The Machiavellians

[SneakySecrets]

Anyone dipped a toe into the realist worldview of the disciples of Machiavelli?  I just read “The Machiavellians” by James Burnham and it is fan-tas-tic.

[GS77]

I heard he was a real meanie.

[brent]

keffe d

[skate_or_dingus]

 A talent agent is sitting in his office. A normal family walks in...

[SneakySecrets]

I heard he was a real meanie.

Is that what you really think about him?

[GS77]

Expand Quote

I heard he was a real meanie.

[close]

Is that what you really think about him?

I haven’t really spent much time reading about his philosophy. I only know ‘the ends justify the means’. Sounds like a modern politician.

[SneakySecrets]

Yeah, but a lot of people think Discourses on Livy is more the “real” Machiavelli and it contradicts a lot of the views in The Prince.  In one, the populace is ignorant, fickle and manipulatable; the other wise and dependable. 

I don’t even think you could call anything in the Prince particularly evil: it’s just what some really smart medieval statesman thought a new ruler needed to know about how power is accumulated and protected in the real world.  He made it effectively as a kind of CV for a new employer and someone that could unite the warring factions of Italy. 

Anyways I meant more about the Italian elite school of thought that eventually sprang from him.  I just think this shit is interesting for some reason.

[SneakySecrets]

i thought it was okay

edit: looked this book up & georges sorel isnt italian jsyk

Ok thanks man

[matt_2993]

https://youtu.be/mU7hdGKOGyk?si=kyDonSx_Ydz8_O5s

[companguero]

Chapters:
0:00 video intro.
0:41 Preface
3:06 Part I - DANTE: POLITICS AS WISH
47:59 Part II - MACHIAVELLI: THE SCIENCE OF POWER
2:23:11 Part III - MOSCA: THE THEORY OF THE RULING CLASS
3:28:31 Part IV - SOREL: A NOTE ON MYTH AND VIOLENCE
3:55:04 Part V - MICHELS: THE LIMITS OF DEMOCRACY
5:01:38 Part VI - PARETO: THE NATURE OF SOCIAL ACTION
6:43:31 Part VII - POLITICS AND TRUTH