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General Discussion => WHATEVER => Topic started by: Tha J-train on October 25, 2007, 09:21:02 AM
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why are people wearing rosaries as the latest piece of flair? I've seen them on bam, robin thicke, random dudes with the turn of the century elizabethean style going on, rasta looking dudes (which really doesn't make sense), guys who wear T-shirts over dress shirts, and now diamond's got two new shirts with rosaries on it. I don't mean to be a hater but as a catholic who actually prays the rosary it really trivializes a prayer that has made a big difference in my life, and seeing people throw it on to up their style points comes off as hella disrespectful to me. what's next, yarmulkes instead of new eras? well... i can't complain that much seeing how clothing companies have tried to turn the rastafarian religion into a marketing tool. There's a line there... its hard to say what's respectful and promotes vs what's bogus and cheapens.
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now you know how the rastafarians feel about everyone rocking red/green/yellow and pot leafs on their clothes
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Way to spell yarmulke right!
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why are people wearing rosaries as the latest piece of flair? I've seen them on bam, robin thicke, random dudes with the turn of the century elizabethean style going on, rasta looking dudes (which really doesn't make sense), guys who wear T-shirts over dress shirts, and now diamond's got two new shirts with rosaries on it. I don't mean to be a hater but as a catholic who actually prays the rosary it really trivializes a prayer that has made a big difference in my life, and seeing people throw it on to up their style points comes off as hella disrespectful to me. what's next, yarmulkes instead of new eras? well... i can't complain that much seeing how clothing companies have tried to turn the rastafarian religion into a marketing tool. There's a line there... its hard to say what's respectful and promotes vs what's bogus and cheapens.
I don't wear a rosary, though every once in a while I wear a little crucifix necklace that was sent to me by some bullshit scam artist fundie group that used the trinket as a ploy to get people to donate money to them (I'm not talking about a charity organization, I'm talking about religiscammers), and I'm a very open atheist. I just think the little think looks cool.
Had it been a rosary, and I thought it looked cool (and wasn't worried about it poking me in the eye), I might be inclined to sport it every once in a while... if only because I'd dig on the irony of it. As far as it being disrepectful to you, what do you care? Your rosary is between you and whatever being(s) you pray to. If your god is real, he can certainly handle himself, and just as it isn't anyone's business to interrupt your cosmic conversations, it really isn't your concern to worry about how other people use religious trinkets, right?
You made a point about people wearing it somehow trivializing prayer... I guess i can dig that, and actually, I could see wearing a rosary for the sole purpose of "stating" that prayer is a trivial thing (as I personally believe it to be). I don't see why you'd be so offended though... I mean, if the creator of the universe is on your team, then what do you care? Just pray for god to zap them.
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think about it like this - you like skateboarding, right? think of your favorite skate brand, the one that means most to you. now imagine the biggest tool (who doesn't actually skate) wearing that a shirt with that logo on it. now multiply that feeling times a million, because skateboarding is something you like and God is someone I worship.
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think about it like this - you like skateboarding, right? think of your favorite skate brand, the one that means most to you. now imagine the biggest tool (who doesn't actually skate) wearing that a shirt with that logo on it. now multiply that feeling times a million, because skateboarding is something you like and God is someone I worship.
See, I can't relate... I see tons of random brodies wearing skate gear daily, and I couldn't care.
And again, if God is on your side, why would you concern yourself with something as petty as a piece of jewelery? To me, it's beads on a string... to you it's something different.
Are you offended on behalf of God? Better yet, do you think it offends God? If you say "yes," then how do you know?
I'd wager (if I was a betting man of faith) that God thinks it's just beads on a string too. If he were real, maybe he's into the prayers, but do you think an omnipresent, omniscient being could give two shits about high-quality mardi gras beads?
Does any of that have an effect on your faith?
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think about it like this - you like skateboarding, right? think of your favorite skate brand, the one that means most to you. now imagine the biggest tool (who doesn't actually skate) wearing that a shirt with that logo on it. now multiply that feeling times a million, because skateboarding is something you like and God is someone I worship.
i worship skateboarding
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hold on while i google rosarie
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my parents gave me one when i was 16, lost it in a fight, I didn't care. I'm an athiest, I dont believing in anything but the fact that people are living on the earth.
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i was doing my daily porning when a video i opened was a chick geting railed dressed like a nun, i freaked out and shut it and looked around to make sure noone saw.
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god saw, he told me he was un-happy that you closed the video.
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Way to spell yarmulke right!
that's the first thing I thought of too when I read the post.
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i was doing my daily porning when a video i opened was a chick geting railed dressed like a nun, i freaked out and shut it and looked around to make sure noone saw.
"Her name was Sistah Fista'"
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think about it like this - you like skateboarding, right? think of your favorite skate brand, the one that means most to you. now imagine the biggest tool (who doesn't actually skate) wearing that a shirt with that logo on it. now multiply that feeling times a million, because skateboarding is something you like and God is someone I worship.
isn't the whole point of symbolism in religion to help spread the word? seems like you'd be stoked. elitism and religion seem like they don't mix well together to me.
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"kindness is my relgion"
now just imagine if everybody lived by those words.
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think about it like this - you like skateboarding, right? think of your favorite skate brand, the one that means most to you. now imagine the biggest tool (who doesn't actually skate) wearing that a shirt with that logo on it. now multiply that feeling times a million, because skateboarding is something you like and God is someone I worship.
isn't the whole point of symbolism in religion to help spread the word? seems like you'd be stoked. elitism and religion seem like they don't mix well together to me.
