Slap MessageBoards
Skateboarding => Shoes & Gear => Topic started by: sbr on January 29, 2023, 07:35:01 AM
-
So I’ve seen mention of this in a few threads but no specific thread for it, so I figured I’d start one…
After decades of never once experiencing this, I’ve had about a year from hell with almost all wheel/bearing combinations I set up having the bearings creep around in the bearing seats to some extent. Sometimes making the spin suck, other times going crooked enough to fully bind up and have to be reseated (predominantly happening in my toe side front wheel, but has happened in others infrequently).
I’ve done multiple F4 99a cuts & sizes, Bones SPF 84b & 81b (happened worse to me in these), Speedlab 99a OJ og formula 99a and Elite 101a and have tried Bronson and Bones bearings with them (with and without tube spacers). The issue is far more consistent when running tube spacers, presumably because the core inconsistencies in the molds prevent the bearing from fully seating with them in (i.e. in a set of F4 56 classics, I had only 1 wheel able to fully seat bearings with the tube spacer. The other three you’d seat one side fully, flip it around to press the other bearing and spacer on and feel the already installed bearing push out of the seat). Also tried cleaning the seats and outsides of the races with isopropyl alcohol, which slowed the issue from happening, but it still happened.
If anyone has had this happen and found a solution, I’d love to hear it. If you’re also experiencing this with no fix, maybe we can complain to one another about how awful mfg quality is now and reminisce of the days where it was damn near impossible to pry bearings out of wheels…
-
.
I believe the best solution to wheels that have constant issues with bearing seating is getting the bearings (of any brand) that have the extended inner spacer part, like Race Reds.
People who have had wheel issues, including myself, have tried these and they work.
Sure most people associate them with longboarders or downhill speedsters, but you can still get affordable decent bearings that have the extra inner spacer, without having to spend huge amounts on super fancy ones and because everything lines up and is seated very solidly, I didn't have any other problems with the wheels having issues like I did before.
The Bones Race Reds bearings are probably the easiest to use as show and tell because they are not that expensive and usually available in a lot more places than some of the other extended race bearings.
You can tighten them right down or leave them with play, as I did because I am not fond of the dead sound and they still worked perfectly well without issues as per one or two wheels constantly having the bearings move in them and lock up with any normal skating that puts pressure on the wheel in a certain way.
Link for more info, etc.
https://bonesbearings.com/bones-reg-race-reds-reg-skateboard-bearings-8-pack
Specifically this image, even though it is not a conventional board, it still shows it all better than any other pic or diagram can.
(https://d27hrylgrpd01o.cloudfront.net/assets/bonesbearings/productimage/size/1500x1388/method/strict/v/f159/BSACRS88-A3.jpg)
-
Im dealing with it rn but it only is a real problem after both wheels get around the curb and I get stuck. 5.8 is almost exactly the same size as the local TV and Peace curbs.
I ride spacers with just a click of wiggle. You can hear it but you can't see the wheel move.
I'm sure once dirt gets between there it's tight. I ride extra washers on the outside of my wheels.
I think this might be a bad move. Might self loosen. There's considerable wear between the two washers and no extra threads showing. I could flip the nuts but I'll have to use new nuts next time I remove the wheels.
1 backwards threading = like 4 regular threading and if you don't do it perfectly it's super glue time.
So when I noticed they was unseated I loosened my nuts put the board on flat ground and stomped on the truck bolts to reseat the bearings. I learned that from my homies who long board. Works almost every time with a soft wheel. It'll get you though the session
Rn I'm pulling everything apart and I'm going to swing the extra washers to the truck side and use different spacers. The ones that came with my Swiss Bearings is able to rattle between my bearings in my front two wheels. Probably because that's the trick that bites the curb.
If the Rat Bone 2 was a few mm wider I'm sure it would not grab the curb. The 56mm dF is wider I think. This wouldn't be an issue.
Dragons appear to have slightly less core material between the the seats. Idk if this makes it easier to twist and unseat.
It's all good tho after I stomp that and stay away from front 50s.
-
.
I believe the best solution to wheels that have constant issues with bearing seating is getting the bearings (of any brand) that have the extended inner spacer part, like Race Reds.
People who have had wheel issues, including myself, have tried these and they work.
Sure most people associate them with longboarders or downhill speedsters, but you can still get affordable decent bearings that have the extra inner spacer, without having to spend huge amounts on super fancy ones and because everything lines up and is seated very solidly, I didn't have any other problems with the wheels having issues like I did before.
The Bones Race Reds bearings are probably the easiest to use as show and tell because they are not that expensive and usually available in a lot more places than some of the other extended race bearings.
You can tighten them right down or leave them with play, as I did because I am not fond of the dead sound and they still worked perfectly well without issues as per one or two wheels constantly having the bearings move in them and lock up with any normal skating that puts pressure on the wheel in a certain way.
Link for more info, etc.
https://bonesbearings.com/bones-reg-race-reds-reg-skateboard-bearings-8-pack
Specifically this image, even though it is not a conventional board, it still shows it all better than any other pic or diagram can.
(https://d27hrylgrpd01o.cloudfront.net/assets/bonesbearings/productimage/size/1500x1388/method/strict/v/f159/BSACRS88-A3.jpg)
Interesting... In theory, even in the case of the bearing not fully seating in the wheel, the extended inner race should keep the bearing sitting straight and avoid the wheel binding up fully (since it can't really go crooked in the seat)... This may be on the "to try" list now
-
Im dealing with it rn but it only is a real problem after both wheels get around the curb and I get stuck. 5.8 is almost exactly the same size as the local TV and Peace curbs.
I ride spacers with just a click of wiggle. You can hear it but you can't see the wheel move.
I'm sure once dirt gets between there it's tight. I ride extra washers on the outside of my wheels.
I think this might be a bad move. Might self loosen. There's considerable wear between the two washers and no extra threads showing. I could flip the nuts but I'll have to use new nuts next time I remove the wheels.
1 backwards threading = like 4 regular threading and if you don't do it perfectly it's super glue time.
So when I noticed they was unseated I loosened my nuts put the board on flat ground and stomped on the truck bolts to reseat the bearings. I learned that from my homies who long board. Works almost every time with a soft wheel. It'll get you though the session
Rn I'm pulling everything apart and I'm going to swing the extra washers to the truck side and use different spacers. The ones that came with my Swiss Bearings is able to rattle between my bearings in my front two wheels. Probably because that's the trick that bites the curb.
If the Rat Bone 2 was a few mm wider I'm sure it would not grab the curb. The 56mm dF is wider I think. This wouldn't be an issue.
Dragons appear to have slightly less core material between the the seats. Idk if this makes it easier to twist and unseat.
It's all good tho after I stomp that and stay away from front 50s.
I've been using the shoe pressure to re-seat trick as long as this has been happening (normally a quick fix because it's almost always the outer facing bearing on the toe side front wheel), but this gets old quick after it happens a few times during a session. The bizarre issue is I was having the opposite issue with center spacers where rather than rattling around in the center of the wheel, it was just long enough to pop one of 2 bearings out a tiny bit from being fully seated against the core of the wheel when putting the other bearing in. This is a totally new issue for me and I got my hands on a set of NOS OJ's from when they were still made in the US so I'm going to see if that makes any bit of difference. If it's still happening, I think Mbrimson88's suggestion of extended race bearings is next to try.
-
Didn’t have it with Bones 100s and Lil Smokies but have it with SF 52 Classics and it sucks. Changing bearings is not an option as I just shelled out major bucks for Quantum Fusions. Unnerving that in this day and age we are even faced with such issues. *old dude rant over*
-
Never had this happen but could see it happening. To me, longboard type bearings would be a band-aid fix. The real solution would be a set of wheels that are made to tighter tolerances.
