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Skateboarding => USELESS WOODEN TOY BANTER => Topic started by: fineslime on May 13, 2024, 07:17:34 PM
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I've been thinking about how high-level athletes like Kobe Bryant, Michael Jordan, and John Daly all share the same sort of high-level/ very specific and focused version of psychopathy; they say to be great you have to be an obsessed villainous psychopath...
It led me to wonder about the psychological attributes that some great skaters have, and what psychological makeup would result in a good skateboarder.
What are the ideal psychological traits that lend themselves to being a great skateboarder? I don't think every good skateboarder is a diagnosable psychopath, but I do think we all share a common determination and mindset. being a psycho helps though.
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Greco has a hammer, I’m sure that helps with confidence
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Loving pain
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Dunno if I'm remembering it correctly or not, but, didn't Heath talk about being an adrenaline junkie in his Epicly Laterd?
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“Breathe the pressha”
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I guess I’d chalk up most skaters to a being mix of determination and self rewarding behavior, with the masochism and stubbornness of what it takes to “get good”
At the end of the day
We all do it for the Jaebs
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Being dumb as fuck seems to help.
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Reynolds had “the madness”. Obsessed and compulsive. All the superstitions and habits before trying a trick.
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Being dumb as fuck seems to help.
"Health insurance is a scam by big corpos" mentality
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Being dumb as fuck seems to help.
"Health insurance is a scam by big corpos" mentality
The fact that there are hardly any top tier gnarly pros out of Europe aka social & health insurance part of the world, despite its immense skating demographic, indicates that you might be woefully correct.
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I think describing John Daly as an "athlete" might be stretching it a bit ;)
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being a narcissist doesn't hurt.
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Substance abuse gotta be up there.
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I've been thinking about how high-level athletes like Kobe Bryant, Michael Jordan, and John Daly all share the same sort of high-level/ very specific and focused version of psychopathy; they say to be great you have to be an obsessed villainous psychopath...
It led me to wonder about the psychological attributes that some great skaters have, and what psychological makeup would result in a good skateboarder.
What are the ideal psychological traits that lend themselves to being a great skateboarder? I don't think every good skateboarder is a diagnosable psychopath, but I do think we all share a common determination and mindset. being a psycho helps though.
Danny Way.
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Autism.
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Addictive behaviours
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I've been thinking about how high-level athletes like Kobe Bryant, Michael Jordan, and John Daly all share the same sort of high-level/ very specific and focused version of psychopathy; they say to be great you have to be an obsessed villainous psychopath...
It led me to wonder about the psychological attributes that some great skaters have, and what psychological makeup would result in a good skateboarder.
What are the ideal psychological traits that lend themselves to being a great skateboarder? I don't think every good skateboarder is a diagnosable psychopath, but I do think we all share a common determination and mindset. being a psycho helps though.
what? can you provide any source for these claims?
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I have a theory that all great switch skaters experience a small degree of brain damage similar to that of people forced to switch to being right handed as a child in school and the fact that most of the necessary learning takes place in teenagers hinders brain development.
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Skateboarding does not revolve around competition and until it does, it will not attract these kind of self-absorbed over achievers that cannot find inner peace. For them, there is no happiness, only the pursuit of the next (greatest of all time) achievement. Narcissism, basically.
These kind of people thrive in sports where their achievements are easily quantifiable - for example how many time they were selected as MVPs.
Moreover, the amount of admiration even the best skateboarder can gain from skateboarding is very small, albeit with some notable exceptions like Tony Hawk or Bam Margera. But they blew up from other mainstream media exposure.
That said, I personally know of a few very good (formerly active) skateboarders that could fit that bill - their self-absorption and over confidence would make it easier for them to try gnarly stuff or just land the trick in fewer tries.
People like that don't push the local scene forward and I hope the olympics don't invite too many of them into skateboarding.
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I've been thinking about how high-level athletes like Kobe Bryant, Michael Jordan, and John Daly all share the same sort of high-level/ very specific and focused version of psychopathy; they say to be great you have to be an obsessed villainous psychopath...
It led me to wonder about the psychological attributes that some great skaters have, and what psychological makeup would result in a good skateboarder.
