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Skateboarding => USELESS WOODEN TOY BANTER => Topic started by: Elderly Gentleman on August 28, 2018, 12:55:14 PM
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http://www.jenkemmag.com/home/2018/08/28/skateboarders-worried-cte/
I read this article and it really got me to thinking about how "uncool" it is in skating to wear a helmet. I know Mike V made the commitment to wear a helmet every time he skates back in 2015, but he's not exactly the most relevant skater nowadays.
I wear a helmet a lot when I skate (mostly because it's required at the park that I most frequently skate at). After a while, I found one that was pretty comfortable (it did take some getting used to though).
If a helmet company put out a skate video where all the skaters wore helmets the whole time (street skating as well as transition) would you even bother watching it? Even it they were ripping?
I'm old so my opinion on it isn't relevant and would never affect the opinion of the younger generation so I wanted to get other people's views on it.
What if a major brand agreed to pay their skaters higher salaries and gave them full medical but required all of their skaters to wear a helmet whenever they skated; would they be kooked out of the industry? Probably. Just wanted to hear some opinions on it.
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I thought the more you hurt yourself the more "core" you are.
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I could watch Vert/ Park skaters wearing helmets and it wouldn't bother me a bit.
As far as street skating goes - if Pros feel like they need a helmet to do a street trick they shouldn't be doing the trick. I don't care if the whole massive stairs/ rails thing goes away either. It's basically been done anyway.
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olympics 101
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I'm with Ed on this one, until say Nyjah has an incident CTE related then maybe changes will happen. Only the big corpo boys might help with medical bills or some type of insurance,but thats a reach. Any skater making enough should get insurance,I have it and hate paying for it,but it has come in handy with lowering the cost on what could have been very expensive medical bills
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I was gonna post the gif of that kid doing a pop-shuv at Pulaski, in a helmet, and leave it at that but then I actually read the article and while I wouldn't necessarily want to see a ton of helmet heavy footage, the discussion concerning CTE is definitely something that, as per this article, hopefully continues and gets explored more.
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A lot of the real bad issues with the NFL players don't arise until later in life like early onset dementia and stuff. I'd imagine some of the big rail/transition/vert guys get concussed as much as some NFL players, maybe not the same kind of repetitive minor hits that football players experience throughout practice and games every week.
The gnar street skating used to be the only thing that got me really hyped as a kid but as I get older the more and more I appreciate watching low impact stuff. Some people get real hyped when an aging pro puts out footage doing the same tricks he used to do on spots almost as big as the ones he used to do them on, but I think it's almost sad in a way. Like you should age gracefully and learn to skate mini ramps or curbs or something.
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I could watch Vert/ Park skaters wearing helmets and it wouldn't bother me a bit.
As far as street skating goes - if Pros feel like they need a helmet to do a street trick they shouldn't be doing the trick. I don't care if the whole massive stairs/ rails thing goes away either. It's basically been done anyway.
I get what you're saying and I can certainly agree with that. If they're doing ledge tricks or flatground or just ollieing over stuff at normal speed then a helmet does seem a bit excessive. I wouldn't be bummed if someone was wearing a helmet doing tre flips down a 15 stair though. But I also agree with you on the massive drop stuff. I'm kind of over all that too and it doesn't get me hyped to skate at all.
I get way more hyped to skate watch someone doing some cool tech ledge or flatbar tricks and some cool mini ramp tricks than I ever have watching someone huck themselves down a 12 stair.
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I'm sure no one here gives helmet-less street skating a second thought, but does anyone else feel weird when you see people skating big, concrete transition totally padless? Unless they're super good at falling and stuff, dudes like Pedro Barros, Ben Raybourn, Willy Lara etc. must take ridiculous hits
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Helmets don't prevent CTE. They just trick you into thinking it's OK to hit your head. Turns out it's not.
Basically, if you aren't comfortable doing a trick without a helmet, you shouldn't do it with a helmet either.
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taking repeated hits to the head even WITH a helmet will get you CTE. NFL helmets are probably 10X as strong as a skateboard helmet and the problem is prevalent. Pretty sure they're not even rated, like I'm sure a football helmet or motorcycle helmet is.
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I can't even skate with a hat on so a helmet is out of the question
I have had several concussions (not all skate related) and am fairly certain I'm going to be out of my gourd later in life
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luckily i've never hit my head skateboarding. i agree with shylow, just skate within your ability and don't try stupid shit.
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A lot of the real bad issues with the NFL players don't arise until later in life like early onset dementia and stuff. I'd imagine some of the big rail/transition/vert guys get concussed as much as some NFL players, maybe not the same kind of repetitive minor hits that football players experience throughout practice and games every week.
The gnar street skating used to be the only thing that got me really hyped as a kid but as I get older the more and more I appreciate watching low impact stuff. Some people get real hyped when an aging pro puts out footage doing the same tricks he used to do on spots almost as big as the ones he used to do them on, but I think it's almost sad in a way. Like you should age gracefully and learn to skate mini ramps or curbs or something.
http://youtu.be/GrEEhvJGTC0 (http://youtu.be/GrEEhvJGTC0)
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I thought the more you hurt yourself the more "core" you are.
I'm so core I can't skate.
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https://www.instagram.com/p/Bm1j9gOHBrB/?taken-by=killerpizza
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It's weird because i never wear one skateboarding, but snowboarding i wear it pretty often unless its street or DIY shit.
The difference for me is being able to kick your board away and learning how to bail properly, where snowboarding you have your feet locked into your board.
I was doing cab 2 frontboard and i caught my heel edge on the rail and flew backwards and smashed my head on the hard ass snow. Wouldn't catch me trying that on a skateboard tho lol
basically skateboarding has this art of bailing properly which makes helmets almost pointless unless you're sending it.
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ok, i am fucked.