I want you to think about that statement for a minute.
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and now diamond's got two new shirts with rosaries on it.
(http://www.cal-surf.com/product_photos/large/porvida.jpg)
Is it this diamond shirt?
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think about it like this - you like skateboarding, right? think of your favorite skate brand, the one that means most to you. now imagine the biggest tool (who doesn't actually skate) wearing that a shirt with that logo on it. now multiply that feeling times a million, because skateboarding is something you like and God is someone I worship.
isn't the whole point of symbolism in religion to help spread the word? seems like you'd be stoked. elitism and religion seem like they don't mix well together to me.
I want you to think about that statement for a minute.
drawing a blank here, what's wrong with it?
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hold on while i google rosarie
are you really that clueless?
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im guessing it has something to do with roses, and possibly that little baby jesus fellow i hear so much about.
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i was doing my daily porning when a video i opened was a chick geting railed dressed like a nun, i freaked out and shut it and looked around to make sure noone saw.
haha...you were doing your daily porning and had to look around to make sure nobody saw?
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i was doing my daily porning when a video i opened was a chick geting railed dressed like a nun, i freaked out and shut it and looked around to make sure noone saw.
haha...you were doing your daily porning and had to look around to make sure nobody saw?
yea, thank goodness it wasnt a sold out show.
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on a similar note.. not really stoked on all the companies using the day of the dead/vato style art right now, its just played out, its cool when a company like Real or Vans does it, but i really dont want to see a sugar skull on a Famous stars and straps shirt.
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hold on while i google rosarie
Why should a non catholic know what a rosarie is? I don't really. I know its got beads and a cross, but don't really know what it is or is about, and hopefully I can say without offending catholics, it doesn't really matter to me.
Actually, I don't care if I offend a christian. Y'all are the white people of religion.
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on a similar note.. not really stoked on all the companies using the day of the dead/vato style art right now, its just played out, its cool when a company like Real or Vans does it, but i really dont want to see a sugar skull on a Famous stars and straps shirt.
I have a 3 year old shirt from Chuy's that's for dia de los muertos. Es tres mariachi's in skeleton form. It's dope and you get a discount if you wear it in to eat.
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i always like to check the bottom of religious paraphernalia to see where it was made. statues of mary, rosaries, whatever almost always are made in china. does the fact that non-christians working for a few cents on an assembly line are making these things bother you? that to me seems like a bigger deal than billy broham down the street rocking a crucifix. it's a material thing: most likely plastic- and before it was shaped into whatever symbol you find to be meaningful it was a puddle of oil.. who cares? it's just a thing. that you find it meaningful doesn't change that.
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hold on while i google rosarie
Actually, I don't care if I offend a christian. Y'all are the white people of religion.
god shut up
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i always like to check the bottom of religious paraphernalia to see where it was made. statues of mary, rosaries, whatever almost always are made in china. does the fact that non-christians working for a few cents on an assembly line are making these things bother you? that to me seems like a bigger deal than billy broham down the street rocking a crucifix. it's a material thing: most likely plastic- and before it was shaped into whatever symbol you find to be meaningful it was a puddle of oil.. who cares? it's just a thing. that you find it meaningful doesn't change that.
actually, its been proven by fox news that god only loves americans.
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I agree with Gay-train, the only religious imagery allowed on skate gear should be pentagrams and inverted crosses.
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to clear a couple things up, i'm not shaken by it. I'm still going to pray the rosary. it doesn't change the way I worship, and my beliefs will stay the same.
Why would it bother me? think about this - Some jews are not even allowed to say the name of their God. they have to use another name. that's how sacred God is to them. there's a scripture verse that says "At the name of God every knee shall bend" Although it might be just a crazy idea to believe in God to some of you posters on here, God is real to me. and think about muslims, why would the holy nation of islam go nuts if an image of their God or even their prophet was made for a reason other than worship? because its sacred to them. they hold their beliefs in their heart and defend them with everything they have, and I admire that. They believe what they believe and they stand up for it at whatever cost. Of course some have misinterpretted teachings and taken things too far, but so have christians. My point is that I hate to see something that represents something sacred to me become the puka shells of 2007.
And no, i'm not "stoked" that the word's getting out. first, the word's been out for over 2,000 years and second, I highly doubt anyone is going to become a catholic after seeing someone wearing a rosary around their neck.
oh and cuddlemonster, not that i approve of either mass production of religoius symbols or sweatshop labor, you have to be hella cynical to think that china = sweatshop. yes there are a lot of unethically run manufacturing plants in china but to blanket statement like that is ignorant. speaking of ignorant to think that not knowing what a rosary is would offend the "white people of religion" is ridiculous when whites represent less than half of the catholic church.
and yes that is one of the diamond shirts im talking about.
alex you bring up an interesting point - let me explain. recently chocolate ran a deck, im pretty sure it was a chico brenes (i was in nicaragua when i saw it and this kid mario got it from chico, and there is a hispanic - catholic connection in case you havent noticed) that was what i would call a holy card featuring st. joseph of cupertino. this i didn't have a problem with and let me tell you why. cause the way they did it was more like paying an homage to these saints (i just googled it and found the series, i really like them actually) instead of using them and banalizing them.