What are the ideal psychological traits that lend themselves to being a great skateboarder? I don't think every good skateboarder is a diagnosable psychopath, but I do think we all share a common determination and mindset. being a psycho helps though.
what? can you provide any source for these claims?
You can never claim someone is a psycho outright, but 1 in 100 have symptoms of being psychopaths.
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I've been thinking about how high-level athletes like Kobe Bryant, Michael Jordan, and John Daly all share the same sort of high-level/ very specific and focused version of psychopathy; they say to be great you have to be an obsessed villainous psychopath...
It led me to wonder about the psychological attributes that some great skaters have, and what psychological makeup would result in a good skateboarder.
What are the ideal psychological traits that lend themselves to being a great skateboarder? I don't think every good skateboarder is a diagnosable psychopath, but I do think we all share a common determination and mindset. being a psycho helps though.
what? can you provide any source for these claims?
You can never claim someone is a psycho outright, but 1 in 100 have symptoms of being psychopaths.
again: based on what? multiple claims are made based on no foundation. the hypothesis whether psychopathic "symptoms" (better: traits) may be beneficial for some aspects of life and success is interesting, however, I would like to see who made the connection to these elite sport athlethes and based on what.
a quick (and not sufficient) search indicates that this hypothesis may not be true (https://doi.org/10.1016/j.paid.2007.11.008)
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I've been thinking about how high-level athletes like Kobe Bryant, Michael Jordan, and John Daly all share the same sort of high-level/ very specific and focused version of psychopathy; they say to be great you have to be an obsessed villainous psychopath...
It led me to wonder about the psychological attributes that some great skaters have, and what psychological makeup would result in a good skateboarder.
What are the ideal psychological traits that lend themselves to being a great skateboarder? I don't think every good skateboarder is a diagnosable psychopath, but I do think we all share a common determination and mindset. being a psycho helps though.
what? can you provide any source for these claims?
You can never claim someone is a psycho outright, but 1 in 100 have symptoms of being psychopaths.
again: based on what? multiple claims are made based on no foundation. the hypothesis whether psychopathic "symptoms" (better: traits) may be beneficial for some aspects of life and success is interesting, however, I would like to see who made the connection to these elite sport athlethes and based on what.
a quick (and not sufficient) search indicates that this hypothesis may not be true (https://doi.org/10.1016/j.paid.2007.11.008)
based on peoples actions
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Elaborate, please.
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I think one of the traits that separates good skaters from others is facing fear. Not fearless, but knowing something is causing fear but still facing it. That is a skill in itself.
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Eli Reed is a fascinating case study here.
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Kobe Bryant, Michael Jordan, and John Daly
Daly is as hellride as it gets
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I think one of the traits that separates good skaters from others is facing fear. Not fearless, but knowing something is causing fear but still facing it. That is a skill in itself.
This is a big one. Ability to face failure repeatedly as well.
The “black outs” Reynolds, Jaws, and others have talked about seems to ring true for big hucks, you have to be able to let go of everything in your mind and be empty/not thinking.
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I think the Pro-Capable are missing a part of their brain that allows them to prioritize self-preservation.
Pro-Capable because these psychos will either end up Pro level, or they are going to absolutely destroy their body because they aren’t talented enough to not break themselves.
Example: a kid at a skatepark was around for a few weeks and every time I ran into him, he’d say something like “I’ve been here for a few hours already”, and he was STILL skating around jumping down and over shit like nothing. The dude never stopped.
But he was scary to watch skate, because he would huck himself at and down the Hubba and handrail, and QP without any sort of finesse or high level skill.
It was terrifying and I had to look away several times he launched himself down the rail or start, because I was always afraid I’d witness some ankle break or knee dislocation.
Anyways, one day I roll up at 9 in the morning, I said hi, and he said he’d been up since 7 skating. Oh, and he had blood smeared all over his neck…
“Wtf did you do?”
“Oh, I was just going for the handrail and fell on it with my neck. No big deal”
…as he continued to skate and gracelessly hit the handrail more.
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Being dumb as fuck seems to help.