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I'm sure no one here gives helmet-less street skating a second thought, but does anyone else feel weird when you see people skating big, concrete transition totally padless? Unless they're super good at falling and stuff, dudes like Pedro Barros, Ben Raybourn, Willy Lara etc. must take ridiculous hits
That shit freaks me out too but I am admittedly old. I can see how butt sliding versus knee sliding could allow you to preserve your knees longer but I can't say that I get more stoked on tranny tricks that are padless vs padded. Maybe Cards padless 540s but I think that's more because of the spontaneity of the thing. Riley Hawk tried the loop recently with a helmet but no pads and he fell to flat coming out of it. Would anyone have thought less of him if he was wearing full pads?
In response to an earlier comment, some skate helmets are definitely rated ala bike and motorcycle helmets. If you wear one, it will make you look extra weird because they are fucking huge. I think most of the ones people wear aren't rated though.
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I might be getting a bit off topic, but has anyone else here dealt with concussions? I’ve been dealing with post concussion syndrome over the past year as a result of three mTBIs, and it’s been absolutely miserable.
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I had 3 concussions as a young teenager (only one skating) and i have no doubt they affected me longterm
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I've had at least 3 concussions from skating. The 3 for sure ones were with a helmet on. I was having a drink with an old buddy a while back and we were reminiscing about the glory day of skating together in high school. One of my slams came up. He said "I remember that, I had to drive you home" I had to thank him again because before that conversation, I had no idea how I got home that night. It sucks to think about but, between the head bonks and drinking, if i make it to 70, i think my brain might be toast.
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Big segments of skating wear helmets, vert and downhill. Both deal with high speeds, where even a small mistake can mean a broken skull.
And especially in downhill, where it’s more to prevent fatality than concussion, helmet wearing is the opposite, you get treated like a dick for NOT wearing one.
When I first started learning downhill with a crew, that was the first rule. Wear one or ride somewhere else. And they all ‘regular’ skates too, usually without helmets.
I learned it’s necessity, no one likes rushing to a pool of blood around someone’s head because he was too ‘cool’ to wear a bucket. I learned that the hard way when I held a downhill clinic and I wasn’t strict enough with the rules.
He came to, but was fucking sick to my stomach scared that this guy didn’t have someone to check on him and make sure he woke up in the morning. Lots can go wrong with skull injuries.
Bringing this back to street skating, I usually don’t wear one either when I skate ‘normally’, because I’m not going anywhere near as fast and you fall differently because of it.
Now, if I skated like a pro with the speed they are hitting stuff and variables of not locking into grinds and shit? That’s taking your life into your own hands.
Sure, we love to see bravissimo, recklessness, and cheating death, but are we at a point in the size tricks being pulled require us to acknowledge the risk?
Or are we happy to continue to celebrate daredevils?
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I just had a baby, and she's 5 months old. My street skating is always just slappys and curbs so nothing crazy, I've never been a rail chomper, so I mostly ride parks and transition. I fall all the time so I'm probably going to start wearing a helmet, I just need to find a comfortable one. It's not just me anymore, I have a little tiny human relying on me now. It's a weird feeling to have.
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about a decade ago in BMX Mike Aitken almost died when he got in a pretty serious crash without a helmet. It sent shockwaves of awareness through BMX and had a fairly large impact to the point that I rarely see BMX kids at the park without helmets anymore
I would bet in due time skateboarding will have it's own Mike Aitken story.. dudes are just charging 13 foot bowls and shit without any caution. You can only run out of something you see coming.
The older you get, especially with loved ones who rely on you, the less you care about being judged and the more you care about your own self and safety. I wouldn't dare ride a bike without a helmet anymore, but in my early 20s we used to bomb giant hills on our way to and from the bar with no care at all..
That being said, that figgy clip was incredible
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I've only had two concussions and I hope it doesn't turn me into Phelps
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I got one from concussion skating a pole jam, it hurt and I felt just mad lame. Hopefully I'm not fucked from just one, but who knows.
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about a decade ago in BMX Mike Aitken almost died when he got in a pretty serious crash without a helmet. It sent shockwaves of awareness through BMX and had a fairly large impact to the point that I rarely see BMX kids at the park without helmets anymore
I would bet in due time skateboarding will have it's own Mike Aitken story.. dudes are just charging 13 foot bowls and shit without any caution. You can only run out of something you see coming.
The older you get, especially with loved ones who rely on you, the less you care about being judged and the more you care about your own self and safety. I wouldn't dare ride a bike without a helmet anymore, but in my early 20s we used to bomb giant hills on our way to and from the bar with no care at all..
That being said, that figgy clip was incredible
I think Dave Mirra committing suicide and then doctor's confirming he had CTE is also definitely a factor. I see a lot of littles at the skatepark with a helmet too. I started around their age and would have never fucked with a helmet but then that's probably progress.
That Figgy clip is as gold as the full cut he's wearing.
Edited cuz I am stoopid
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Dave Mirra ^
Mat Hoffman is alive and well.. alive.
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Dave Mirra ^
Mat Hoffman is alive and well.. alive.
Thanks. I got confused :(
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The older you get, especially with loved ones who rely on you, the less you care about being judged and the more you care about your own self and safety.
Yeah, this.
I'm just babbling here, but I think there's a level of social conditioning with this as well. Stories of wisdom are never romanticized and told widely because they're basically boring. Stories of redemption and overcoming incredible odds are what people like to hear. And honestly I think we look to fictional characters for inspiration a lot more often than we should. Anyway my point is that it seems like people get sparked off bullshit way too much and make the wrong choices and skateboarding, like everything else, isn't immune to that.
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I see stars when I fall and DO NOT hit my head which is disconcerting. I think my brain is just rattling around or something.
There already have been a few well publicized deaths of skaters who weren't doing anything super "risky" but those have largely been shrugged off (Shokus, Georgie Tsushima, Eric Costello [helmet unbuckled, fell off while rolling in]). Plenty of localized random deaths.