The only wheels I've found that didn't have obvious runout and inaccurate bearing seats are wheels made by Creative Urethane (an OEM some brands use) that also had hard cores or some kind of dual duro construction. Also the only wheels where I could use high quality steel spacers and tighten down the wheel all the way without affecting spin.
BITD no one I knew used spacers because none of the bearings most skaters could afford came with them. If the wheels are poured inaccurately, it's probably best to ditch the spacers because they might cause a problem. I wouldn't use fancy bearings in those types of wheels either.
As for quality being better BITD, sometimes it was, sometimes it wasn't. Every brand of trucks seemed to get axle slip back in the 90s at one point and we were constantly banging our axles on the concrete while skating. Sometimes boards would suck also and lose pop (e.g. become "soggy") in less than 2 weeks. There was no consistency with certain board brands either back then.
-
Didn’t have it with Bones 100s and Lil Smokies but have it with SF 52 Classics and it sucks. Changing bearings is not an option as I just shelled out major bucks for Quantum Fusions. Unnerving that in this day and age we are even faced with such issues. *old dude rant over*
So far I've tried (with and without tube spacers) Bones Swiss, Swiss Ceramics, Bronson Ceramics, Quantum Fusions, and now Bronson Raws (wanted to see if a coated outer race would grip any better in the bearing seat than a polished outer race) and it happened with all of them so I can't isolate it to being specifically bearing related. The suggestion to try Race Reds, however, is making a whole lot of sense to me since the races are extended on both sides of the bearing and this makes me feel like the bearings would not be able to go crooked enough to bind even if they do move a bit in the seat. Doesn't sound like a bad use of $30 if the new wheels I'm throwing on still have the issue.
-
Sounds to me like your axel(s) might be bent.
From my experiences this is usually what makes bearings back out of their seat this way.
Not to say there isnt any other possible reason for this, as my bearings have done this on straight axels once in a blue moon.
But whenever it has KEPT happening consistently/frequently, a bent axel was the culprit.
-
Sounds to me like your axel(s) might be bent.
From my experiences this is usually what makes bearings back out of their seat this way.
Not to say there isnt any other possible reason for this, as my bearings have done this on straight axels once in a blue moon.
But whenever it has KEPT happening consistently/frequently, a bent axel was the culprit.
This was one of my first theories, but I've had it happen on two sets of Indys, a set of Thunders, and Ace AF1's. I'm also just under 140lbs and pretty much only skate transition so I'm not taking on enough impact to bend my axles. The only thing that I can see causing it on my end is how I lock into grinds since I push all the way up against the wheel, but at the same time, I can't see that causing any more lateral impact than someone who does a ton of slappies.
-
Never had this happen but could see it happening. To me, longboard type bearings would be a band-aid fix. The real solution would be a set of wheels that are made to tighter tolerances.
The only wheels I've found that didn't have obvious runout and inaccurate bearing seats are wheels made by Creative Urethane (an OEM some brands use) that also had hard cores or some kind of dual duro construction. Also the only wheels where I could use high quality steel spacers and tighten down the wheel all the way without affecting spin.
BITD no one I knew used spacers because none of the bearings most skaters could afford came with them. If the wheels are poured inaccurately, it's probably best to ditch the spacers because they might cause a problem. I wouldn't use fancy bearings in those types of wheels either.
As for quality being better BITD, sometimes it was, sometimes it wasn't. Every brand of trucks seemed to get axle slip back in the 90s at one point and we were constantly banging our axles on the concrete while skating. Sometimes boards would suck also and lose pop (e.g. become "soggy") in less than 2 weeks. There was no consistency with certain board brands either back then.
I 100% feel you on the BITD issues of axle slip and inconsistent board quality, but I'm not talking that far back. It's been less than 10 years since OJ's last made wheels in the US and I'm pretty sure that is the same deal for Spitfire. This is an issue I've never experienced in decades of being on a board and all of a sudden it started consistently happening right about the time we started seeing mfg shortages due to the pandemic. Also, oddly enough... the last set of F4's I got were much more white than the normal beige color so I'm not sure if the formula changed any or if they switched factories or something.
If we're going way BITD... I remember going to remove a set of bearings from a well-worn set of Spitfire classics and having the bearing explode because the outer race cold welded itself to the wheel lol
-
Expand Quote
Sounds to me like your axel(s) might be bent.
From my experiences this is usually what makes bearings back out of their seat this way.
Not to say there isnt any other possible reason for this, as my bearings have done this on straight axels once in a blue moon.
But whenever it has KEPT happening consistently/frequently, a bent axel was the culprit.
This was one of my first theories, but I've had it happen on two sets of Indys, a set of Thunders, and Ace AF1's. I'm also just under 140lbs and pretty much only skate transition so I'm not taking on enough impact to bend my axles. The only thing that I can see causing it on my end is how I lock into grinds since I push all the way up against the wheel, but at the same time, I can't see that causing any more lateral impact than someone who does a ton of slappies.
Ah, my bad, I skimmed the thread and didnt see that mentioned.
Wouldn't locking into grinds exert forces that would push the bearings inward towards the seat?
-
Happens to me when I do a lot of slappies. My guess, for at least my issue, is the way I slam into the curbs causing some crazy torque and the bearings slide out. Usually tighten the bearings back into place and it doesn't happen again for a while. I too thought it was a particular set of wheels but it's happened over a few different shapes and duro's
-
I 100% feel you on the BITD issues of axle slip and inconsistent board quality, but I'm not talking that far back. It's been less than 10 years since OJ's last made wheels in the US and I'm pretty sure that is the same deal for Spitfire. This is an issue I've never experienced in decades of being on a board and all of a sudden it started consistently happening right about the time we started seeing mfg shortages due to the pandemic. Also, oddly enough... the last set of F4's I got were much more white than the normal beige color so I'm not sure if the formula changed any or if they switched factories or something.
If we're going way BITD... I remember going to remove a set of bearings from a well-worn set of Spitfire classics and having the bearing explode because the outer race cold welded itself to the wheel lol
The USA made Spitfires I last bought (over 10 years ago) were horrible quality in terms of runout and bearing seat accuracy. Urethane was okay. I don't know where they are making them now, but wouldn't be buying another set anyway.
Didn't care about wheel accuracy BITD, nor did anyone I know care that much about flat spotting or chipping which was common. Nowadays if I am paying $40+ for a set of wheels they should be made properly.
Re: manufacturing QC during the pandemic, a lot of industries were impacted. I've seen bad quality from all sorts of things. No qualms about returning stuff either. Might be hard to return a set of wheels though.
-
Expand Quote
Sounds to me like your axel(s) might be bent.
From my experiences this is usually what makes bearings back out of their seat this way.
Not to say there isnt any other possible reason for this, as my bearings have done this on straight axels once in a blue moon.
But whenever it has KEPT happening consistently/frequently, a bent axel was the culprit.
This was one of my first theories, but I've had it happen on two sets of Indys, a set of Thunders, and Ace AF1's. I'm also just under 140lbs and pretty much only skate transition so I'm not taking on enough impact to bend my axles. The only thing that I can see causing it on my end is how I lock into grinds since I push all the way up against the wheel, but at the same time, I can't see that causing any more lateral impact than someone who does a ton of slappies.
It should be easy enough to check for bent axles if you take the wheel off and square up an accurate ruler or level or something. It should be obvious that way. I would be shocked if you are bending axles at 140lbs though.
-
Ah, my bad, I skimmed the thread and didnt see that mentioned.
Wouldn't locking into grinds exert forces that would push the bearings inward towards the seat?
Expand Quote
Expand Quote
Sounds to me like your axel(s) might be bent.
From my experiences this is usually what makes bearings back out of their seat this way.
Not to say there isnt any other possible reason for this, as my bearings have done this on straight axels once in a blue moon.