"Health insurance is a scam by big corpos" mentality
The fact that there are hardly any top tier gnarly pros out of Europe aka social & health insurance part of the world, despite its immense skating demographic, indicates that you might be woefully correct.
Hoping this is sarcasm.
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I'm sure the bloard is familiar with the "10,000 hour rule", which basically boils down to "it takes a lot of practice to be good at complex tasks."
Skateboarding is not only a complex task, but one that can expose participants to significant degrees of danger and potential harm. The potential harm escalates as you progress into more advanced levels of skating (an obvious example is the difference between a kickflip on flat versus a kickflip down a 10 stair.)
Because of this, the outliers in skating (high level ams and pros) must have a deep obsession with achieving and maintaining high-level skills, an obsession that ultimately outweighs the potential dangers (injury or death) of the practice involved to achieve that level of skill.
To contrast this idea - in my experience, the majority of people who pick up skating end up following two general paths:
1) They quit due to difficulty and/or the above mentioned factors (fear of injury/harm/death).
2) They don't quit, but become complacent/satisfied at a certain skill level (whether consciously or not).
I think the underlying rationale of the second case is that the cost (time, effort, exposure to danger) it takes to attain elite level skill level isn't proportionate to the benefit of having that increased skill set (especially a skill set that can be as fleeting as the ability to do tre flip noseblunts down handrails or backflip over a mega ramp).
This rationale definitely makes sense for skaters that aren't following the contest or sponsorship route - why would you put your body or life on the line if nobody really cares or is rewarding you for it?
However, for the outliers (high level ams and pros), the obsession to perfect their craft and reach their highest potential - even despite the potential dangers - manifests in hours and hours spent on the board. The obsession drives intense focus and practice, which over a long enough period of time (and under the right circumstances) can lead to mastery.
This is why I think that obsession is one of the key attributes that makes great skaters great - they can't not skate because they are obsessed with it, and that obsession can produce incredible skill and determination to fight through trick battles, injuries, and other adversities.
This is also why it's sometimes tragic to see skaters with great potential fade from the limelight or get caught up in bad shit. The obsession either fades or gets directed into darker, more self-destructive ends.
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Be the type of person who's willing to try crack at least once despite the potential for life-destroying addiction but then not get addicted and just have tried it once to see what it was like
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I think one of the traits that separates good skaters from others is facing fear. Not fearless, but knowing something is causing fear but still facing it. That is a skill in itself.
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this thread reek like screen grabs of ai promps for some dickheads skate video game he making cuz he can tre flip on a board with the trucks hella tight and don’t see how it’s a pressure flip and that’s where they got lost. It’s in the separating and making one thing a thing that equals this or that. That naming part. That dumbing it down. It’s skateboarding. To do it is to understand it. Nothing more. Tricks land themselves. You are the vessel of that trick entering our dimension.
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All top tier skaters are a little crazy. The bests of all industries are a little insane. You basically have to be different and crazy to be able to achieve such greatness
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Kobe Bryant, Michael Jordan and John Daly…..I’m sure everyone here has their Kobe and MJ of skating, but who would be the John Daly of skateboarding?
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I'd say there's a three way balance you need to get right between being obsessed enough to practice, being brave enough to commit to stuff and having the natural athleticism to actually perform the tricks. Generally, with the people I know who are sponsored/pro level, they're not the dude who'll just throw himself at anything cos those dudes are generally braver than their skill level and end up injured or breaking too many boards to be able to skate. It's more of an ability to weigh up skill level vs risk rationally In their brain and then if they believe the skill level is sufficient, to commit to stuff. I'd also say that people who are more naturally athletically gifted probably find it a lot easier to find this confidence through having had a lifetime of being Able to do physical tasks more easily than others and therefore an expectance of success, however when I was growing up it was often the dudes who were naturals who didn't stick with skating because they were also good at other stuff and maybe the challenge of skating didn't satisfy them as much as for someone who had to work at it. I had a mate who played premier league/european cup level football until he was in his 20s, he started skating around 28 and it was amazing how quick he got good but after a few months he just got bored cos there was other stuff that he was good at that he didn't get so broken off doing.