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humans are so fucked up, i doubt bears and lizards would buy into that bullshit
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J-Train, some of the things you just said sparked a thought that I've had before while in the company of people that I was told to be a "certain way" around because the people in question were very religious, and may possibly be extremely sensitive to certain topics of conversation, or the way those topics were presented.
That got me to wondering... should people treat the religious like most thoughtful people treat the handicapped? I'm not saying religion in general is a handicap (though I do know of some instances where I would say that), nor am I trying to say that the religious are regular or anything... what I'm asking is if more secular people should treat the religious with kid-gloves or be especially politically correct or something.
I mean, I can relate to a certain level of sensitivity when it comes to race, sexual orientation, or some other natural human condition that people have and are persecuted (or mistreated) over... but I can't relate to that when it comes to someone's willful, conscious choice.
You made a sort of skateboard analogy earlier, but I'd like to offer up a different one:
I sincerely love skateboarding more than anything I've ever loved. For over 22 years now, I've had an overwhelming obsession with it.
I grew up, was raised, and was a devout Christian for a large part of my life, but when I look at myself now, and my relationship with skateboarding, I can say that I'm more of a skateboarder than I ever was a religionist (and I was pretty fucking religious). Some could even equate my attempts at skateboard activism (on local and larger scale levels) as a religious fundamentalism.
Keeping this in mind... my cult like devotion to skateboarding... I don't get offended when I get busted from a spot. I don't like it, but I don't take it personal because I know that not everyone shares the value of skateboarding that I have. Some people (overzealous cops for example), even despise what I do... but I'm not offended by that either. It's just another thing that makes me a skateboarder, and them not a skateboarder. I made my choice to skate, and non skaters didn't. It has no effect on my skateboarding, and it's nothing I ever dwell on, even though hatred or unfairness may present itself to me every time I skate private property.
That's a really fucking stretched thin analogy I just wrote there, by the way. I think I almost broke it.
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grim, i would say its less an issue of kid gloves and more an issue of respect. and i think respect is due to those of every race, every sexual orientation, and every religion. and of course to those with disabilities. I'm not saying that rosaries should be outlawed among non-catholics, I'm just saying I find it disrespectful.
with your analogy, a main point to consider would be the fact that those people who kick you out are more often than not doing what they have to do. you're pursuing leisure, they're working. while they may disagree with you and even disrespect you, their reason for opposing you is because they have to survive. like you said, its a stretch. but i see your point. i can only respond by saying that religions, simply for the fact that they mean so much to certain people, should not be mocked, trivialized, or insulted. It's consideration. Ever said the word "regular" around someone who has a disabled sibling? I can guarantee you they'll find it offensive. It's because they have a personal relationship with that sibling. And those who consider themselves religious will tell you they have a personal relationship with God. thats all it comes down to, just being considerate. someone said earlier "kindness is my religion" well that's this is about.
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grim, i would say its less an issue of kid gloves and more an issue of respect. and i think respect is due to those of every race, every sexual orientation, and every religion. and of course to those with disabilities.
Ah, but this is one of the things I'm talking about... race, sexual orientation, disabilities and the like are part of the human condition despite the wishes of the person who has those traits, whereas religiosity is a choice... I'm not about to make a case saying it's ok to be disrespectful to the religious, as that would just be an asshole thing to do, but I would argue that the only way to respect religion (at least the flavors of Christianity that I come across) would be by partaking in the faith. I mean, according to a large swath of Christianity, by not believing in God or Jesus, then I'm doomed to an eternity of damnation... a notion that I find not only absurd, but fairy tail-ish. But by saying that, some religious folks might say I'm disrespecting them, which I'm not. I simply don't respect the religion. I respect people, including religious people, but I don't have any respect for religion that would refer to me as a sheep in a flock, or in my case, attempt to dictate that I'm a sinner on Lucifer's earth, destined for an eternity in either a lake of fire or in seclusion from a God that made everything.
I'm not saying that rosaries should be outlawed among non-catholics, I'm just saying I find it disrespectful.
If someone was fucking with your rosary, I could see getting a bit offended... but who is really getting disrespected if they're doing something with one of their own? I mean, to some people, it's just a necklace. Yours is a device for prayer. If it's upsetting to God, he'll handle that shit, right?
with your analogy, a main point to consider would be the fact that those people who kick you out are more often than not doing what they have to do. you're pursuing leisure, they're working. while they may disagree with you and even disrespect you, their reason for opposing you is because they have to survive. like you said, its a stretch. but i see your point. i can only respond by saying that religions, simply for the fact that they mean so much to certain people, should not be mocked, trivialized, or insulted. It's consideration. Ever said the word "regular" around someone who has a disabled sibling? I can guarantee you they'll find it offensive. It's because they have a personal relationship with that sibling. And those who consider themselves religious will tell you they have a personal relationship with God. thats all it comes down to, just being considerate. someone said earlier "kindness is my religion" well that's this is about.
I can dig a lot of what you're saying, but I have to ask this... if someone has a religious dictate that states "1+1=3", do I have to respect that just because that's something they're convinced is the truth?
Please don't get me wrong on what I'm saying... I'm not ragging on you at all, I respect the fact that you have a religious belief system... I just have no respect for religion itself. Since religion is mostly a set of instructions and rules, the only way to respect them would be to abide by them, in the same way we can selectively respect or not respect the law.