But whenever it has KEPT happening consistently/frequently, a bent axel was the culprit.
This was one of my first theories, but I've had it happen on two sets of Indys, a set of Thunders, and Ace AF1's. I'm also just under 140lbs and pretty much only skate transition so I'm not taking on enough impact to bend my axles. The only thing that I can see causing it on my end is how I lock into grinds since I push all the way up against the wheel, but at the same time, I can't see that causing any more lateral impact than someone who does a ton of slappies.
Ah, my bad, I skimmed the thread and didnt see that mentioned.
Wouldn't locking into grinds exert forces that would push the bearings inward towards the seat?
Most times yes, but the biggest cause of the wheel binding up is if my front toe side wheel touches the deck during feebles / feeble fakies. I also had it happen when I bailed a few slide & rolls on Saturday from the board knocking the wheel on the way into the bowl.
Also, going back to the mfg inconsistencies mentioned previously, here is the 58 F4 Classics I have on my board and the 56 F4 Classics my son has on his board. This is the first time I've had a set of F4's look white and not tan/beige (it's way more apparent in natural light). Maybe a change in formula or shopping factories around has changed how strict they are on QC or what they consider acceptable mfg tolerances?
My skating has not changed much at all over the past decade, and with the issue happening over the past 1-2 years I feel like something had to have changed that is mfg related to amplify this. Stoked I'm not the only one that it's happening to because it makes me feel like less of a head case hahaha
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52658010922_be6236670f.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/2oed553)
-
I've got a couch or loveseat crail board with a set of zealous ceramics and mIndys. Sounds dead as hell but rides fast and everything is flush with one washer.
-
I may be wrong about this but, FWIW, I believe the F4s are still poured right here in SF.
Can somebody w/ the inside scoop fill me in on what’s doing over at Pointech, if those aren’t F4s I see them making in there whenever I stroll on by on lunch break?
‘Cause they seem to be busy doing SOMETHING in there.
-
A lot of the F4s coming through the shop lately say “Made in Mexico” on the tiny barcode sticker.
-
Every set of F4s I have had in the last few years has been made in Mexico. And every set has been great.
-
Expand Quote
Im dealing with it rn but it only is a real problem after both wheels get around the curb and I get stuck. 5.8 is almost exactly the same size as the local TV and Peace curbs.
I ride spacers with just a click of wiggle. You can hear it but you can't see the wheel move.
I'm sure once dirt gets between there it's tight. I ride extra washers on the outside of my wheels.
I think this might be a bad move. Might self loosen. There's considerable wear between the two washers and no extra threads showing. I could flip the nuts but I'll have to use new nuts next time I remove the wheels.
1 backwards threading = like 4 regular threading and if you don't do it perfectly it's super glue time.
So when I noticed they was unseated I loosened my nuts put the board on flat ground and stomped on the truck bolts to reseat the bearings. I learned that from my homies who long board. Works almost every time with a soft wheel. It'll get you though the session
Rn I'm pulling everything apart and I'm going to swing the extra washers to the truck side and use different spacers. The ones that came with my Swiss Bearings is able to rattle between my bearings in my front two wheels. Probably because that's the trick that bites the curb.
If the Rat Bone 2 was a few mm wider I'm sure it would not grab the curb. The 56mm dF is wider I think. This wouldn't be an issue.
Dragons appear to have slightly less core material between the the seats. Idk if this makes it easier to twist and unseat.
It's all good tho after I stomp that and stay away from front 50s.
I've been using the shoe pressure to re-seat trick as long as this has been happening (normally a quick fix because it's almost always the outer facing bearing on the toe side front wheel), but this gets old quick after it happens a few times during a session. The bizarre issue is I was having the opposite issue with center spacers where rather than rattling around in the center of the wheel, it was just long enough to pop one of 2 bearings out a tiny bit from being fully seated against the core of the wheel when putting the other bearing in. This is a totally new issue for me and I got my hands on a set of NOS OJ's from when they were still made in the US so I'm going to see if that makes any bit of difference. If it's still happening, I think Mbrimson88's suggestion of extended race bearings is next to try.
"Racing" bearings maybe not these Bones ones have one ball less in the race. This reduces friction but also reduces strength.
Next bearings I cop are going to be quantum ceramics. Promised them I would when they first started I would cop when my last set of bones are done. The white shields have melted several have broken off. I got those ones in 2016.
-
@Mbrimson88 when you install those race reds, do you not have the issue that sbr mentioned of having the first-installed bearing push out a bit when you install the second one? (i.e., do the lengths of the two built-in inside race spacers added together equal a shorter total length than the length of a regular spacer?)
(The few times I have tried spacers, I have usually had that issue where the first bearing installed gets pushed out a bit when I install the second, so I gave up on spacers.)
-
@Mbrimson88 when you install those race reds, do you not have the issue that sbr mentioned of having the first-installed bearing push out a bit when you install the second one? (i.e., do the lengths of the two built-in inside race spacers added together equal a shorter total length than the length of a regular spacer?)
(The few times I have tried spacers, I have usually had that issue where the first bearing installed gets pushed out a bit when I install the second, so I gave up on spacers.)
The Race Reds I ordered came in today and this happened. I went out and skated my quarter for a bit and these moved in the seats more than anything I've tried thus far.
I'm back to running my Bronson Ceramics without the tube spacer so the bearings fully seat in the wheel and hopefully the issue stays to a minimum.
-
Dang, I feel bad for this poor homey. Any/all combos of bearing & wheel, spacers or otherwise (you HAVE tried running NO spacers, riiiiiight?!?) yield the same results.
I’m no Shredlock Holmes over here, but I’m gonna guess that, while a very real issue, the fact that it re-occurs for you, regardless of wheels/bearings used, speaks to a need to adjust your current technique, as NO gear can presently withstand your considerable gnar.
You’re gonna have to talk to silhouette for tips on technique though, on account of I have only ever experienced this ish with soft-ass cruiser wheels & have no advice to impart as a result.
Good luck on your quest, brave knight.
-
Expand Quote
@Mbrimson88 when you install those race reds, do you not have the issue that sbr mentioned of having the first-installed bearing push out a bit when you install the second one? (i.e., do the lengths of the two built-in inside race spacers added together equal a shorter total length than the length of a regular spacer?)
(The few times I have tried spacers, I have usually had that issue where the first bearing installed gets pushed out a bit when I install the second, so I gave up on spacers.)
The Race Reds I ordered came in today and this happened. I went out and skated my quarter for a bit and these moved in the seats more than anything I've tried thus far.
I'm back to running my Bronson Ceramics without the tube spacer so the bearings fully seat in the wheel and hopefully the issue stays to a minimum.
Wow.
That is so weird.
I would say definitely the wheels, but without seeing them in person, or checking things I would not know.
As to the extended bearings, I dug out a board with them on and tried a few different sets of wheels on them last night at the indoor park and on a couple of sets, they pushed each other a touch, but on the wheels I had the issues with originally, they sat fairly well.
All the wheels still skated fine, no issues, no movement and the bearings still spun well, even on hard sideways push tricks and they were the wheels that the normal bearings had issues in previously.
The wheels that had issues I did have the nut tightened down with no play, but on all the other wheels, I left a bit as I usually would.
So I am curious:
- which wheels are you running?
- how hard or easy was it to push the bearings into the wheels? I usually just put two bearings face up on a truck axle and push them on like that.
- was it only on certain tricks, certain wheel or all wheels?
- did you have some play, or tighten them down so there was no play?
-
So I’ve seen mention of this in a few threads but no specific thread for it, so I figured I’d start one…
After decades of never once experiencing this, I’ve had about a year from hell with almost all wheel/bearing combinations I set up having the bearings creep around in the bearing seats to some extent. Sometimes making the spin suck, other times going crooked enough to fully bind up and have to be reseated (predominantly happening in my toe side front wheel, but has happened in others infrequently).