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Kobe Bryant, Michael Jordan and John Daly…..I’m sure everyone here has their Kobe and MJ of skating, but who would be the John Daly of skateboarding?
Someone who smokes cigs, doesn’t look like an athlete, but is incredibly talented. Drehobol?
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Being dumb as fuck seems to help.
Not all, but a lot of the gnarliest skaters seem pretty "simple minded," to put it gently. You almost have to be at least a little bit stupid to repeatedly jump down big gaps and shit.
I think it helps to be able to turn your brain off while attempting tricks. David Foster Wallace wrote an essay that pertains to this subject. From "How Tracy Austin Broke My Heart":
"It may well be that we, spectators, who are not divinely gifted as athletes, are the only ones able truly to see, articulate, and animate the experience of the gift we are denied. And that those who receive and act out the gift of athletic genius must, perforce, be blind and dumb about it -- and not because blindness and dumbness are the price of the gift, but because they are its essence."
And also:
“The real secret behind top athletes’ genius, then, may be as esoteric and obvious and dull and profound as silence itself. The real, many-veiled answer to the question of just what goes through a great player’s mind as he stands at the center of a hostile crowdnoise and lines up the free-throw that will decide the game might well be: nothing at all.”
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Mindfulness is being fully aware in the present moment
Id say, along with fear tolerance or risk taking, mindfulness is a huge component of skating on another level
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Kobe Bryant, Michael Jordan and John Daly…..I’m sure everyone here has their Kobe and MJ of skating, but who would be the John Daly of skateboarding?
I hate to say it, but it could be Fred Gall. I love me some John Daly, but I can’t believe the OP didn’t put Tiger Woods in there instead.
Tiger Woods is your Nyjah. Molded to be a super star by an overbearing father. While Fred Gall is your John Daly. The everyday man with demons, who wins over the hearts of the people with their honesty, public failings, and blue collar charisma.
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this thread reek like screen grabs of ai promps for some dickheads skate video game he making cuz he can tre flip on a board with the trucks hella tight and don’t see how it’s a pressure flip and that’s where they got lost. It’s in the separating and making one thing a thing that equals this or that. That naming part. That dumbing it down. It’s skateboarding. To do it is to understand it. Nothing more. Tricks land themselves. You are the vessel of that trick entering our dimension.
In some weird way this is kinda deep.
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Kobe Bryant, Michael Jordan and John Daly…..I’m sure everyone here has their Kobe and MJ of skating, but who would be the John Daly of skateboarding?
I hate to say it, but it could be Fred Gall. I love me some John Daly, but I can’t believe the OP didn’t put Tiger Woods in there instead.
Tiger Woods is your Nyjah. Molded to be a super star by an overbearing father. While Fred Gall is your John Daly. The everyday man with demons, who wins over the hearts of the people with their honesty, public failings, and blue collar charisma.
Northwest Arkansas in the house John Daly is a hero and to see him compared to Fred Gall makes my heart happy.
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I had a mate who played premier league/european cup level football until he was in his 20s, he started skating around 28 and it was amazing how quick he got good but after a few months he just got bored cos there was other stuff that he was good at that he didn't get so broken off doing.
Yooooo...as a rare fotball/skating combo fanatic, plus moonlighting in football on/off for 15+ years, I'm dying to know who this player is. Especially since he's obviously not some Serie C/Ekstraklasa John Doe.
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All top tier skaters are a little crazy. The bests of all industries are a little insane. You basically have to be different and crazy to be able to achieve such greatness
Probably more than a little. All skaters are a bit crazy so they must be really crazy.
Almost all pro skaters start when they’re kids and the very best get noticed early. That probably causes a lot of issues, like having psycho stage parents, or being around adults who don’t have your best interests in mind, or being bullied by your peers.
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Being dumb as fuck seems to help.
Not all, but a lot of the gnarliest skaters seem pretty "simple minded," to put it gently. You almost have to be at least a little bit stupid to repeatedly jump down big gaps and shit.