/tipsy
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why are people wearing rosaries as the latest piece of flair? I've seen them on bam, robin thicke, random dudes with the turn of the century elizabethean style going on, rasta looking dudes (which really doesn't make sense), guys who wear T-shirts over dress shirts, and now diamond's got two new shirts with rosaries on it. I don't mean to be a hater but as a catholic who actually prays the rosary it really trivializes a prayer that has made a big difference in my life, and seeing people throw it on to up their style points comes off as hella disrespectful to me. what's next, yarmulkes instead of new eras? well... i can't complain that much seeing how clothing companies have tried to turn the rastafarian religion into a marketing tool. There's a line there... its hard to say what's respectful and promotes vs what's bogus and cheapens.
ARGGGGHH.. THEY DON'T GROW HAIR ON YOUR CHEST. I DON'T BACK THIS FRUITY SHIT!
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I was raised Mormon, and as soon as I was able to develop rudimentary critical thinking I rejected all of it. I sometimes wonder if I would still be a believer if I had been raised with a more balanced/moderate brand of Christianity. But, like, I also wonder what it would have been like if I'd been raised Muslim or Krishna.
I currently live with 4 other Christians, and things can get awkward. When we start drinking and having religious debates, I have to be very careful to not get offensive and/or reveal what I really think. I definitely relate to the treating Christian like they have some sort of handicap, but I think Christians feel that way about atheists, it's a natural human arrogance that you develop when you feel strongly about something.
Also, I don't think belief is a conscious choice. Like, I didn't choose to stop believing that Christ was my savior and that God told Joseph Smith to get as many wives as possible. I just didn't believe it. And I feel that the same is true for people of faith. I don't agree with them, and I think religion is a falsehood that has been and continues to be significantly destructive to humanity, but I don't for a second think that anyone could just turn off their beliefs.
Ughh, I'm sorry, I severely tired and mildly drunk. I can't organize my thoughts very well, and I apologize if I'm making no coherent points.
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jesus rips.
(http://a670.ac-images.myspacecdn.com/images01/34/l_0811653373e101afc85e8dc0838777c5.jpg)
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I really don't want to be late to this party... J, you know where I can score some sick beads?
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If someone was fucking with your rosary, I could see getting a bit offended... but who is really getting disrespected if they're doing something with one of their own? I mean, to some people, it's just a necklace. Yours is a device for prayer. If it's upsetting to God, he'll handle that shit, right?
I can dig a lot of what you're saying, but I have to ask this... if someone has a religious dictate that states "1+1=3", do I have to respect that just because that's something they're convinced is the truth?
Please don't get me wrong on what I'm saying... I'm not ragging on you at all, I respect the fact that you have a religious belief system... I just have no respect for religion itself. Since religion is mostly a set of instructions and rules, the only way to respect them would be to abide by them, in the same way we can selectively respect or not respect the law.
/tipsy
yeah, its true, wearing rosaries as flair isn't that offensive - especially when compared to insults, jokes, and blatant lies about the catholic church. And like you said God will handle that, yes, we believe God will do justice (But I tell you that every careless word that people speak, they shall give an accounting for it in the day of judgment - Matthew 12:36). Ideally, christians should warn people to be respectful of God without letting their anger speak for them. It's difficult and rare that christians do this completely out of love.
You don't have to respect what the religion teaches, like you said "i respect the fact that you have a religious belief system" is all I can ask for. i dont respect athiesm, but i respect athiests - which means I will take things into consideration before saying somethign like "how can you NOT believe in God? that's crazy!" i mean everyone thinks what they believe is right. otherwise they wouldn't believe it. you think my faith is 1 + 1 = 3, and I think the same of what you believe. theres no getting around that, so its more an issue of trying to see where they're coming from. do unto others as you would have them do unto you.
oh and jesus wouldn't be rockin that kind of weak angle on a boardslide
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And like you said God will handle that, yes, we believe God will do justice
do unto others as you would have them do unto you.
so when we are all burning enterally for disrespecting god by not believing that some jewish guy from 2000 years ago was his son and not just another preacher with a god complex, does that mean that you can or can't think it's funny?
and if I told you it was predestiny for guys like me and grim, would you feel at all bad about us get tourchered without having a fair chance at salvation?
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jesus rips.
(http://a670.ac-images.myspacecdn.com/images01/34/l_0811653373e101afc85e8dc0838777c5.jpg)
jesus on adidas? accels?
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I called christians "the white people of religion," not because their skin is white, but because compared to members of every other religion, they have not experienced any hardship or persecution, and are consistently in the majority of the population. Yet, they still act like the whole world is out to get and oppress them. Its annoying. Why are you offended? When was the last time a Christian was killed for being a Christian? When was the last large oppression of Christians? When was the last time you felt uncomfortable because you are christian? This shit doesn't happen, and if it does its on a much smaller scale than has occured to Jews, Muslims, Buddhists, etc. The only time that shit happens is when they go to foreign places and push their shit on people with different beliefs in "missions." Is there an equivalent to the swastika for Christians? Don't say an upside down cross because that is just a symbol of oppositional belief, not the idea that you hate christians and support the idea of killing them all. You guys are in the majority. When december comes around I get stupid Christmas ads, movies, sales, and decorations shoved down my throat. Is there any other holiday that another religion has that gets shoved down your throat? No. Y'all are so comfortable that if somebody wheres some symbol around their neck you get all offended. Don't. Just get over it, and keep moving on happily, knowing that nobody will ever find out what your religion is and suddenly become all awkward and uncomfortable around you. I'm teaching a class right now where a kid asked me "Are you a jew?" I said "Yeah, is there something wrong with that?" He simply said, "Yeah." Now kids see me walking down the hall and scream shit like "JEW!" and "SHALOM!" hatefully. That ever happen to you for being christian? Probably not. So quit whining, bitch.