Maybe when a big name goes more people will wear them? Maybe it's like condoms and people would rather accept the risk and feel good in the now?
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I've started wearing a lid more often in bowls/ on bigger tranny but I just can't bring myself to do it for the low-impact type of street skating I do at the age of 43. Most of my head bonks have been due to slipping out or landing badly on transition. Even when I was trying 'big' stuff in the streets, I was able to avoid a head smash. So much of the appeal of skateboarding is the freedom of it being just you, the board and the streets... as dumb as that sounds... But the level of risk these days... its only a matter of time before a high level pro kills/ paralyses themselves...
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im down for people wearing helmets, but personally when i skate a park where a helmet is required i feel like i am going to eat shit because i have that thing on my head.
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Welp, this thread gave me serious anxiety.
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(https://media.giphy.com/media/bQAuAyRPbvCs8/giphy.gif)
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I got a bad concussion a few years ago and it ruined my life. Back truck hung up on a small box and I caught the corner. That’s all it takes sometimes.
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i have hit my head more often being out at
night drinking and shit, than while skating.
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The older you get, especially with loved ones who rely on you, the less you care about being judged and the more you care about your own self and safety.
pretty much. I skate with my 3 yo all the time and I make him wear a helmet so I figure I should lead by example too no?
It's not like I'm impressing anyone with my skating skills at this age anyway, more just out there to have some fun and roll with him
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(https://media.giphy.com/media/bQAuAyRPbvCs8/giphy.gif)
My kinda shit
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You mess with the bull you get the horns.
Also, if you think a helmet is going to stop you from getting a brain injury (it will stop you from cracking your skull or worse, opening that fucker up or having something stick into it) you know jack shit about the brain.
Think of the brain as within a sack of goo, surrounded by a wall of concrete. Smash it hard enough the goo doesn't work as it should, and the brain compacts against the concrete and develops a bruise or worse, bleeds as a result. Impact causes the trauma and acute trauma can be lessened by a helmet.
Funny how the two examples they draw from, BMX riders and football players, both wear helmets.
We better all go back to low-impact freestyle, then we can all die of old age and cancer.
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I've had several concussions (3 in the last year ) all from skating transition, but the one that's probably got me ticking like a time bomb was hitting a car bombing a hill 15 years ago. Back of the head straight to the curb. 4 brain hemorrhages and a year of rehab before I had my life back. I'd better be nice to my kids, they'll probably be full time carers before they can vote haha
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i get some weird schadenfruede enjoyment from the fact helmets don't prevent this. to all the finger wagging nannies, your helmet head ass kid is gonna end up just as regular as hair blowing in the wind jerry gurney.
isn't it ironic?
don't ya think?
also, cheap excuse for gravdiggaz.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e9XwDJdrK80
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Big segments of skating wear helmets, vert and downhill. Both deal with high speeds, where even a small mistake can mean a broken skull.
And especially in downhill, where it’s more to prevent fatality than concussion, helmet wearing is the opposite, you get treated like a dick for NOT wearing one.
When I first started learning downhill with a crew, that was the first rule. Wear one or ride somewhere else. And they all ‘regular’ skates too, usually without helmets.
I learned it’s necessity, no one likes rushing to a pool of blood around someone’s head because he was too ‘cool’ to wear a bucket. I learned that the hard way when I held a downhill clinic and I wasn’t strict enough with the rules.
He came to, but was fucking sick to my stomach scared that this guy didn’t have someone to check on him and make sure he woke up in the morning. Lots can go wrong with skull injuries.
Bringing this back to street skating, I usually don’t wear one either when I skate ‘normally’, because I’m not going anywhere near as fast and you fall differently because of it.
Now, if I skated like a pro with the speed they are hitting stuff and variables of not locking into grinds and shit? That’s taking your life into your own hands.
Sure, we love to see bravissimo, recklessness, and cheating death, but are we at a point in the size tricks being pulled require us to acknowledge the risk?
Or are we happy to continue to celebrate daredevils?
I lost a friend who fell off his skateboard on a hill with no helmet. On a related note, skating while drunk is the worst idea: You not only are more likely to slam, but the blood thinning effect of alcohol can make you hemorrhage if you do.
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I've only had two concussions and I hope it doesn't turn me into Phelps
we're all living our lives in skating desperately hoping we don't become phelps
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I thought the more you hurt yourself the more "core" you are.
Gotta pay to play :'(
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i have hit my head more often being out at
night drinking and shit, than while skating.
Wear a full cut out to the bars.
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I get that it might be a huge problem for some professional skaters, but is it really such a big issue for the average skateboarder? I have been skating for more than 18 years. I have split my head open once and I have had plenty of injuries in my knees and ancles, but I have never had a concussion. None of my skate buddies have ever had a concussion from skating either. I mostly skate parks and street spots, sometimes bigger tranny and ledges and I never wear a helmet. I think generally skating without a helmet is not a problem, unless you skate vert ramps and big bowls or you skate handrails or big gaps.
You might also suffer a freak accident and get concussed doing a 180 on flat, which is as likely to happen as getting concussed, because you are walking down a set of stairs.
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I get that it might be a huge problem for some professional skaters, but is it really such a big issue for the average skateboarder? I have been skating for more than 18 years. I have split my head open once and I have had plenty of injuries in my knees and ancles, but I have never had a concussion. None of my skate buddies have ever had a concussion from skating either. I mostly skate parks and street spots, sometimes bigger tranny and ledges and I never wear a helmet. I think generally skating without a helmet is not a problem, unless you skate vert ramps and big bowls or you skate handrails or big gaps.
You might also suffer a freak accident and get concussed doing a 180 on flat, which is as likely to happen as getting concussed, because you are walking down a set of stairs.
I kinda agree that the avg skater who has at least some sense for risk-assessment probably isn't at much more risk than avg athletes in other activities.