I think it helps to be able to turn your brain off while attempting tricks. David Foster Wallace wrote an essay that pertains to this subject. From "How Tracy Austin Broke My Heart":
"It may well be that we, spectators, who are not divinely gifted as athletes, are the only ones able truly to see, articulate, and animate the experience of the gift we are denied. And that those who receive and act out the gift of athletic genius must, perforce, be blind and dumb about it -- and not because blindness and dumbness are the price of the gift, but because they are its essence."
And also:
“The real secret behind top athletes’ genius, then, may be as esoteric and obvious and dull and profound as silence itself. The real, many-veiled answer to the question of just what goes through a great player’s mind as he stands at the center of a hostile crowdnoise and lines up the free-throw that will decide the game might well be: nothing at all.”
Aw, man, you got me thinkin'!
Love David Foster Wallace so much RIP.
So who is the Nicola Jokic of skateboarding, the one who thinks out and analyzes and understands every trick and situation, the one for whom the head is an advantage?
Who's the Hal Incandenza of skateboarding, the fragile, crystalline super-brain who might get the yips in the big moment?
Who's the Big Don Gately of skateboarding, the absolute meat tank with the head like a concrete block, who is still a really chill kind dude?
Edit: nominees for the Don G award: Foy, BA, Stu, Grosso, others?
Edit edit: hmm so maybe there are more Don Gs than Jokers in skateboarding?
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Being dumb as fuck seems to help.
Not all, but a lot of the gnarliest skaters seem pretty "simple minded," to put it gently. You almost have to be at least a little bit stupid to repeatedly jump down big gaps and shit.
I think it helps to be able to turn your brain off while attempting tricks. David Foster Wallace wrote an essay that pertains to this subject. From "How Tracy Austin Broke My Heart":
"It may well be that we, spectators, who are not divinely gifted as athletes, are the only ones able truly to see, articulate, and animate the experience of the gift we are denied. And that those who receive and act out the gift of athletic genius must, perforce, be blind and dumb about it -- and not because blindness and dumbness are the price of the gift, but because they are its essence."
And also:
“The real secret behind top athletes’ genius, then, may be as esoteric and obvious and dull and profound as silence itself. The real, many-veiled answer to the question of just what goes through a great player’s mind as he stands at the center of a hostile crowdnoise and lines up the free-throw that will decide the game might well be: nothing at all.”
Aw, man, you got me thinkin'!
Love David Foster Wallace so much RIP.
So who is the Nicola Jokic of skateboarding, the one who thinks out and analyzes and understands every trick and situation, the one for whom the head is an advantage?
Who's the Hal Incandenza of skateboarding, the fragile, crystalline super-brain who might get the yips in the big moment?
Who's the Big Don Gately of skateboarding, the absolute meat tank with the head like a concrete block, who is still a really chill kind dude?
Edit: nominees for the Don G award: Foy, BA, Stu, Grosso, others?
Edit edit: hmm so maybe there are more Don Gs than Jokers in skateboarding?
For your "Nicola Jokic" archetype - Rodney Mullen comes to mind, just in terms of the analytical approach to board physics and pressure points when developing new tricks and techniques.
I know he's not a favorite around here, but Dan Corrigan seems to have a similarly analytical (almost over-analytical) approach to skating. His trick tips isolate really specific details that I wouldn't initially think about.
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Slap really is the most Orwellian place on the internet.
Are you fuckers really this invested? U psycho analizers
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Maybe they just put the time in. Instead of Twitter or whatever this is.
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I had a mate who played premier league/european cup level football until he was in his 20s, he started skating around 28 and it was amazing how quick he got good but after a few months he just got bored cos there was other stuff that he was good at that he didn't get so broken off doing.
Yooooo...as a rare fotball/skating combo fanatic, plus moonlighting in football on/off for 15+ years, I'm dying to know who this player is. Especially since he's obviously not some Serie C/Ekstraklasa John Doe.
You wouldn't have heard of him and I don't really wanna put his name out there, He was at Leeds youth and maybe came on as a sub a couple of times and then played for Leicester, think he was first team for a bit but he was out by his early 20s.
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Are you going to risk life and limb over and over and over again for that eternal, but essentially internal satisfaction of rolling away?
That is skateboarding.