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in all fairness, the Romans persecuted the shit of the Christians
Religion was very important to the Romans. Within the Roman Empire, Christianity was banned and Christians were punished for many years. Feeding Christians to the lions was seen as entertainment in Ancient Rome.
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About 2000 years ago. When they were first starting up. And they act like it makes up for all the persecution and crusades they've gone on since.
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www.zeitgeistmovie.com (http://www.zeitgeistmovie.com)
this about sums it up.
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i dont respect athiesm, but i respect athiests -
I hate to nit pick, but I just wanted to point out that atheism isn't something I believe in (you mention belief in the next quote)... it's a void. It's just a word use to quickly state that I don't have belief (theologically, that is). I'd venture to guess that you and I are probably very similar in what we do believe in... I'm pretty sure I'd be defined as a humanist, and I think most people with empathy and compassion are humanists, by nature. Some are secular, some others practice humanism under the name of a faith.
which means I will take things into consideration before saying somethign like "how can you NOT believe in God? that's crazy!" i mean everyone thinks what they believe is right.
I know you're not really asking, but that's a question I get a lot and I really like answering it...
You know how you feel (or don't feel) about Thor, Ra, or Shiva? I feel the same way. You and I are just a trinity away from sharing the same basic theology.
otherwise they wouldn't believe it. you think my faith is 1 + 1 = 3, and I think the same of what you believe. theres no getting around that, so its more an issue of trying to see where they're coming from. do unto others as you would have them do unto you.
I'd be down for a discussion. I just dig theology debates.
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(http://sanchezkisser.com/images/zjly-web_print.jpg)
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I called christians "the white people of religion," not because their skin is white, but because compared to members of every other religion, they have not experienced any hardship or persecution, and are consistently in the majority of the population. Yet, they still act like the whole world is out to get and oppress them. Its annoying. Why are you offended? When was the last time a Christian was killed for being a Christian? When was the last large oppression of Christians? When was the last time you felt uncomfortable because you are christian? This shit doesn't happen, and if it does its on a much smaller scale than has occured to Jews, Muslims, Buddhists, etc. The only time that shit happens is when they go to foreign places and push their shit on people with different beliefs in "missions." Is there an equivalent to the swastika for Christians? Don't say an upside down cross because that is just a symbol of oppositional belief, not the idea that you hate christians and support the idea of killing them all. You guys are in the majority. When december comes around I get stupid Christmas ads, movies, sales, and decorations shoved down my throat. Is there any other holiday that another religion has that gets shoved down your throat? No. Y'all are so comfortable that if somebody wheres some symbol around their neck you get all offended. Don't. Just get over it, and keep moving on happily, knowing that nobody will ever find out what your religion is and suddenly become all awkward and uncomfortable around you. I'm teaching a class right now where a kid asked me "Are you a jew?" I said "Yeah, is there something wrong with that?" He simply said, "Yeah." Now kids see me walking down the hall and scream shit like "JEW!" and "SHALOM!" hatefully. That ever happen to you for being christian? Probably not. So quit whining, bitch.
theo, don't get me wrong. I never said anything about how christians have it harder than jews. you were the one who said you have no problem offending a christian. I have a problem with offending a jew. If I got you right, you have no problem offending a religious group provided that they are relatively popular. I understand that you've been persecuted for what you believe, but to then say that you have no problem offending someone of another creed just because they haven't been offended as much as you comes across as very childish.
When people take the Lord's name in vain, I tell them I find that hella disrectful because of my beliefs. I hope you would do the same, because its not whining, its taking a stand for what you believe. and you'd be a bitch to do otherwise.
oh, and in answer to your question about when the last time a christian was killed for being a christian, take a look at what's going on (and has been going on for a long time) in china. I know that's on the whole other side of the planet but we all live in the same world. http://chinaaid.org/persecution/
grim, my uncle george (RIP) was a catholic priest when he met my aunt loiuse. He married her and became a humanist.
When I said "how can you not.." I meant I wouldn't say it in an insulting way, like you're an idiot if you don't believe in God. I also enjoy a good theological debate, but i always have a tough time seeing as how the catholic church has had so many problems throughout the years. When I was in nicaragua I met my first openly athiest friend (which is strange, because nicaragua is largely catholic) but he had been raised in california. he said he never really thought about it, him and his friends just never thought a supreme being existed. in a lot of ways i could relate to him better than some of my religious friends just because he questioned everything.
and to address sleazy,
no, I will not laugh if you end up in hell. a huge part of my faith is to love your neighbor, and it isn't very loving to laugh at your neighbor's misfortune.
and i believe God is just so he will make sure at some point you will have a chance at salvation - the free will vs. predestination debate is a whole nother topic that is incredibly confusing. to sum it up, my belief is that God knows the future, but he does not force you to do anything. He simply knows beforehand what you will do, because he's all-knowing.
on another note, the past two days of skating were basically the best ever. i wish fall would never end. I haven't had to deal with a winter in 3 years but this time i'll be in st. paul for the whole thing. ugh
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when's everybody gonna admit that they just worship the sun?