But how did you "split your head open" without being concussed?
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Ive been thinking about this quite a bit lately. About two months back I was at a local park and watched a skilled skateboarder hit his head really badly 50-50ing a foot-high flat bar. His board slipped out under him, both of his feet went behind the bar so that His ankleswere locked into the top of the bar and slingshotted him headfirst into the concrete. Out cold, blood everywhere, came to making horrible morning sounds, eventually getting a ride to the hospital.
Again, this dude was a good skateboarder, who wasn’t doing “stupid shit” he wasn’t “prepared for,” he just got a little to comfy and a perfectly shitty sequence of events had him getting a substantial head injury. I’ve never seen someone that good get hurt that badly on something that small, and it definitely opened my eyes a bit
There’s no logical reason not to wear a helmet on a board. It’s a culture thing, and a lot of outsiders would probably see it as a cultural problem endemic to skateboarding. I’m not saying everyone should/has to wear a helmet, but I do think it’s a conversation worth having, especially once some of our childhood idols start going out like pro wrestlers and football players.
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Ive been thinking about this quite a bit lately. About two months back I was at a local park and watched a skilled skateboarder hit his head really badly 50-50ing a foot-high flat bar. His board slipped out under him, both of his feet went behind the bar so that His ankleswere locked into the top of the bar and slingshotted him headfirst into the concrete. Out cold, blood everywhere, came to making horrible morning sounds, eventually getting a ride to the hospital.
Again, this dude was a good skateboarder, who wasn’t doing “stupid shit” he wasn’t “prepared for,” he just got a little to comfy and a perfectly shitty sequence of events had him getting a substantial head injury. I’ve never seen someone that good get hurt that badly on something that small, and it definitely opened my eyes a bit
There’s no logical reason not to wear a helmet on a board. It’s a culture thing, and a lot of outsiders would probably see it as a cultural problem endemic to skateboarding. I’m not saying everyone should/has to wear a helmet, but I do think it’s a conversation worth having, especially once some of our childhood idols start going out like pro wrestlers and football players.
okay, I'll have this conversation. there's even less of a "logical" reason not to wear a helmet every time you ride in a car, something that causes way more head injuries and death than all the hangups on 3-foot quarterpipes and 20-stair handrails in the world combined. Ask yourself and every other "responsible", "well-intentioned" person why they don't wear a helmet in their car, why they don't make their kids wear helmets in the car, and why they don't pester their neighbours about wearing helmets while driving, then come back and tell me what you find out. Otherwise, I just consider it an insulting, naive imposition, to insinuate that my behaviour is somehow illogical or irresponsible, that my decisions are more superficial than someone else's, just because theirs are in line with mainstream practices.
Sorry Hypnotoad, this is a pet peeve of mine and I'm not trying to blast you specifically, i've just heard way too much crap about it being a "cultural thing" or "cool", as though these weren't factors in everything we do.
In all seriousness, the reasons people don't wear helmets driving are basically the same as in skateboarding, it's some combination of personal freedom, risk vs. convenience, and coolness does factor into it heavily. The main differences are that driving is way more dangerous and there's a huge financial incentive for car companies not to do anything that takes away from the "coolness" of the automobile and its association with personal freedom.
Anyone who wants to wear a helmet should do so whenever and wherever they like and I would never put anybody down for it. But people trying to argue that it is "logical" need to take a look at themselves and then fuck off.
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okay, I'll have this conversation. there's even less of a "logical" reason not to wear a helmet every time you ride in a car, something that causes way more head injuries and death than all the hangups on 3-foot quarterpipes and 20-stair handrails in the world combined. Ask yourself and every other "responsible", "well-intentioned" person why they don't wear a helmet in their car, why they don't make their kids wear helmets in the car, and why they don't pester their neighbours about wearing helmets while driving, then come back and tell me what you find out.
Cars have airbags and seatbelts.
And per your argument, just driving your car around would be akin to riding your cruiser board to go to the store. Actually skating shit would be closer to racing a car, during which everyone wears helmets, harnesses, and other safety gear.
I can't see street helmets ever being a thing, but if anyone were to do it, I feel like Gonz could be a major influence. That motorcycle helmet that he wears when skating tranny seems pretty distinctive and it wouldn't be the weirdest accessory that NY skaters have adopted in recent years.
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I get that it might be a huge problem for some professional skaters, but is it really such a big issue for the average skateboarder? I have been skating for more than 18 years. I have split my head open once and I have had plenty of injuries in my knees and ancles, but I have never had a concussion. None of my skate buddies have ever had a concussion from skating either. I mostly skate parks and street spots, sometimes bigger tranny and ledges and I never wear a helmet. I think generally skating without a helmet is not a problem, unless you skate vert ramps and big bowls or you skate handrails or big gaps.
You might also suffer a freak accident and get concussed doing a 180 on flat, which is as likely to happen as getting concussed, because you are walking down a set of stairs.
I kinda agree that the avg skater who has at least some sense for risk-assessment probably isn't at much more risk than avg athletes in other activities.
But how did you "split your head open" without being concussed?
I tried to kickflip Bs 50-50 a ledge and I only landed on the tail with my backfoot on the ledge and the board was catapulted in the air and hit me between the eyes and split my forehead open. I don't think I was concussed. I didn't feel dizzy after the initial hit by the board and I did not have a head ache. I had to go to the ER to get stitches, though.
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okay, I'll have this conversation. there's even less of a "logical" reason not to wear a helmet every time you ride in a car, something that causes way more head injuries and death than all the hangups on 3-foot quarterpipes and 20-stair handrails in the world combined. Ask yourself and every other "responsible", "well-intentioned" person why they don't wear a helmet in their car, why they don't make their kids wear helmets in the car, and why they don't pester their neighbours about wearing helmets while driving, then come back and tell me what you find out.