I’ve done multiple F4 99a cuts & sizes, Bones SPF 84b & 81b (happened worse to me in these), Speedlab 99a OJ og formula 99a and Elite 101a and have tried Bronson and Bones bearings with them (with and without tube spacers). The issue is far more consistent when running tube spacers, presumably because the core inconsistencies in the molds prevent the bearing from fully seating with them in (i.e. in a set of F4 56 classics, I had only 1 wheel able to fully seat bearings with the tube spacer. The other three you’d seat one side fully, flip it around to press the other bearing and spacer on and feel the already installed bearing push out of the seat). Also tried cleaning the seats and outsides of the races with isopropyl alcohol, which slowed the issue from happening, but it still happened.
If anyone has had this happen and found a solution, I’d love to hear it. If you’re also experiencing this with no fix, maybe we can complain to one another about how awful mfg quality is now and reminisce of the days where it was damn near impossible to pry bearings out of wheels…
Most times yes, but the biggest cause of the wheel binding up is if my front toe side wheel touches the deck during feebles / feeble fakies. I also had it happen when I bailed a few slide & rolls on Saturday from the board knocking the wheel on the way into the bowl.
Also, going back to the mfg inconsistencies mentioned previously, here is the 58 F4 Classics I have on my board and the 56 F4 Classics my son has on his board. This is the first time I've had a set of F4's look white and not tan/beige (it's way more apparent in natural light). Maybe a change in formula or shopping factories around has changed how strict they are on QC or what they consider acceptable mfg tolerances?
My skating has not changed much at all over the past decade, and with the issue happening over the past 1-2 years I feel like something had to have changed that is mfg related to amplify this. Stoked I'm not the only one that it's happening to because it makes me feel like less of a head case hahaha
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52658010922_be6236670f.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/2oed553)
Also just checking if you skate the other board from that pic does the same thing happen?
Wondering if truck, wheel, bearing combo or something else, but as per your list of wheels tried here, that is pretty much all brands worth a mention in the wheel category, but swapping in or out one thing at a time, or if whatever you are doing does or doesn't happen on the other board may be a start.
The board your son has compared to your board, as well as when did you get the current trucks you are riding and did it start before or after you had those too?
It might be a stretch to make him skate your wheels and bearings on his board, but it would be interesting to try those on a different set of trucks and see if something changed there too.
Stranger things have happened, but I wouldn't be tossing the Race Reds quite so soon as you did the Swiss or those wheels, as per your sale thread.
* For what it is worth, I picked up a set of the Classic 58mm Formula Four wheels and they were a lighter colour than the others I have, but I just put that down to a newer batch and they skate fine on two boards I have set up, as well as for the person who I traded them with - they just wanted wider wheels.
-
1] Which wheels are you running?: Currently, OJ Elite Hardline 99a 56's with Bronson Ceramics (no center spacers). When I put the bearings in I had that "pop one in, go to put the other on with a spacer and the already seated bearing pops out" issue so I ditched the spacers to let the bearings fully seat to the core of the wheel.
But the issue has happened with:
- Spitfire F4 Classic 99a 58's
- Spitfire F4 Classic 99a 56's
- Spitfire F4 Classic 99a 55's
- Spitfire F4 Conical Full 99a 58's
- Spitfire F4 Conical Full 99a 54's
- Bones SPF 84b 58's
- Bones SPF 81b 58's
- Speedlab Slappy Hour 99a 58's
- OJ Original Formula Hardline 99a 55's
- OJ Original Formula Mini Combo 99a 56's
- Bones Swiss
- Bones Swiss Ceramics
- Bronson Raws
- Bronson Ceramics
So I can tell you for sure it's not isolated to a specific brand (It's me, hi... I'm the problem, it's me...)
2] How hard or easy was it to push the bearings into the wheels?: Not any more or less difficult than it's ever been, aside from the Bones SPF's which sucked to press bearings into. I've put them on as I always have - bearing on the truck, press it in, 2nd bearing down with tube spacer facing up, and press that one in. I also used a bearing press to try and get proper alignment, but it made absolutely no difference.
3] Was it only on certain tricks, certain wheel, or all wheels?: The issue mostly manifests itself on the front toe side wheel when doing feebles on transition (when the wheel hits the deck on an angle) in all of the wheels. In the Hardline 55's I did have it happen slightly in one of my rear wheels, but it didn't go crooked enough to bind the wheel up (the slight slack in the wheel just disappeared).
4] Did you have some play, or tighten them down so there was no play?: I've never run 0 play in a wheel aside from testing the Race Reds which I tried with slight play and no play. The rest have had slight wiggle room but not a whole lot of slop (with and without tube spacers)
5] Also just checking if you skate the other board from that pic does the same thing happen?: It's a 7.75" mini shape so the leverage point is different, but the issue has happened on my sons board when he skate it (surprise, with feebles) but after I took the tube spacers out of his wheels (Thunders / Bones Swiss / Spitfire F4 Classic 99A 56) which allowed the bearings to fully seat in the wheels and the issue has pretty much gone away for him.
6] Wondering if truck, wheel, bearing combo or something else, but as per your list of wheels tried here, that is pretty much all brands worth a mention in the wheel category, but swapping in or out one thing at a time, or if whatever you are doing does or doesn't happen on the other board may be a start: So this has happened on Aces, Thunders and Indys... BUT I have only tried the no spacer setup on Aces thus far...
7] The board your son has compared to your board, as well as when did you get the current trucks you are riding and did it start before or after you had those too?: It's been a consistent issue across pretty much everything I've had over the past 1 1/2 - 2 years
8] It might be a stretch to make him skate your wheels and bearings on his board, but it would be interesting to try those on a different set of trucks and see if something changed there too: Since the issue has happened for him as well, I don't think swapping wheels will change the result. I'm going to be setting up Stage 4's soon and I'm hoping those with no spacer will make some kind of difference.
The one curious thing I noticed when throwing the Elites on was the AF1's have more threads than the Thunders do and the threads appear to be a slightly smaller outer diameter than the axle itself. Even if you ditch the tube spacer and speed washers you're not getting the center race of the bearing to have enough contact on the axle itself to prevent it from having a free wobble, which I assume is contributing to the issue (impact on the wheel from it hitting pushes unevenly on the center race and causes the outer bearing to go crooked). This is something I didn't even have register to me as potentially being part of the issue, so we'll see once I get the Stage 4's if it makes any bit of difference.
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52664897677_d3273beffa.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/2oePngc)
-
The one curious thing I noticed when throwing the Elites on was the AF1's have more threads than the Thunders do and the threads appear to be a slightly smaller outer diameter than the axle itself. Even if you ditch the tube spacer and speed washers you're not getting the center race of the bearing to have enough contact on the axle itself to prevent it from having a free wobble, which I assume is contributing to the issue (impact on the wheel from it hitting pushes unevenly on the center race and causes the outer bearing to go crooked). This is something I didn't even have register to me as potentially being part of the issue, so we'll see once I get the Stage 4's if it makes any bit of difference.
Thanks for the detailed info - it sure is one of those funny ones, to happen to so many setup options, but as you came to the conclusion in the last paragraph, I am wondering if Ace "quality control" had something to do with it, not wholely the issue, but at least contributing to it in some way.
That was the thought I had earlier, but I didn't want to say it straight away, as well as not having your setup to look at or skate, so I didn't know all the facts and was limited by my own experiences and what I read for this one.
I used to push one back wheel out on a set in question on smith grinds on ramps, due to the angle and the pressure, so if I didn't do that trick, I would have fewer issues, but every run I would have to pop the wheel back on to the bearing correctly, if a smith was done in the run. Not being about to stop doing smith grinds, so I tried the same as race reds (different brand) and it stopped the issue, but my board did have a little of the "dead" sound from having that one axle nut tightened down, but I left all the others with some play.