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jesus rips.
(http://a670.ac-images.myspacecdn.com/images01/34/l_0811653373e101afc85e8dc0838777c5.jpg)
jesus on adidas? accels?
savier is gonna come back with jc as the only pro.
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you are so fucking gnar'd.
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apparently they make great anal beads, that could be why.
why are people wearing rosaries as the latest piece of flair? I've seen them on bam, robin thicke, random dudes with the turn of the century elizabethean style going on, rasta looking dudes (which really doesn't make sense), guys who wear T-shirts over dress shirts, and now diamond's got two new shirts with rosaries on it. I don't mean to be a hater but as a catholic who actually prays the rosary it really trivializes a prayer that has made a big difference in my life, and seeing people throw it on to up their style points comes off as hella disrespectful to me. what's next, yarmulkes instead of new eras? well... i can't complain that much seeing how clothing companies have tried to turn the rastafarian religion into a marketing tool. There's a line there... its hard to say what's respectful and promotes vs what's bogus and cheapens.
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People always rocked crucifixes for whatever reason since forever, those Buddhist rosaries were popular a while ago and so was that Kaballah red string or whatever it was, rappers might still be wearing gold/platinum iced out Jesus faces. Get over it and move on. It's this offended holier than thou attitude that make people dislike 'religious people' because they're all hung up on what other people are doing or not doing.
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why are people wearing rosaries as the latest piece of flair? I've seen them on bam, robin thicke, random dudes with the turn of the century elizabethean style going on, rasta looking dudes (which really doesn't make sense), guys who wear T-shirts over dress shirts, and now diamond's got two new shirts with rosaries on it. I don't mean to be a hater but as a catholic who actually prays the rosary it really trivializes a prayer that has made a big difference in my life, and seeing people throw it on to up their style points comes off as hella disrespectful to me. what's next, yarmulkes instead of new eras? well... i can't complain that much seeing how clothing companies have tried to turn the rastafarian religion into a marketing tool. There's a line there... its hard to say what's respectful and promotes vs what's bogus and cheapens.
this reminds me of a bumper sticker i saw when i was little,
"16,000 children die of starvation daily - why should "God" answer YOUR prayers?"
do you honestly think if god were real he would give a fuck about disrespecting some string?
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^^^ gnar'd
the arrogance of praying always amazes me. with all the shit going on in the world, god's got time to care about your promotion\girl\problems...
please
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China oppresses all religions. No religion in a communist dictatorial state. And J, I'm not just talking about jews, I'm talking about muslims, buddhists, taoists, satanists, basically every religion in the world has it harder than christians do.And its not because of beliefs, its because of who your parents are. The worst thing that happens to christians are that people say "Jesus!" when they are frightened, and occasionally wear your jewlery for fashion rather than religion. Christians have the biggest missionary system in the world too. They go around offering help to people as long as they promise they will follow this garbage. The force their religion on people and oppress with their power system. So cry me a river, some people don't like you.
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the title of this thread is really funny to me for some reason......
I remember a couple of years ago I was wearing this cheap plastic rosary as a belt and this kid who was into hardcore punk music or whatever started getting on my case about it so I pretended that I was seriously into religion and he just talked to me about how bad it was for a whole hour......that was dope....
I guess my opinion would go a long with those who say "the J-train is pretty wack for even caring....."...as for religion as a whole, I couldn't even begin to discuss that stuff....im just not framiliar with it, or smart enough to have good opinions in that area.....
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i enjoyed reading through this thread but im too tired to contribute.
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I remember a couple of years ago I was wearing this cheap plastic rosary as a belt
Wow, that's cutting edge fashion right there.
Myself, I wonder why anybody would even go out of their way to wear a rosary if it meant nothing to them, and if it is a statement against religion then it's a shitty statement, sort of like wearing a Che Guevara shirt at the mall.
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(http://www.grimcity.com/slap/vivala.gif)
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Hehe, Bob Guevara.
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(http://www.grimcity.com/slap/vivala.gif)
Hey man, I just rolled through Hammond on the Amtrak yesterday.
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Rosaries aren't cool.
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No one has to respect anyone's beliefs attitudes or opinions.
That's pure nonsense.
However they do have to respect the person's right to practice them, in anyway they see fit as long as it's not infringing on anyone else's rights.
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^^^ gnar'd
the arrogance of praying always amazes me. with all the shit going on in the world, god's got time to care about your promotion\girl\problems...
please
"
everyone who prays to God believes that God, as creator of all, is above time. don't take your bumper sticker logic too seriously.
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I remember a couple of years ago I was wearing this cheap plastic rosary as a belt
Wow, that's cutting edge fashion right there.
Myself, I wonder why anybody would even go out of their way to wear a rosary if it meant nothing to them, and if it is a statement against religion then it's a shitty statement, sort of like wearing a Che Guevara shirt at the mall.
eh well I found it on the ground and didn't have a belt........i think it was nearly five years ago anyways......
i see loads of kids in che guevara shirts in the mall.........it always seems like half of the peole don't have any idea why they are wearing it........i dont know much about the guy but uh.........yeah, it would be like me wearing the che guveera shirt......i guess it would be peer pressure that made me (or them) do it or something like that.......