Cars have airbags and seatbelts.
...and would still be safer if you wore a helmet: therefore not wearing a helmet in a car is "illogical" (in the sense in which that word is used in the argument concerning skateboarding), because it reduces your risk of potential injury. If I get t-boned going through an intersection, talking on the phone about what kind of toilet paper to pick up, my chances of survival are better if the window is smashed not by my skin and skull, but by a thin layer of plastic and foam.
just driving your car around would be akin to riding your cruiser board to go to the store. Actually skating shit would be closer to racing a car, during which everyone wears helmets, harnesses, and other safety gear.
most likely place for a car accident is within 25 miles of your house, distracted by the fact that you drive there everyday and you just want to get that toilet paper and get home again.
You point out that some types of driving are more risky and have naturally evolved a set of safety precautions that go along with them: to me that's the same as skating, wherein helmets and pads are a normal part of vert and bowl skating. Skateboarders are just as able to assess risk as anyone else, no one needs to tell me to wear a helmet skating vert, no one needs to tell me to wear a helmet period, because skateboarding has evolved its practices based on the same criteria as other activities ie. risk assessment and practicality as well as appearance. Some of it is about safety and some of it is about looking cool, just like it is for any one of you who don't want to be the person at the stop light wearing a protec behind the wheel.
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Big segments of skating wear helmets, vert and downhill. Both deal with high speeds, where even a small mistake can mean a broken skull.
And especially in downhill, where it’s more to prevent fatality than concussion, helmet wearing is the opposite, you get treated like a dick for NOT wearing one.
When I first started learning downhill with a crew, that was the first rule. Wear one or ride somewhere else. And they all ‘regular’ skates too, usually without helmets.
I learned it’s necessity, no one likes rushing to a pool of blood around someone’s head because he was too ‘cool’ to wear a bucket. I learned that the hard way when I held a downhill clinic and I wasn’t strict enough with the rules.
He came to, but was fucking sick to my stomach scared that this guy didn’t have someone to check on him and make sure he woke up in the morning. Lots can go wrong with skull injuries.
Bringing this back to street skating, I usually don’t wear one either when I skate ‘normally’, because I’m not going anywhere near as fast and you fall differently because of it.
Now, if I skated like a pro with the speed they are hitting stuff and variables of not locking into grinds and shit? That’s taking your life into your own hands.
Sure, we love to see bravissimo, recklessness, and cheating death, but are we at a point in the size tricks being pulled require us to acknowledge the risk?
Or are we happy to continue to celebrate daredevils?
This. Skating while drunk is always a bad idea, and at night! Slammed my tailbone at night while drinking one time, it fucking sucked.
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okay, I'll have this conversation. there's even less of a "logical" reason not to wear a helmet every time you ride in a car, something that causes way more head injuries and death than all the hangups on 3-foot quarterpipes and 20-stair handrails in the world combined. Ask yourself and every other "responsible", "well-intentioned" person why they don't wear a helmet in their car, why they don't make their kids wear helmets in the car, and why they don't pester their neighbours about wearing helmets while driving, then come back and tell me what you find out.
Cars have airbags and seatbelts.
...and would still be safer if you wore a helmet: therefore not wearing a helmet in a car is "illogical" (in the sense in which that word is used in the argument concerning skateboarding), because it reduces your risk of potential injury. If I get t-boned going through an intersection, talking on the phone about what kind of toilet paper to pick up, my chances of survival are better if the window is smashed not by my skin and skull, but by a thin layer of plastic and foam.
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just driving your car around would be akin to riding your cruiser board to go to the store. Actually skating shit would be closer to racing a car, during which everyone wears helmets, harnesses, and other safety gear.
most likely place for a car accident is within 25 miles of your house, distracted by the fact that you drive there everyday and you just want to get that toilet paper and get home again.
You point out that some types of driving are more risky and have naturally evolved a set of safety precautions that go along with them: to me that's the same as skating, wherein helmets and pads are a normal part of vert and bowl skating. Skateboarders are just as able to assess risk as anyone else, no one needs to tell me to wear a helmet skating vert, no one needs to tell me to wear a helmet period, because skateboarding has evolved its practices based on the same criteria as other activities ie. risk assessment and practicality as well as appearance. Some of it is about safety and some of it is about looking cool, just like it is for any one of you who don't want to be the person at the stop light wearing a protec behind the wheel.
Crashed my car on the same road 50 feet from my house multiple times and had the worst bails just doing a bs 5050 on a QP to get speed for the actual next trick.
This is why skateboarding is so amazing because no matter how comfy someone looks on the board they're always hyper aware of what they're trying.
Also everyone saying pros need to wear helmets will be the same people crying when they see guys like zion & foy wearing red bull helmets.
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Some people will never wear helmets. No matter what. I know people who refuse to go to certain parks because helmets are required and even though they really want to try the bowl/ramp/rail there, they refuse because of this requirement.
My main curiosity was if a relevant or popular skater (someone a little more relevant and respected with the current scene than Mike V) were to decide to start always wearing a helmet, or if a safety equipment brand like Rector or Triple 8 put out a full length video of street skating but all of the riders were wearing helmets, would they be accepted for it or kooked for it by the majority?
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xgOUgrOHuFc (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xgOUgrOHuFc)
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I might be getting a bit off topic, but has anyone else here dealt with concussions? I’ve been dealing with post concussion syndrome over the past year as a result of three mTBIs, and it’s been absolutely miserable.
Dude, a “year?” I’ve been dealing with PCS for two months. This shit fucking sucks. Fatigue, cognitive issues, irritability, sensitivity to sound and light, headaches... Fuck this shit. Stopped skating for a month and rested all the time. Symptoms got way better. Skated once, tried to do a back 3 and got dizzy. Went right back to headaches and all that other shit all over again. Back to square one. Fuck
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Ive been thinking about this quite a bit lately. About two months back I was at a local park and watched a skilled skateboarder hit his head really badly 50-50ing a foot-high flat bar. His board slipped out under him, both of his feet went behind the bar so that His ankleswere locked into the top of the bar and slingshotted him headfirst into the concrete. Out cold, blood everywhere, came to making horrible morning sounds, eventually getting a ride to the hospital.