When I switched out those wheels, I didn't have the same issue, but that was my experience there. I since put those same bearings in cruiser wheels that are softer with no core, and they have stopped the same thing happening when I use that board, hard sharp curvy turns would usually result in the bearings moving in the wheels, which now hold fast, again with all four tightened right down, but I am not worried if there is a little lateral movement as everything stays where it should be and the bearings spin freely.
I know that doesn't help this situation, but that is in detail pretty much my own experience with similar things. Others I have known to have wheels with bearing seats widening out, so the bearings pretty much fall out of the wheels usually result in those guys just stop skating those wheels, or have tried various bearings until something fits, even to the point of putting something in the wheel to try to gap up the difference, but I think that is not a good solution.
Wheels being urethane will bend and stretch even more, or reshape / misshape easily.
Also to mention here, there had been issues with some Spitfire wheels where their core was not made correctly, so one bearing might not seat fully, but the wheels I saw that had this issue were few and far between and I could not get bearings into the one wheel in question to full get it on the truck normally, so this is almost completely ruled out, even though I could see mention of quality control issues for some things like this being brought up.
The list of the big wheel brands all having the issue made me think of other factors, trucks maybe, or whatever, but any which way it sure is annoying to have that happen.
Not to ask too much, but is it possible to set up or have filmed a feeble or trick in question that you think is causing the issue? I don't care how good, how big, how well done it is - just want to see it, more because I am so curious, but also this sort of thing is very interesting to me in terms of knowing what and all that.
-
.
I also meant to ask earlier, where are you in the world, a hot climate, or average?
Do you do anything to the wheels, drop lube in them before putting in bearings or anything else too?
One guy who used to always put a dab of grease round the inside of each wheel would have way more issues with the bearings slipping out, compared to others who just jammed them in there, but realistically the bearings should have a little coating to get new bearings into new wheels, only needing a tiny bit of lube or something if bearings just don't go in easily.
-
I’ve commented on this issue in other threads. This has been happening to me for years even after replacing wheels, bearings, and trucks. I’ve noticed it happens more frequently when it’s hotter outside or when I’m hauling ass (skating bowls). It happens a lot less when it’s cold out or if I skate mini ramp (skating a lot slower). When skating bowls, it happens every run. On mini ramp it will happen once or twice in an hour long session.
Removing spacers helps reduce the occurrence, but it still happens. Wheels with cores also help a lot too. Too bad I prefer Spitfires and have convinced myself that I need to use spacers because they came with the bearings.
-
Bringing this back from the dead to see if anyone else has had any issues. Been having this happen with pretty much all trucks and wheels I've tried over the past few months and have been gradually downsizing my wheels to see if that makes any bit of difference... I've been trying to shake the madness, but having my wheel lock up multiple times per session is a headache I wish I didn't have to deal with...
-
Bringing this back from the dead to see if anyone else has had any issues. Been having this happen with pretty much all trucks and wheels I've tried over the past few months and have been gradually downsizing my wheels to see if that makes any bit of difference... I've been trying to shake the madness, but having my wheel lock up multiple times per session is a headache I wish I didn't have to deal with...
So you got it on the Indy and Thunders as well?
Only on feeble tricks or on other tricks too?
I know you have had setup upgrades, so curious if you noticed much or any difference between truck brands, along with all the info as per previous posts in this thread re wheels and bearings.
-
So you got it on the Indy and Thunders as well?
Only on feeble tricks or on other tricks too?
I know you have had setup upgrades, so curious if you noticed much or any difference between truck brands, along with all the info as per previous posts in this thread re wheels and bearings.
Shot you a DM on IG as well, but long story short it has happened with multiple different trucks, bearings & wheels. The issue predominantly presents itself with feebles, but yesterday my son and I both had it happen while skating flat at the tennis court across the street from us (we're both on Thunder Teams, Swiss & F4 Classic 54's).
-
That’s awesome….I run race reds out of principle so I’m worse than you…..
Even running what I consider the ‘perfect’ set up….bearings still slip out of the cage/seize/break….
I equate it to constantly tightening my axel nuts because I can….and…koo…koo…
I still stand by a lot of what we do in skating is so far beyond what the bearing was designed for.
I also think just buying reds or some other cheap bearing all the time is not a bad program either…. You don’t get your hands as dirty….just keep some spares….buy new axel nuts so your ready to go when it happens mid session…
-
I had it in the beginning on my two sets of Spit Classics 52 mm, with different bearings but it has now almost disappeared. Maybe they are just broken in, but I also made progress on my heelflips resulting in less primo landings. Might have some kind of relation, who knows?
-
Expand Quote
So you got it on the Indy and Thunders as well?
Only on feeble tricks or on other tricks too?
I know you have had setup upgrades, so curious if you noticed much or any difference between truck brands, along with all the info as per previous posts in this thread re wheels and bearings.
Shot you a DM on IG as well, but long story short it has happened with multiple different trucks, bearings & wheels. The issue predominantly presents itself with feebles, but yesterday my son and I both had it happen while skating flat at the tennis court across the street from us (we're both on Thunder Teams, Swiss & F4 Classic 54's).
Yeah (Wow!) so crazy to hear.
Any specific position of wheel on the setup, and do you skate the board either end doing pop shuvs or other tricks or only really skate them the one way, so say it is always the front toe that is jamming more or like that?
It is intriguing and horrifying at the same time, especially as my usual go to fix (using Race Reds tightened down so no other movement besides bearings spinning) didn't seem to work for you either.
Had another set of wheels, slightly softer cruiser sort the bearings would not stay in if you held up the wheel, that were doing that and again the extended bearing races tightened right down fixed the issue on that board and it skated fine after that, for doing lots of things where the skater was pushing the wheels this way and that, slides, grinds on ledges, etc.
-
Happens to me on every set of softer durometer wheels now, and it's 100% from slappies and how aggressive I smash into them, it's just how I do it. Others can be more graceful and still do a proper slappy, I've noticed. Bones dragons 93a in 52mm and 60mm, both sizes and shapes the bearings pop out of the seat super easy. I can't skate that wheel now and it sucks cause I actually really liked them. Happens on 95a Dogtown wheels (Creative Urethane) and 95a-97a OJs. I tried cored softer wheels for the first time to alleviate this issue per a pal's recommendation and it worked, but I hated the way they felt and performed. Now I'm just digging through my old bag of used wheels lately since weather has finally been nice to skate outdoor again, and my old 52mm NFG's and Spitfire f4 99a's are doing fine with no bearing slippage. Harder formula locks em in there good. Bearing spacers never worked for me, either.
-
I took my spacers out a few weeks ago and this has been happening a lot less. This is on my main setup with 99a F4s.
I’ve also noticed it never happens on my other setup with 95a OJs. I used to ride Bones DTF which were also 95a and never once had the bearings back out in all the years I rode them. I noticed it happening all the time when I switched to harder wheels.
-
Adding my pointless opinion because I am sick and tired of this happening and I want to comment every time this issue gets raised in hopes that the people who make wheels notice the complaints and act upon. I have been having this issue on and off (most sets, really) since around 2008. Not taking old, tiny wheels (early 90's) into account where the bearings would straight up fall out of the wheels after a few months of use. The issue became a real problem around 2012 skating bones wheels and this was the reason I switched to F4s. However, even on most sets of F4s the bearings tend to slide out of their seats, making the truck feel like the axle has slipped with one wheel tightening. It has been strangely happening mostly when I skate flatground, and especially when I bail a trick and the board goes bouncing all over the place. I am sure that what causes the problem is a combination of me skating super sticky ground (like a super sandy/weathered concrete park) and the wheels being kinda slack from the get go. I remember with wheels back in the day that it was almost impossible to remove the bearings and no one ever had issues with the bearings sliding out of their seats. Wheel manufacturers should just make the bearing seats a little tighter (0.5 mm ?). Another fix for this could be to add a inward draft to the bearing seat (see attached pic for an extremely exaggerated example) but I am not sure how this would work with mold release. In any case, I believe the bearing should "pop" into place and not easily slide in.