- Hick Roward
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Pat Duffy was brought back in a time machine like the Terminator, then his program malfunctioned.
But, Danny Way comes closest to what you are describing.
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I had a mate who played premier league/european cup level football until he was in his 20s, he started skating around 28 and it was amazing how quick he got good but after a few months he just got bored cos there was other stuff that he was good at that he didn't get so broken off doing.
Yooooo...as a rare fotball/skating combo fanatic, plus moonlighting in football on/off for 15+ years, I'm dying to know who this player is. Especially since he's obviously not some Serie C/Ekstraklasa John Doe.
You wouldn't have heard of him and I don't really wanna put his name out there, He was at Leeds youth and maybe came on as a sub a couple of times and then played for Leicester, think he was first team for a bit but he was out by his early 20s.
No, no, didn't expect an explicit ID :) this is more than enough. Still, very cool.
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Deathwish. Rock n roll hell yeah!
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I've been thinking about how high-level athletes like Kobe Bryant, Michael Jordan, and John Daly all share the same sort of high-level/ very specific and focused version of psychopathy; they say to be great you have to be an obsessed villainous psychopath...
It led me to wonder about the psychological attributes that some great skaters have, and what psychological makeup would result in a good skateboarder.
What are the ideal psychological traits that lend themselves to being a great skateboarder? I don't think every good skateboarder is a diagnosable psychopath, but I do think we all share a common determination and mindset. being a psycho helps though.
what? can you provide any source for these claims?
You can never claim someone is a psycho outright, but 1 in 100 have symptoms of being psychopaths.
again: based on what? multiple claims are made based on no foundation. the hypothesis whether psychopathic "symptoms" (better: traits) may be beneficial for some aspects of life and success is interesting, however, I would like to see who made the connection to these elite sport athlethes and based on what.
a quick (and not sufficient) search indicates that this hypothesis may not be true (https://doi.org/10.1016/j.paid.2007.11.008)
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/37884281/
https://www.researchgate.net/publication/375678226_Beyond_a_Game_A_Narrative_Review_of_Psychopathic_Traits_in_Sporting_Environments
Niels Birbaumer, one of the fathers of biological psychology and pioneering Neuro-researcher on convicted psychopaths with and without brain damage, loved to say in his seminars: "The pity is, I only got to do research on the bad psychopaths. The succesful ones are sitting on the boards of our Top 100." Of course this is hyperbole, as are the quotes by David Foster Wallace, who was a gifted poet and intellectual, but not a researcher (and also a lot more geniusly gifted himself than he liked to admit).
I'm not a psychological researcher myself, I've only made a couple films about it, but the whole thing really doesn't seem too far fetched when you engage with the (public) personas of Jagger Eaton, Nyjah Huston, Tyshawn, PRod. There's them and then there's the more awkward (and in a way more sincere) silent assassins like Yuto and Gustavo Ribeiro.
This all applies to the athletic, trophy- and contest-oriented side of skating of course. Wouldn't know how to find similarities between Kader, Dylan, Gino and Grant Taylor...
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impulsive personality would probably be a common denominator. When looking at anything over 9 stairs impulsive thinking would be a strength.
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Ironically if you're registered on Slap then it's 99.9% confirmed you don't have the psychology of a pro
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Ironically if you're registered on Slap then it's 99.9% confirmed you don't have the psychology of a pro
Are you trying to suggest we’re not a bunch of psychos?
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That David Foster Wallace quote is great.
Then there are also pros who have the sensitivity. They know how to make a trick look good, care about execution and trick selection. They dance and they think about it, maybe they just repeat enough to get in the flow and enter the mindless zone.
I'm super curious about the correlation between ADHD and skateboarding.
Skateboarding can help regulate a busy mind, perfect vessel for hyper-focus and cruising around provides a ton of novelty. Been seeing lots of my long-time skate friends posting about ADHD, but don't have much more than an anecdotal take.
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I think describing John Daly as an "athlete" might be stretching it a bit ;)
Yeah, I had to re-read that.
Out of ALL the golf guys this poster could have gone to he decide to go to the fucken Marlboro Papa Smurf, the Colonel of Coronary Artery Disease fucken John Daly