Again, this dude was a good skateboarder, who wasn’t doing “stupid shit” he wasn’t “prepared for,” he just got a little to comfy and a perfectly shitty sequence of events had him getting a substantial head injury. I’ve never seen someone that good get hurt that badly on something that small, and it definitely opened my eyes a bit
There’s no logical reason not to wear a helmet on a board. It’s a culture thing, and a lot of outsiders would probably see it as a cultural problem endemic to skateboarding. I’m not saying everyone should/has to wear a helmet, but I do think it’s a conversation worth having, especially once some of our childhood idols start going out like pro wrestlers and football players.
okay, I'll have this conversation. there's even less of a "logical" reason not to wear a helmet every time you ride in a car, something that causes way more head injuries and death than all the hangups on 3-foot quarterpipes and 20-stair handrails in the world combined. Ask yourself and every other "responsible", "well-intentioned" person why they don't wear a helmet in their car, why they don't make their kids wear helmets in the car, and why they don't pester their neighbours about wearing helmets while driving, then come back and tell me what you find out. Otherwise, I just consider it an insulting, naive imposition, to insinuate that my behaviour is somehow illogical or irresponsible, that my decisions are more superficial than someone else's, just because theirs are in line with mainstream practices.
Sorry Hypnotoad, this is a pet peeve of mine and I'm not trying to blast you specifically, i've just heard way too much crap about it being a "cultural thing" or "cool", as though these weren't factors in everything we do.
In all seriousness, the reasons people don't wear helmets driving are basically the same as in skateboarding, it's some combination of personal freedom, risk vs. convenience, and coolness does factor into it heavily. The main differences are that driving is way more dangerous and there's a huge financial incentive for car companies not to do anything that takes away from the "coolness" of the automobile and its association with personal freedom.
Anyone who wants to wear a helmet should do so whenever and wherever they like and I would never put anybody down for it. But people trying to argue that it is "logical" need to take a look at themselves and then fuck off.
This is a false comparison, and not very ‘logical’, because of the sheer number of people riding cars and spending time in them is astronomically higher than the number of people who skate.
Think of the number of people who drive, and the amount of time they spend behind the wheel. It’s not even comparable. If the numbers were equal, I suspect you’d see a WAY higher head injury ratio in skateboarding.
Personally over my life I’ve spend probably 100x more time behind the wheel than on a skateboard, both well over 20 years, but I’ve never had any of the injuries, much less head bumps, that I’ve had in skating
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The older you get, especially with loved ones who rely on you, the less you care about being judged and the more you care about your own self and safety.
It's not like I'm impressing anyone with my skating skills at this age anyway, more just out there to have some fun and roll with him
Me too, I skate with my son all the time and I’m not setting the world on fire anymore. Shook my whole family’s world when I slipped out by missing locking in a frontside grind and landing on the back of my head.
TBI and 4 days in a trauma unit, luckily the only lasting issue is no longer being able to smell, is no joke. Slipped out while warming up doing a trick that I’ve done literally thousands of times. At my age I’ll just wear the helmet. I don’t preach to kids but I’ll tell them what happened if they ask about me wearing a helmet.
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I don't wear a helmet because it's not wavy, but I'm not going to sit here and act like not wearing one is safer. You might as well be justifying cigarettes.
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I'm sure no one here gives helmet-less street skating a second thought, but does anyone else feel weird when you see people skating big, concrete transition totally padless? Unless they're super good at falling and stuff, dudes like Pedro Barros, Ben Raybourn, Willy Lara etc. must take ridiculous hits
Even though it's not transition, and I love the guy, this to me is one of the worst slams I always remember. Ugh.
https://youtu.be/aKunbEacMHQ (https://youtu.be/aKunbEacMHQ)
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It's weird because i never wear one skateboarding, but snowboarding i wear it pretty often unless its street or DIY shit.
The difference for me is being able to kick your board away and learning how to bail properly, where snowboarding you have your feet locked into your board.
I was doing cab 2 frontboard and i caught my heel edge on the rail and flew backwards and smashed my head on the hard ass snow. Wouldn't catch me trying that on a skateboard tho lol
basically skateboarding has this art of bailing properly which makes helmets almost pointless unless you're sending it.
I never even feel weird putting on a helmet to go snowboarding... I know I'm gonna usually try and hit some off course, back country shit so to speak, come close to trees, cutting my own lines, so it makes sense to wear one.
But I will forever feel awkward putting one on to skate anything.To hit your head in skating is kinda pretty tough to do, even if you're not a pro at falling.
Snowboarding is usually so much faster and even though I have never done it before, not even learning at first, have I ever caught an edge and got tossed, but I do expect to go damn near head over heels at some point every time I go. Not ever in skating.
When I was 14 I would secretly wear my soccer ankle guards skating on days after my ankles took a thrashing. LMAO, Low key, I've always secretly wondered if anybody else ever did this, but would never, never ask. Hahaha
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This is a false comparison, and not very ‘logical’, because of the sheer number of people riding cars and spending time in them is astronomically higher than the number of people who skate.
Think of the number of people who drive, and the amount of time they spend behind the wheel. It’s not even comparable. If the numbers were equal, I suspect you’d see a WAY higher head injury ratio in skateboarding.
Personally over my life I’ve spend probably 100x more time behind the wheel than on a skateboard, both well over 20 years, but I’ve never had any of the injuries, much less head bumps, that I’ve had in skating
Do you seriously believe driving is safer than skateboarding?
If you live in the states, your chances of dying in a car accident are slightly over 1 in ten thousand.