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you fit a rosary around your waist? ITS A MIRACLE FROM GOD!!!!1
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(http://www.grimcity.com/slap/vivala.gif)
Hey man, I just rolled through Hammond on the Amtrak yesterday.
Rolling to or from Chicago?
I bet that's the smallest train station you've ever seen, heh?
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^^^ gnar'd
the arrogance of praying always amazes me. with all the shit going on in the world, god's got time to care about your promotion\girl\problems...
please
everyone who prays to God believes that God, as creator of all, is above time. don't take your bumper sticker logic too seriously.
can you explain what "above time" means? i'm not familiar with that concept.
has it really never occurred to you that if there is a creator out there, that he might not give a shit about a bunch of parasites floating on a tiny rock in space? did you ever stop to consider why we are so special? so many animals on the earth but we're the only ones with souls? if there's intelligent life elsewhere in the universe, again, not so special, sorry no souls for you either... can you point to anything but human arrogance that would explain this? i mean our arrogance had us thinking that the universe revolved around us until it was proven otherwise, can't you see that it's the same human arrogance that still has some faiths believing that the universe revolves around us. but it takes it even further to suggest that it revolves around the individual too, that the creator of the universe actually cares about each one of us and how we run our lives.
and once you work that mess out can you then explain why after putting all this effort into tracking our every movement and action the only thing that this deity really cares about is that we believe that he had a son that was on earth? this makes sense too you? morality by subscription to belief, that's a moral standard that you feel good about standing behind? the idea of piety being an independent idea from deity doesn't seem like a good thing too you? you stand by torturing people for not believing in hard to believe things? that's a morally sound position too you? why even wait? if it's not wrong to torture people for not believing, do you stand by doing it before death? if not, then why not, it's not immoral if they don't believe, fuck em?
i'm actually amazed that more people don't have a problem with the torture aspects of their faith, but hey, if you can get behind that then good for you. maybe you'll be right and get the last laugh while i get tortured for not believing.
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This is why theological debates are pointless. A rational person will come up with a rational argument that makes sense and seems to be pretty impossible to dispute, then the religious person will come back with some stupid non-sequitor point that points the debate away from the question. Then the non-sequitor gets debated, but its framed as something that can be interpreted in any way and is "deep." Trying to convince somebody to believe or not to believe in any deity is a waste of breath.
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ahahhaha i just remembered half you guys bought into religion AHHHHHHHHHAHAHHAHAHAHAHHAHA
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I'm considering going as Jesus for halloween but I don't want to get my ass kicked by Nortenos.
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this article sums it up pretty well...
A God With Whom I Am Not Familiar
By Tim Wise
This is an open letter to the man sitting behind me at La Paz today, in Nashville, at lunchtime, with the Brooks Brothers shirt:
You don't know me. But I know you.
I watched you as you held hands with your tablemates at the restaurant where we both ate this afternoon. I listened as you prayed, and thanked God for the food you were about to eat, and for your own safety, several hundred miles away from the unfolding catastrophe in New Orleans.
You blessed your chimichanga in the name of Jesus Christ, and then proceeded to spend the better part of your meal and mine, since I was too near your table to avoid hearing every word morally scolding the people of that devastated city, heaping scorn on them for not heeding the warnings to leave before disaster struck. Then you attacked them all of them, without distinction it seemed for the behavior of a relative handful: those who have looted items like guns, or big screen TVs.
I heard you ask, amid the din of your colleagues "Amens," why it was that instead of pitching in to help their fellow Americans, the people of New Orleans instead again, all of them in your mind choose to steal and shoot at relief helicopters.
I watched you wipe salsa from the corners of your mouth, as you nodded agreement to the statement of one of your friends, sitting to your right, her hair neatly coiffed, her makeup flawless, her jewelry sparkling. When you asked, rhetorically, why it was that people were so much more decent amid the tragedy of 9-11, as compared to the aftermath of Katrina, she had offered her response, but only after apologizing for what she admitted was going to sound harsh.
"Well," Buffy explained. "It's probably because in New Orleans, it seems to be mostly poor people, and you know, they just don't have the same regard."
She then added that police should shoot the looters, and should have done so from the beginning, so as to send a message to the rest that theft would not be tolerated. You, who had just thanked Jesus for your chips and guacamole, said you agreed. They should be shot. Praise the Lord.
Your God is one with whom I am not familiar.
Two thoughts.
First, it is a very fortunate thing for you, and likely for me, that my two young children were with me as I sat there, choking back fish tacos and my own seething rage, listening to you pontificate about shit you know nothing about.
Have you ever even been to New Orleans?
And no, by that I don't mean the New Orleans of your company's sales conference. I don't mean Emeril's New Orleans, or the New Orleans of Uptown Mardi Gras parties.
I mean the New Orleans that is buried as if it were Atlantis, in places like the lower 9th ward: 98 percent black, 40 percent poor, where bodies are floating down the street, flowing with the water as it seeks its own level. Have you met the people from that New Orleans? The New Orleans that is dying as I write this, and as you order another sweet tea?
I didn't think so.
Your God the one to whom you prayed today, and likely do before every meal, because this gesture proves what a good Christian you are is one with whom I am not familiar.
Your God is one who you sincerely believe gives a flying fuck about your lunch. Your God is one who you seem to believe watches over you and blesses you, and brings good tidings your way, while simultaneously letting thousands of people watch their homes be destroyed, and perhaps ten thousand or more die, many of them in the streets for lack of water or food.