-
Adding my pointless opinion because I am sick and tired of this happening and I want to comment every time this issue gets raised in hopes that the people who make wheels notice the complaints and act upon. I have been having this issue on and off (most sets, really) since around 2008. Not taking old, tiny wheels (early 90's) into account where the bearings would straight up fall out of the wheels after a few months of use. The issue became a real problem around 2012 skating bones wheels and this was the reason I switched to F4s. However, even on most sets of F4s the bearings tend to slide out of their seats, making the truck feel like the axle has slipped with one wheel tightening. It has been strangely happening mostly when I skate flatground, and especially when I bail a trick and the board goes bouncing all over the place. I am sure that what causes the problem is a combination of me skating super sticky ground (like a super sandy/weathered concrete park) and the wheels being kinda slack from the get go. I remember with wheels back in the day that it was almost impossible to remove the bearings and no one ever had issues with the bearings sliding out of their seats. Wheel manufacturers should just make the bearing seats a little tighter (0.5 mm ?). Another fix for this could be to add a inward draft to the bearing seat (see attached pic for an extremely exaggerated example) but I am not sure how this would work with mold release. In any case, I believe the bearing should "pop" into place and not easily slide in.
I'd be interested to try something if someone did this, especially since the F4's have a slightly angled edge on the outside of the bearing seat (presumably to make it easier to press the bearing in). I know NHS has a slightly smaller bore on their softer wheels to accommodate the urethane distortion the bearing seat takes when you press the bearing in (since lets say a 95a will not hug the bearing as tightly as a 101a will). I've wanted to try a set of F4 101 Classics to see if a harder wheel would hold the bearing any more snug, but I'm terrified of skating 101's since I spend most of my time skating smooth concrete bowls and I feel like I would just slide all over the place on them. I may grab a set for the fuck of it just to see if it yields any different result.
-
I've wanted to try a set of F4 101 Classics to see if a harder wheel would hold the bearing any more snug
I strongly advise to try F4s if you have not already, they are THE best wheels. Just wanted to add that I had the bearings slide out while skating F4 101 classics and radial slims. For me, if I don't struggle to insert the bearings, it is a guarantee that they will slip out of the seats.
-
Expand Quote
I've wanted to try a set of F4 101 Classics to see if a harder wheel would hold the bearing any more snug
I strongly advise to try F4s if you have not already, they are THE best wheels. Just wanted to add that I had the bearings slide out while skating F4 101 classics and radial slims. For me, if I don't struggle to insert the bearings, it is a guarantee that they will slip out of the seats.
I've mostly skated F4 99's since they came out and have never had the bearing issue until the start of the pandemic and it's been plaguing me with every shape and size since then. Some less than others, but it happens (mind you it has also happened with OJ's OG and Elite 99a formulas & Speed Labs 99a formula with multiple different sets of bearings). The issue has lessened since I stopped running the center spacer, but it's still annoying to have to press the bearing back in the wheel after every few runs when it decides to act up. What I'm curious about is I'm setting up a Krooked 9.81" shape next on Ace AF1 66's and it'll be the first board in quite some time that I did not have the "size up" trucks on (i.e. an 8.75" with 9.125" trucks) so I'm curious if the board fitting in the rear and being a bit bigger in the front will change anything in a positive way.
-
I never had this problem growing up, and it happened all the time since four years ago when I picked it back up frequently.
Any power slide would push the bearing out against the wheel and cause it all be slow down.
I have always had a mm or two of play cause that’s what I thought you do.
Well, watched a few YT videos from people telling me “noooo you’re supposed to have NO play in your bearings! That’s how they’re designed!”
Well that’s a load of crap… I did that barely and it slowed the spin.
But I tried having them loosened to JUST off full tight grip (fraction of a mm), so they roll free… and I haven’t had bearing slip since like six months ago.
Huzzah.
-
carbon assembly paste. I mean it works pretty well on carbon bike frames. It lowers the amount of torgue needed so your frame doesn't snap, like on handlebars, seatpoast clamp etc.
It's save for carbon, don't know about polyurethane..
-
I never had this problem growing up, and it happened all the time since four years ago when I picked it back up frequently.
Any power slide would push the bearing out against the wheel and cause it all be slow down.
I have always had a mm or two of play cause that’s what I thought you do.
Well, watched a few YT videos from people telling me “noooo you’re supposed to have NO play in your bearings! That’s how they’re designed!”
Well that’s a load of crap… I did that barely and it slowed the spin.
But I tried having them loosened to JUST off full tight grip (fraction of a mm), so they roll free… and I haven’t had bearing slip since like six months ago.
Huzzah.
Yeah, I never once had this issue until the start of the pandemic. I also used to run my wheels a bit more "sloppy" play-wise, but lessened the amount of play after the issue started happening and it helps alleviate it a bit but does not fully solve the problem.
carbon assembly paste. I mean it works pretty well on carbon bike frames. It lowers the amount of torgue needed so your frame doesn't snap, like on handlebars, seatpoast clamp etc.
It's save for carbon, don't know about polyurethane..
I'm hesitant to add any kind of grease or the like to the bearing seat, especially carbon paste. That stuff is designed to lessen the torque needed, however, its also made to prevent the carbon from binding up and cold welding itself to the other parts so in my head it'd just make the issue worse. I did try prepping the bearing seats and the outsides of the bearing races with isopropyl alcohol hoping that'd help and it helped lessen the issue from happening. I'm still curious if I'd have the issue with 101's, but I know I'd just be sliding out and dying on them so the likelihood of me giving them a test is pretty low. I did find a shop that had a F4 graphic that came out pre-pandemic (that are the potato brown color) that I may grab a set of to see if they yield any different results than the stuff I've been having issues with over the past few years.
-
I use a bearing press, but when I notice a bearing slide into the wheel too easily, it’s usually because the outside of the outer race got coated in excess oil from the manufacturing and packaging process.
When this happens, I pull the bearing out and use a tiny bit of alcohol, degreaser, citrus cleaner, or something similar on a cotton swab to dissolve the oil on the outside, dry the metal, and swipe any residue out of the bearing seat, too.
-
The thing with my Spitfires is they sit extremely tight but the bearings still regularly jam. Then I have to loosen the nut a bit and it‘s fine but I can‘t do that too often else it falls of.
-
So yesterday I had the first session in 2 years where the issue did not present itself on my basically new complete (minus the swiss that I carried over since they’re only a few weeks old). The only thing I did differently this time around was give the bearings a full cleaning before assembly.
For context, they’re Swiss with no tube spacers in Spitfire F4 Classic 56’s.
Bearing overhaul process:
- Soak in isopropyl alcohol for an hour
- Agitate/shake them and let them sit for another hour
- Rinse with water
- Dry/blow out with air compressor
- 1 drop of speed cream in each bearing
- Spin the bearings a few times in both directions to let the speed cream evenly coat the balls/inner race and let sit on a paper towel shieldless side down to seep for 20-30 min
- Clean off the shieldless side with a dry paper towel, spin again, let sit shieldless side down for 20-30 min to seep
- Clean off the shieldless side with a dry paper towel, spin again, let sit shieldless side down for 20-30 min to seep
- Clean off the shieldless side with a dry paper towel once last time and use another clean dry paper towel to wipe down the outer rings of all of the bearings
- Install the bearings as normal
Take this with a grain of salt, but the issue started happening when I retired a set of 4 year old regularly maintained Swiss bearings and every set of bearings I’ve had it happen with were brand new. It never once dawned on me to try fully clean a brand new set of bearings. I did try just wiping the outer races down pre-assembly with alcohol a few times on previous setups, but they still had the issue so I’m thinking all of the bearings I’ve had are coming over lubricated from the factory and even being wiped down before installation the lubricant will seep toward the shieldless side/core of the wheel and cause the issue to happen (and once the bearing goes crooked a few times the urethanes rebound is compressed and wont fully go back to the OG bearing seat ID).