You think 1 in 10 000 skateboarders die as a result of an injurybsuatained during skateboarding? And yes, i'm talking about comparable times apent behind the wheel vs. Time spent on 4 wheels.
And that's not even getting into the numbers of non-fatal hrad injuries due to car accidents. The numbers aren't even close.
Furthermore, unless you drive for a living, or have a serious commute, the average skateboarder spends more time skating than mist oeiple spend driving.
My argument is based on the premise that driving is more dangerous than skating, and the stats support that idea.
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Either way, helmet or no, can we please agree to call it a helmet and not a brain bucket, skid lid, etc...I'd rather have CTE than have to hear people try to make a helmet sound cool by using nerd slang, thank you!
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This is a false comparison, and not very ‘logical’, because of the sheer number of people riding cars and spending time in them is astronomically higher than the number of people who skate.
Think of the number of people who drive, and the amount of time they spend behind the wheel. It’s not even comparable. If the numbers were equal, I suspect you’d see a WAY higher head injury ratio in skateboarding.
Personally over my life I’ve spend probably 100x more time behind the wheel than on a skateboard, both well over 20 years, but I’ve never had any of the injuries, much less head bumps, that I’ve had in skating
Do you seriously believe driving is safer than skateboarding?
If you live in the states, your chances of dying in a car accident are slightly over 1 in ten thousand.
You think 1 in 10 000 skateboarders die as a result of an injurybsuatained during skateboarding? And yes, i'm talking about comparable times apent behind the wheel vs. Time spent on 4 wheels.
And that's not even getting into the numbers of non-fatal hrad injuries due to car accidents. The numbers aren't even close.
Furthermore, unless you drive for a living, or have a serious commute, the average skateboarder spends more time skating than mist oeiple spend driving.
My argument is based on the premise that driving is more dangerous than skating, and the stats support that idea.
Do I believe driving is safer? Absolutely.
Because of the speed and power of driving, when something goes wrong it goes REALLY wrong, which accounts for a high fatality rate.
But even so, do I believe that 1 in 10,000 skaters die from skating? I definitely could. I don’t see anything particularly extreme in that number. But I’d be happy to see some stats, if you have any to back up your assertion.
But are we measuring how dangerous something is by fatality? Twisted ankles? Neither of those are particularly fair comparisons, due to the nature of the activities. We can, but those are different threads.
This thread is about brain trauma, and you brought up the driving thing, saying that skaters are not as likely to receive head injuries as vehicle passengers.
So let’s stick with that.
And we could do an informal poll here on SLAP, and I guarantee you there will be more head injuries here due to skating than driving.
By the way, you claim ‘stats support my idea’, but you only give vehicle stats, only for fatalities. Not for head injuries, and no data on time spent in a car. And most importantly, none for skating. Where are those?
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i love it when there is a thread about some genuinely interesting topic that is relevant to every single one of us and yet people still manage to make it about themselves and their boring ass dicsuccion about whether skating or driving a car is more risky? oh well rip chris benoit
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Been skating for 18 years, all of them low-impact and I am still having the time of my life. When the time comes to skate transition exclusively, I will don a helmet. Knock on wood, I have never even been close to hitting my head, as I always take things slowly (freak accidents aside).
Stevie built an amazing career (and legacy) for himself not hucking once, so it really is up to every skater with PRO ambitions to consider if the risks are worth the reward. I cannot relate to star/rail hucker parts anyways, so they can go the way of the dodo IMO.
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rip chris benoit
Life gave him one too many benoit chops, so he had to crippler crossface his family, then himself.
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I was gonna post the gif of that kid doing a pop-shuv at Pulaski, in a helmet, and leave it at that but then I actually read the article and while I wouldn't necessarily want to see a ton of helmet heavy footage, the discussion concerning CTE is definitely something that, as per this article, hopefully continues and gets explored more.
*no pop, shuv
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All this talk about hitting your head jinxed me. I haven't hit my head in probably 6 months, and have never hit it significantly. This morning I went for fakie front board (half cab board to fakie), a go-to warm up trick of mine, on a small flatbar. Missed the board, blinked right as I missed so I couldn't spot my landing well, and went straight to my left knee and cheek bone/temple.
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Life gave him one too many benoit chops, so he had to crippler crossface his family, then himself.
I'd wager it was the flying headbutt that did him in.
(https://i.imgur.com/z4tNjUS.gif)
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More interesting question: Do yall niggas think OJ Simpson has that shit?
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More interesting question: Do yall niggas think OJ Simpson has that shit?
YES
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More interesting question: Do yall niggas think OJ Simpson has that shit?
I think that murder was totally a psychotic CTE breakdown that he himself didnt know he was having till he was doing the murders
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By the way, you claim ‘stats support my idea’, but you only give vehicle stats, only for fatalities. Not for head injuries, and no data on time spent in a car. And most importantly, none for skating. Where are those?
I'll try to make this quick then stop polluting the thread.
I've met with people from various brain injury societies (organizations pushing for skateboard helmet laws), and they have told me that they don't have statistics concerning head injuries or fatalities in skateboarding. I believe them, and I believe you too when you say you don't have them, which is why I said that stats support my idea that driving is more dangerous. I can show you convincing numbers that tell you how dangerous driving is, whereas arguments made about the dangers of skateboarding are anecdotal, or "common sense". We can sit here all day and talk about where we were the day Phil Shao died, or seeing Muska knock himself out on the cyclops rail at Slam city Jam in '99, but personally, I like it when I turn the key and the car starts- in other words, science isn't the same as opinion. Again, I would never tell someone they shouldn't wear a helmet, nor do I think it's wrong.
What I'm trying to point out is that conversations about head injuries in skating, (protective gear, etc.) should be informed by analysis rather than just emotional value judgements, because eventually these conversations turn into public policy.
