riders that were encouraged to leave more established board brands for something more boutique? How do those guys offset the lack of the Nike check when they leave?

To address the Nike pro shoe dilemma, do you think maybe some of those guys just don't want their name on a shoe? Not like I know, but maybe Malto, Theotis and Shane are totally fine with just getting shoes, getting a steady payment, and skating without having to worry about whether or not their design/signature on a shoe performs. Maybe they aren't just sitting, waiting patiently, and that's a responsibility they don't care about.

This doesn't even touch the topic of staff, like Zurg mentioned. How many former Fallen, former Vans, former Lakai...etc. staff members have found employment with Nike? What happens if Nike pulls the plug? Is DC suddenly going to create new jobs for these designers, sales reps, and warehouse management?

Dudes would have to quit... nobody wants to get released.. and nobody wants to see these guys not get paid.
Same goes for the staff. They all know what they are doing.. and i would bet they all feel like shit while doing it.
I would even guess its getting frustrating in that building... knowing nothing stays true in a corporate structure...
The good Employees getting moved, split up, less freedom, having to explain "why", biting tongues, ect.

There truly is no justification.... there isn't. Its all justified by a temporary "at least they get paid" moment of time.. but we all know this trend isn't going to last forever.. it never does.. but when the "cycle" dips out of their favor.... its going to change and a lot of patient people are going to get shafted.

But your right... it might be too late..... there really isn't many places to go anymore. The whole infrastructure needs to be rebuilt. Its taken a beating... Not many places left.

[Casey Jones]

Fallen out of business, Dekline out of business. Someone should just make a company called "Decrease" and see how long that lasts.

[witty pseudonym]

Fuck the corporate shoes companies meddling in our shit. 

[the canadian suit]

We are our own enemy. The Skate Shop infrastructure has done this to themselves. We are so quick to shout "SELL OUT" whenever a pair of Huf's are spotted on a wal mart marketplace website, so quick to diss Lakai for having shoes in Ross Dress for Less, etc. Skate shops preach "Support skater owned! Support your local shop!" while they stock more Nikes and Cons than anything else. What am I supposed to pick? The new Suciu shoe or a Circa shoe that's been sitting on the wall for 3 years?

The whole system is fucked and we are made to feel guilty about it. It isn't our fault. Our money is not guaranteed to you just because you make shoes specifically for skateboarding. I do not have any allegiance to a shoe company.

Step up your video game, step up your shoe game, do something fucking different and capture the market. Convince your team not to quit for Nike money. Put on a guy with a questionable board sponsor. Put Bobby Worrest on when he just filmed an entire part at Pulaski only in your shoes.

[MeanestCleanestPenis]

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Why is this such a big deal to you guys? Reading this is a giant headache. I am honored Nike (biggest sports brand on earth) wants a part in skateboarding, won't buy em myself but still! �

Do whatever you want, so long as it's legal no-one is getting screwed.

[close]

But people are getting screwed �
Dudes just lost their jobs and sponsorships so what you said doesn't make sense.
Plus, shops are closing because of Nike. Which I know people will argue that shops are responsible too, but still there is a lot evidence that Nike interference correlates with shops closing.
The way I see it, no one should be honored that Nike is in skateboarding unless you're getting their paychecks. Even then you know the checks come with a grain of salt.

[close]

So it would be better if Nike shut down its skate program and fires it's 30 person skate team and large staff including some skating legends than fallen cut its 8 team members or whatever and presumably small staff? Not to mention the 100s on flow. I don't think fallen sponsors anyone in my area.

I don't like how people equate the demise of a crap company to the demise of skating. Surely this won't affect our want/will to skate

[close]

Yup... then divide up the 30+ PRO's on the squad... back into skate shoe companies. Now you have multiple brands on the shelves.. pushing multiple PRO shoes per brand. Way more people eating, way more doors opening, and a lot more glass ceilings breaking for pro skaters. How long is Ishods name going to be on that dunk, or Coreys name on his shoe? These guys going to have longevity within Nike? Multiple shoes? 10-15 different shoes through out the years? who's next, Luan, Shane, Theotis, Guy, Malto, Bobby, Alex..... who's next? Years are flying by... There is a bunch of people on that team that deserve a pro shoe. Not a color way, not "name on a shoe for a year"...
Some of these dudes need to be the icons of brands and products that carry their names for a long time. Instead they are sitting waiting patiently... false hope.

This is where most consumers are in the dark and you can probably enlighten us. What are the financial implications of riding for nike? Are these guys getting 3/4 times what they would get on Fallen or Emerica? Is the standard non-pro shoe deal on Nike better than having a decent selling pro shoe on DC in financial terms?

I don't doubt that in a few years nike may shaft a lot of their pros but what is it that attracts so many pros to nike at the moment? Is it solely money or are there other reasons too?

[MintySandwhich]

Skateboarding has gotten to a point where it's unbreakable. We all know this. The "core" skateboarders want to say it's the big corp's fault, and that its fickle cycle goes in waves of popularity. The close niche bubble has popped and it's no longer ours, unless we actually make an effort to change it. But it all boils down to quality... if they make better shoes, they are gonna be more successful. Capitalism is the name of the game, and if you can't get with the times, you're gonna fail. But the more positive side to this is that there is always a downfall in popularity, and Nike/others will bail quicker than anyone else.