I’ll report back in a few days, but I have not had one single session at the bowl where at least one wheel gave me an issue in 2 years, so yesterday was welcome change to say the least.
This has been my TED talk…
-
I had two 4-hour sessions over the weekend and the issue did not happen once, which is a first for me since this has been non-stop for 2 years.
Thus far, I think the full cleaning prior to setting the new board up worked. My son, on the other hand, has been having the issue happen multiple times per session. We ordered him a new deck and some other things over the weekend and I figured I'd give his bearings the same cleaning treatment to see if I can replicate my success and I pulled the bearings from his wheel to see this (which I think proves my factory over-lubrication theory).
I'll give myself a few more sessions and have him skate his new setup for a week or so and I'll check back in here with an update, but this may have been the culprit all along. The moral of the story is we may all have to start cleaning band new bearings out of the box lol
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52825012343_48d2e28bfc_c.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/2otXZLT)
-
I’ve had this problem for the last year. Don’t use spacers. Has me considering buying a bearing press. I used to be able to just press in the bearings by hand now I usually have to crank them to get them set in the wheel. Usually about once a week one of my bearing will pop out and I gotta crank it again. I also only tighten my axel flush so I don’t have to rethread. Prob causes the issue while skating but confusing trying to get them in when they’re new
-
I’ve had this problem for the last year. Don’t use spacers. Has me considering buying a bearing press. I used to be able to just press in the bearings by hand now I usually have to crank them to get them set in the wheel. Usually about once a week one of my bearing will pop out and I gotta crank it again. I also only tighten my axel flush so I don’t have to rethread. Prob causes the issue while skating but confusing trying to get them in when they’re new
Try cleaning the bearings and wiping the bearing seats down before reinstalling. I've legit tried everything and the first time I had any bit of difference was after I fully cleaned/degreased the bearings and was SUPER diligent about only lightly re-greasing them.
-
I took my spacers out a few weeks ago and this has been happening a lot less. This is on my main setup with 99a F4s.
I’ve also noticed it never happens on my other setup with 95a OJs. I used to ride Bones DTF which were also 95a and never once had the bearings back out in all the years I rode them. I noticed it happening all the time when I switched to harder wheels.
I’m going to have to try this. I wondered if the spacers aren’t allowing a good seat of the bearing… for the conspiracy theory that wheel makers shrunk the molds a tiny bit to save money.
-
I’m going to have to try this. I wondered if the spacers aren’t allowing a good seat of the bearing… for the conspiracy theory that wheel makers shrunk the molds a tiny bit to save money.
I stopped using spacers as well, but as far as shrinking molds I think it's more that the molds are inconsistent and the spacers are not precision spec. I had a set of Spitfire F4's my son was skating that 2 wheels fit with the spacers perfectly and 2 wheels I would seat one side, put the spacer on and press the other bearing in and you could feel the other already seated bearing press out of the seat.
-
I'm gonna go ahead and say that Fireball Built bearings are the best value for money that you can possibly buy. They aren't as fast as ceramics or traditional bearings that use light oils for lubricants (they use grease), but they are consistent as fuck and last forever.
-
Hadn’t had issues with this since some V2 STFs and some OG formula classics I skated back in 2009-2010 but recently out of nowhere I’ve been having this happen on a set of 99A F4s, always on the back left wheel. The wheel locked up a few times during a sesh a few days back. At first I thought it might have been an axle slip on these ventures I’m currently skating, so I actually switched out my back hanger with a used hanger from an old set of ventures I had laying around that I knew was still good. Lo and behold fifteen minutes into the next sesh the wheel locked up again! I was thinking “there’s no way I just axle slipped another hanger” so I took a closer look and I’m fairly certain it’s from the bearings slipping out of the wheel. Much like an axle slip, it’s not the end of the world, but it definitely is annoying having to check your board every few tricks to make sure your wheel isn’t locked up and having to fix it real quick if it is locked up.
-
Pulled out some used 99a spits from last summer that I never had an issue with bearing slippage, but put some new Bones Big Balls in them fresh out of the package, and first slappy here we go again. You might be onto something with the alcohol bath. I didn’t go that far but I cleaned the inner and outer race with rubbing alcohol, and same with inside the wheels and the axles and hanger facings so everything is dried up. Tightened to less play with barely any side to side movement but enough for a good spin. Will try this out tomorrow and hopefully it solves it cause this shit is annoying.
edit: it didn’t work. Fuuuuuck
-
Hadn’t had issues with this since some V2 STFs and some OG formula classics I skated back in 2009-2010 but recently out of nowhere I’ve been having this happen on a set of 99A F4s, always on the back left wheel. The wheel locked up a few times during a sesh a few days back. At first I thought it might have been an axle slip on these ventures I’m currently skating, so I actually switched out my back hanger with a used hanger from an old set of ventures I had laying around that I knew was still good. Lo and behold fifteen minutes into the next sesh the wheel locked up again! I was thinking “there’s no way I just axle slipped another hanger” so I took a closer look and I’m fairly certain it’s from the bearings slipping out of the wheel. Much like an axle slip, it’s not the end of the world, but it definitely is annoying having to check your board every few tricks to make sure your wheel isn’t locked up and having to fix it real quick if it is locked up.
Out of curiosity what color are the F4’s? I have a whiter color set of F4 Classic 99a 56’s that I skated for a few months and they have been fine. Got a small edge chunk so I swapped them for a set if F4 Classic 99a 55’s that are more beige colored and had the issue happen with 2 of the wheels within the first 15 minutes on them. Took them off, swapped everything with alcohol and had the same issue. Tried them again with Spitfire Burners and still the issue persists. Threw the 56’s back on and we’re back to functional again… Might try and track down a set of newer whiter 55’s to see if its possibly a batch issue with the darker ones…
-
I posted about this issue a few years back and someone said it might be dirty or rusty axles causing it and suggested cleaning my axles and lightly oiling them. That worked for me and I rarely have this problem any more.
-
I posted about this issue a few years back and someone said it might be dirty or rusty axles causing it and suggested cleaning my axles and lightly oiling them. That worked for me and I rarely have this problem any more.
My trucks are only a few months old and the axles are clean so I don't think that's the issue. Oddly enough, I had a set of 99a F4 Classic 56's that I set up with Bones Swiss that I cleaned before I set the wheels up and I got 2 months with absolutely no issues. Got an edge chunk in my one wheel and grabbed a set of 99a F4 Classic 55's and had the issue happen with 2 of the 4 wheels with the same bearings (my heel side back wheel and my toe side front wheel). Tried the 55's with Spitfire Burner bearings as well just for sanity's sake, and the same thing happened. Put the Swiss back in the 56's and they're perfectly fine... The one thing I'm noticing is the 55's are more beige colored and the 56's are more white, so I ordered another set of 55's from a higher volume online shop (hoping to get a newer batch this way) and we'll see if they show up whiter like the 56's, and if that's the case maybe they'll be all good hahaha
-
Ordered a set of 99a F4 Classic 55's from Skate Warehouse assuming they'd be more "high volume" and have newer product and they came today. The wheels are the same color as my 99a F4 Classic 56's (more white than beige) and after throwing them on and messing around on my quarter for a bit they're working just as well as the 56's did for me. Now I'm just curious why the beige ones are having issues with the bearings staying seated...