Did you ever stop to think just what a rancid asshole such a God would have to be, such that he would take care of the likes of you, while letting babies die in their mother's arms, and old people in wheelchairs, at the foot of Canal Street?
Your God is one with whom I am not familiar.
But no, it isn't God who's the asshole here, Skip (or Brad, or Braxton, or whatever your name is).
God doesn't feed you, and it isn't God that kept me from turning around and beating your lily white privileged ass today either.
God has nothing to do with it.
God doesn't care who wins the Super Bowl.
God doesn't help anyone win an Academy Award.
God didn't get you your last raise, or your SUV.
And if God is even half as tired as I am of having to listen to self-righteous bastards like you blame the victims of this nightmare for their fate, then you had best eat slowly from this point forward.
Why didn't they evacuate like they were told?
Are you serious?
There were 100,000 people in that city without cars. Folks who are too poor to own their own vehicle, and who rely on public transportation every day. I know this might shock you. They don't have a Hummer2, or whatever gas-guzzling piece of crap you either already own or probably are saving up for.
And no, they didn't just choose not to own a car because the buses are so gosh-darned efficient and great, as Rush Limbaugh implied, and as you likely heard, since you're the kind of person who hangs on the every word of such bloviating hacks as these.
Why did they loot?
Are you serious?
People are dying, in the streets, on live television. Fathers and mothers are watching their baby's eyes bulge in their skulls from dehydration, and you are begrudging them some Goddamned candy bars, diapers and water?
If anything the poor of New Orleans have exercised restraint.
Maybe you didn't know it, but the people of that city with whom you likely identify the wealthy white folks of Uptown were barely touched by this storm. Yeah, I guess God was watching over them: protecting them, and rewarding them for their faith and superior morality. If the folks downtown who are waiting desperately for their government to send help a government whose resources have been stretched thin by a war that I'm sure you support, because you love freedom and democracy were half as crazed as you think, they'd have marched down St. Charles Avenue and burned every mansion in sight. That they didnt suggests a decency and compassion for their fellow man and woman that sadly people like you lack.
Can you even imagine what you would do in their place?
Can you imagine what would happen if it were well-off white folks stranded without buses to get them out, without nourishment, without hope?
Putting aside the absurdity of the imagery--after all, such folks always have the means to seek safety, or the money to rebuild, or the political significance to ensure a much speedier response for their concerns can you just imagine?
Can you imagine what would happen if the pampered, overfed corporate class, which complains about taxes taking a third of their bloated incomes, had to sit in the hot sun for four, going on five days? Without a Margarita or hotel swimming pool to comfort them I mean?
Oh, and please, I know. I'm stereotyping you. Imagine that. I've assumed, based only on your words, what kind of person you are, even though I suppose I could be wrong. How does that feel Biff? Hurt your feelings? So sorry. But hey, at least my stereotypes of you aren't deadly. They won't effect your life one bit, unlike the ones you carry around with you and display within earshot of people like me, supposing that no one could possibly disagree.
But I'm not wrong, am I Chip? I know you. I see people like you all the time, in airports, in business suits, on their lunch breaks. People who will take advantage of any opportunity to ratify and reify their pre-existing prejudices towards the poor, towards black folks. You see the same three video loops of the same dozen or so looters on Fox News and you conclude that poor black people are crazy, immoral, criminal.
You, or others quite a bit like you, are the ones posting messages on chat room boards, calling looters sub-human "vermin," "scum," or "cockroaches." I heard you use the word "animals" three times today: you and that woman across from you what was her name? Skyler?
What was it you said as you scooped the last bite of black beans and rice into your eager mouth? Like zoo animals? Yes, I think that was it.
Well Chuck, it's a free country, and so you certainly have the right I suppose to continue lecturing the poor, in between checking your Blackberry and dropping the kids off at soccer practice. If you want to believe that the poor of New Orleans are immoral and greedy, and unworthy of support at a time like this or somehow more in need of your scolding than whatever donation you might make to a relief fund so be it.
But let's leave God out of it, shall we? All of it.
Your God is one with whom I am not familiar, and I'd prefer to keep it that way.
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I'm considering going as Jesus for halloween but I don't want to get my ass kicked by Nortenos.
http://www.tmz.com/2007/10/28/warning-bin-laden-costume-not-a-crowd-pleaser/ (http://www.tmz.com/2007/10/28/warning-bin-laden-costume-not-a-crowd-pleaser/)
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rosaries aren't cool, i went to a catholic elementary and high school and, that was a lot of fucking prayers
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I'm considering going as Jesus for halloween but I don't want to get my ass kicked by Nortenos.
http://www.tmz.com/2007/10/28/warning-bin-laden-costume-not-a-crowd-pleaser/ (http://www.tmz.com/2007/10/28/warning-bin-laden-costume-not-a-crowd-pleaser/)
did the guy get beat down or something? seemed like the clip skipped. either way that's fucked. people need to get a sense of humor
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I'm not that worried about it, but I might go to this celebration downtown that has a history of stabbings, but I don't know who usually does the stabbing, it may just be meth heads or something. I got the idea for the costume because people used to call me Jesus a lot since I had long hair and a beard. Anyways, I have short hair now, with a beard still, so I think I'm going to go as moses instead, because I'm too cheap to buy a wig.