Besides, it's fucking shoes... that's something everyone uses.. don't get mad over something like that.

If nike started making boards, then I would be pissed.

[Donkey Lips]

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Why is this such a big deal to you guys? Reading this is a giant headache. I am honored Nike (biggest sports brand on earth) wants a part in skateboarding, won't buy em myself but still! �

Do whatever you want, so long as it's legal no-one is getting screwed.

[close]

But people are getting screwed �
Dudes just lost their jobs and sponsorships so what you said doesn't make sense.
Plus, shops are closing because of Nike. Which I know people will argue that shops are responsible too, but still there is a lot evidence that Nike interference correlates with shops closing.
The way I see it, no one should be honored that Nike is in skateboarding unless you're getting their paychecks. Even then you know the checks come with a grain of salt.

[close]

So it would be better if Nike shut down its skate program and fires it's 30 person skate team and large staff including some skating legends than fallen cut its 8 team members or whatever and presumably small staff? Not to mention the 100s on flow. I don't think fallen sponsors anyone in my area.

I don't like how people equate the demise of a crap company to the demise of skating. Surely this won't affect our want/will to skate

[close]

Yup... then divide up the 30+ PRO's on the squad... back into skate shoe companies. Now you have multiple brands on the shelves.. pushing multiple PRO shoes per brand. Way more people eating, way more doors opening, and a lot more glass ceilings breaking for pro skaters. How long is Ishods name going to be on that dunk, or Coreys name on his shoe? These guys going to have longevity within Nike? Multiple shoes? 10-15 different shoes through out the years? who's next, Luan, Shane, Theotis, Guy, Malto, Bobby, Alex..... who's next? Years are flying by... There is a bunch of people on that team that deserve a pro shoe. Not a color way, not "name on a shoe for a year"...
Some of these dudes need to be the icons of brands and products that carry their names for a long time. Instead they are sitting waiting patiently... false hope.

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Playing devil's advocate here - so Nike releases it's 30 team pros, and they go back to "skate shoe companies"...how do these brands make room on the payroll for Koston, for Guy, for Corey, for Shane? What happens to the lesser knowns that are currently on these brands? Is DC going to find extra money just to take on more names? Or is DC going to make room by cutting riders with a less marketable name? It takes a ton of time to generate revenue off of a pro model shoe, out of an already over-saturated market, so please don't think they'll make the money up right away (if at all). What happens with all of the artificial sales from non-skateboarders when Nike pulls the plug?

Even releasing 10-15 of these big names back into the shoe market, would cause huge disruption for the rest of the team riders on the skate-owned brands. And what about the Nike riders that were encouraged to leave more established board brands for something more boutique? How do those guys offset the lack of the Nike check when they leave?

To address the Nike pro shoe dilemma, do you think maybe some of those guys just don't want their name on a shoe? Not like I know, but maybe Malto, Theotis and Shane are totally fine with just getting shoes, getting a steady payment, and skating without having to worry about whether or not their design/signature on a shoe performs. Maybe they aren't just sitting, waiting patiently, and that's a responsibility they don't care about.

This doesn't even touch the topic of staff, like Zurg mentioned. How many former Fallen, former Vans, former Lakai...etc. staff members have found employment with Nike? What happens if Nike pulls the plug? Is DC suddenly going to create new jobs for these designers, sales reps, and warehouse management?

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Dudes would have to quit... nobody wants to get released.. and nobody wants to see these guys not get paid.
Same goes for the staff. They all know what they are doing.. and i would bet they all feel like shit while doing it.
I would even guess its getting frustrating in that building... knowing nothing stays true in a corporate structure...
The good Employees getting moved, split up, less freedom, having to explain "why", biting tongues, ect.

There truly is no justification.... there isn't. Its all justified by a temporary "at least they get paid" moment of time.. but we all know this trend isn't going to last forever.. it never does.. but when the "cycle" dips out of their favor.... its going to change and a lot of patient people are going to get shafted.

But your right... it might be too late..... there really isn't many places to go anymore. The whole infrastructure needs to be rebuilt. Its taken a beating... Not many places left.

Even if all, or half of the pro's for Nike quit of their own terms - that's still a healthy amount of guys that are used to a certain income, a certain lifestyle, and we both know that the only way any team can afford it, would be sacrificing team riders to make room. Loyalty isn't a currency that any brand uses - skater-owned or not. What happens if Shane and Ishod start talking to DC about coming onboard, and DC doesn't have the money to keep everybody? Does MikeMo or Davis get a pay cut? Do they get cut altogether? Maybe they start looking at marketability, and in corporate speak, who "will lead them into the next era of growth"?

The trend isn't going to last forever. It's volatile, and there are dips and gains. And of course we all like the "Well, at least so and so is getting a check while they can" argument. It's growing into a potential problem because a lot of professionals, both in skateboarding and in the staff, have now built a dependency on Nike. And honestly, this is a problem for the industry, and for you, not us.

Whether or not Nike exists in skateboarding, it doesn't effect me, it doesn't effect any kid doing kickflips in their driveway. Skateboarding is the same for the majority of people. It only effects the people who get paid by skateboarding. Consumers aren't to blame with this. The professionals and industry icons that said "Hey we're OK with Nike!" are to blame. But again, those are the people that will get hung out to dry when and if Nike moves on, so it really doesn't effect any of us on here at all.