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52925417326_3faba80deb_c.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/2oCQAFh)
-
Ordered a set of 99a F4 Classic 55's from Skate Warehouse assuming they'd be more "high volume" and have newer product and they came today. The wheels are the same color as my 99a F4 Classic 56's (more white than beige) and after throwing them on and messing around on my quarter for a bit they're working just as well as the 56's did for me. Now I'm just curious why the beige ones are having issues with the bearings staying seated...
That might be something to email DLX about, if for nothing more than to just check with them.
I think there was a time when quality control was lacking and things seemed a bit weird.
I haven't heard of any more issues recently, so whatever was going on a while back seems to be ironed out - that being just after the shutdowns so maybe they had ramped up production and rushed it a bit, leading to those issues.
-
Expand Quote
I posted about this issue a few years back and someone said it might be dirty or rusty axles causing it and suggested cleaning my axles and lightly oiling them. That worked for me and I rarely have this problem any more.
My trucks are only a few months old and the axles are clean so I don't think that's the issue. Oddly enough, I had a set of 99a F4 Classic 56's that I set up with Bones Swiss that I cleaned before I set the wheels up and I got 2 months with absolutely no issues. Got an edge chunk in my one wheel and grabbed a set of 99a F4 Classic 55's and had the issue happen with 2 of the 4 wheels with the same bearings (my heel side back wheel and my toe side front wheel). Tried the 55's with Spitfire Burner bearings as well just for sanity's sake, and the same thing happened. Put the Swiss back in the 56's and they're perfectly fine... The one thing I'm noticing is the 55's are more beige colored and the 56's are more white, so I ordered another set of 55's from a higher volume online shop (hoping to get a newer batch this way) and we'll see if they show up whiter like the 56's, and if that's the case maybe they'll be all good hahaha
Sounds like you can rule out axle grime then. What about bearings? When I had the issue I was also running Bones Swiss but nowadays I just skate Reds.
Kind of a tangent but back in May 2019 I had a set of F4s where one of the wheels wore down way faster than the others and was noticeably smaller. It was really weird but DLX sent me a replacement set after I told them about it. Only time I've had issues with F4s.
I've noticed the color change too. The newer batches are really white, like Bones wheels or something. I actually prefer the "natural" beige-ish color.
-
just chiming in because I was flipping the wheels on my set up so they wear evenly, and had 2 bearings fall out of the wheel. I have skated bones Swiss 6 for the last 5+ years and always used the spacers. These wheels are the first time it has happened to me and they were SF classics 54MM 97du purchased summer 2022.
This is my first time skating 97du, as im normally 99 or 101, so I have to assume that softer wheel is the culprit. Not sure what difference 2du really makes but its the only notable change ive made.
-
Was having an issue with this with Ace AF1 Hollow, Spitfire Conical full, mosaic bearings. My only theory was that the Ace's were an early set if hollows and seemed to have slightly undersized axles that allowed more bearing play than solid AF1's and Indy's. I haven't had the problem since switching back to Indy's.
The bearings are very tight in the wheels so I don't think that was the issue.
-
Expand Quote
I posted about this issue a few years back and someone said it might be dirty or rusty axles causing it and suggested cleaning my axles and lightly oiling them. That worked for me and I rarely have this problem any more.
My trucks are only a few months old and the axles are clean so I don't think that's the issue. Oddly enough, I had a set of 99a F4 Classic 56's that I set up with Bones Swiss that I cleaned before I set the wheels up and I got 2 months with absolutely no issues. Got an edge chunk in my one wheel and grabbed a set of 99a F4 Classic 55's and had the issue happen with 2 of the 4 wheels with the same bearings (my heel side back wheel and my toe side front wheel). Tried the 55's with Spitfire Burner bearings as well just for sanity's sake, and the same thing happened. Put the Swiss back in the 56's and they're perfectly fine... The one thing I'm noticing is the 55's are more beige colored and the 56's are more white, so I ordered another set of 55's from a higher volume online shop (hoping to get a newer batch this way) and we'll see if they show up whiter like the 56's, and if that's the case maybe they'll be all good hahaha
what do think about lubing the axle? idk, just throwing lube at the wall and seeing if it sticks.
-
Yesterday I put some Indy spacers in my wheels and now the bearings stay where they are or the axle nuts don't tighten itself anymore. First time in ~15 years that I use spacers. I feel hella dumb now.
-
.
There have been a few more people with bearing seat issues in other threads, so hopefully if they can revisit this thread, it might help some.
For those who did have issues before, are any of you still having issues, or have the cleaning of bearing seat and outside of bearings sorted that for you?
Or did you just end up getting different wheels and no longer have to deal with that problem?
-
I was thinking of loosening the nut a quarter turn riding around and sending a photo to skate one. I'm sure they're not going to send an alternative wheel. I don't want a dragon back. I want a big ass hard wheel in return.
-
.
There have been a few more people with bearing seat issues in other threads, so hopefully if they can revisit this thread, it might help some.
For those who did have issues before, are any of you still having issues, or have the cleaning of bearing seat and outside of bearings sorted that for you?
Or did you just end up getting different wheels and no longer have to deal with that problem?
I had this problem for years and the thing that finally fixed it was getting rid of my bearing spacers. I tried several new sets of wheels, trucks, and bearings but my bearings would always back out. I always convinced myself to use the spacers since they came with Swiss bearings, but life is better without them
-
When you press in the bearing, make sure its properly seated/square. If you roll the wheel between ur thumb and pointer finger, you can easly feel if the bearings are unevenly seated, as the wheel will spin squarly. I know alot of skaters have 10 thumbs, so they dont do basic stuff like this correctly... Just a headsup
-
I use a bearing press, but when I notice a bearing slide into the wheel too easily, it’s usually because the outside of the outer race got coated in excess oil from the manufacturing and packaging process.
When this happens, I pull the bearing out and use a tiny bit of alcohol, degreaser, citrus cleaner, or something similar on a cotton swab to dissolve the oil on the outside, dry the metal, and swipe any residue out of the bearing seat, too.
I gotta try this… having a bit of bearing slip these days every once in a while. I have X97’s and bones Swiss.
It could easily be bones lube on the inner wheel track.
-
I ordered a bearing press. Gonna clean my bearings and the new wheels I got with alcohol. These last set of wheels has been annoying.
-
I had this problem for years and the thing that finally fixed it was getting rid of my bearing spacers. I tried several new sets of wheels, trucks, and bearings but my bearings would always back out. I always convinced myself to use the spacers since they came with Swiss bearings, but life is better without them
When you press in the bearing, make sure its properly seated/square. If you roll the wheel between ur thumb and pointer finger, you can easly feel if the bearings are unevenly seated, as the wheel will spin squarly. I know alot of skaters have 10 thumbs, so they dont do basic stuff like this correctly... Just a headsup
Yes I think both those two replies are on the money.
Cleaning the outside of the bearings seem to be the way to go, as well as checking the bearing is seated correctly, as per the spin between finger and thumb way.
I never use bearing presses, even though I know others swear by them. I usually put the board on the floor or ground on its side, just put two bearings on the axle, both shields down, push wheel down gently but firmly using both palms, turn some, push down, spin to make sure it is evenly on there, then turn over and repeat, check between finger and thumb if there is any doubt, but almost always they are good.
Had a few sets of wheels with uneven bearing seats, which are easy to see with this method, but I know some people don't even check and just try to skate the board with bearings only half pressed in quite often, which is so weird, but I guess that is just part of getting to know your setup, etc.
-
Also.. It can seem tempting to use the axle nut as press. Tighten the axle bolt down super hard to seat the bearings. This is not good, because it only puts load on the inner races.