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tossing my 2 cents in here:
I've been wearing my helmet for all skating ever since my son was born. Part for the wife, part for him, part so when he later (potentially) started skating, since he'd have to wear one, I didn't want to get called out as a hypocrite.
It feels awkward and "nerdy" for a bit, but that passes. And if anybody actually tries to make fun then they are most likely a colossal kook, so fuck 'em.
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sup mikev
helmets are smart, skateboarders are dumb
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I might be getting a bit off topic, but has anyone else here dealt with concussions? I’ve been dealing with post concussion syndrome over the past year as a result of three mTBIs, and it’s been absolutely miserable.
Yeah you need to ease back into exercise, if you overexert yourself right out the gate you’re likely to have a relapse of symptoms. Sorry to hear about your injury, id recommend eating clean, staying sober, and doing things like meditation and light exercise to minimize stress. Best of luck with your recovery.
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Although they certainly can help mitigate the damage from hitting your head, helmets can’t prevent all concussions. Both of the mTBIs I’ve sustained skating were the result of whiplash.
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Although they certainly can help mitigate the damage from hitting your head, helmets can’t prevent all concussions. Both of the mTBIs I’ve sustained skating were the result of whiplash.
acting like a maniac will give you whiplash.
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I list almost 2 years of my memory from a car wreck at 19 yrs of age. I've been skating 30+ years, a large part in crusty east coast ramps that pitched you 6-8 ft straight to flat when you'd get the mail holding the coping on. I just shaved my head last week for the first time in decades. My wife just said of my, the back of your head is.... scars everywhere. She has been telling me I have cte, mostly just because I repeat myself VERY often, and argue I've never said things before. Only thing I noticed is I can't remember numerical sequences, and have trouble with mathmatics, which I was strong in my youth. Time is also very blurry.
What I'm trying to say is now Jenkem and Slap are both taking about this possibility, maybe it's time for me to not be so argumentative about it. But I believe you must die before they can biopsy your brain to see if CTE is the issue.
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It's weird because i never wear one skateboarding, but snowboarding i wear it pretty often unless its street or DIY shit.
The difference for me is being able to kick your board away and learning how to bail properly, where snowboarding you have your feet locked into your board.
I was doing cab 2 frontboard and i caught my heel edge on the rail and flew backwards and smashed my head on the hard ass snow. Wouldn't catch me trying that on a skateboard tho lol
basically skateboarding has this art of bailing properly which makes helmets almost pointless unless you're sending it.
I never even feel weird putting on a helmet to go snowboarding... I know I'm gonna usually try and hit some off course, back country shit so to speak, come close to trees, cutting my own lines, so it makes sense to wear one.
But I will forever feel awkward putting one on to skate anything.To hit your head in skating is kinda pretty tough to do, even if you're not a pro at falling.
Snowboarding is usually so much faster and even though I have never done it before, not even learning at first, have I ever caught an edge and got tossed, but I do expect to go damn near head over heels at some point every time I go. Not ever in skating.
When I was 14 I would secretly wear my soccer ankle guards skating on days after my ankles took a thrashing. LMAO, Low key, I've always secretly wondered if anybody else ever did this, but would never, never ask. Hahaha
Yeah I have done that and knocked myself out before snowboarding and I was wearing a helmet, I've also knocked myself out playing hockey, another sport that needs a helmet, I've never knocked myself out skateboarding though
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I didn't wear helmets much skating my first go-around ('87-'93). Biggest I went was a 9 stair, and spent a lot of time on mini ramps - no pools or vert.
I started up again five years ago at 40 and wear one most of the time now. If I'm dicking around in a parking lot, no. But if I'm skating a concrete park I strap one on.
A couple months ago I was getting a new helmet for my 7 year old and noticed they had a few "Certified" helmets on the shelf and mostly non-certified. I asked about it and the shop employee told me that the non-certfied ones provided no brain protection. I did a bit of research and realized the Triple-8 Sweatsaver I had been wearing for years was pretty much useless. I bought an S1 Lifer helmet that actually absorbs impact.
I hadn't hit my head in years although I have had a couple concussions in the past. Yesterday I was at the skatepark trying a new line which necessitated hauling ass. I mis-timed a pump bump at speed and ate shit hard. When my head hit the concrete I heard the foam cracking. Headache, a little dizzy and a sore neck. I do think that if I had my old helmet on I would have been much worse, and if I had no helmet I would have been laying on the concrete bleeding.
This is the testing showing the actual g-force reduction
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qrVizAB6kSo
This is the park I ate it at, which is pretty damn fun (when the scooter kids are in school) and you can haul ass.
https://www.instagram.com/p/BltEoRPBtCM/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link
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i've been thinking lately that the level of the gnarly side of skating has gotten to the point that those guys might want to put a helmet on. like when you see vert guys selectively wearing pads, they can tell when they need the helmet or knees.
the slam with foy seemed like that was probably in the level of gnar that a helmet would make sense. i could imagine street parts working if the guys were doing similar thing and putting on helmets for the really gnarly steep stuff. i think it's unfortunate that some really talented guys are going to get seriously fucked while the culture and industry figures it all out. it's obvious that skaters are taking way more risks than ever before though and i seriously hope seeing people get knocked out like in that deathwish part doesn't become the norm.
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I wear a helmet when I ski. I wear a helmet wen I ride my road bike. I didnt wear a helmet when I skate.
I’ve had 2 concussions over the last 3 years. The last one I hade about 8 months of post concussion disorder. I work in IT. I can’t lose this job it’s how I take care of my family.
Had to slow down. Don’t do anything more than push now. Never could do much Skating either, which might explain the concussions.
My only goal now is to skate(a bit and safely) on my birthday, June 21st 2021. I’ll be 50 and it’s also go skateboarding day.
Don’t fuck with your brains. Most skateboarders are already way to fucking stupid as it is. You guys can’t afford to lose any more brain function.