Learning new languages via software or otherwise

[pugmaster]

The overwhelming majority of the world has citizens who speak more than one language.  Most certainly, skateboarding as an activity places us in positions where we interact with individuals who come from different linguistic backgrounds. I would like to have this thread act as a repository of information for individuals who seek to learn different languages so that they may be better equipped to communicate more effectively and efficiently with people who are native speakers of various languages.

Duo lingo and Rosetta Stone are some options for learning languages and I am curious to hear what the experiences are of individuals who have used those services have been like.

An immersion experience is often very effective but I feel like people who are in remote settings who do not have those opportunities are at a disadvantage.  For example, a skater who wants to visit Japan in a year who wants to learn and practice basic Japanese that lives in rural Kentucky.

The SLAP community is very diverse culturally and linguistically and I am curious to hear about what you all have to offer related to this topic.

   

[rawr1922]

 
New App coming soon. Looks like a cool concept.  Company did a soft launch recently. In first two weeks, 117k messages exchanged between 10 different countries

[primo]

In addition to learning on your own with software or recordings that work for you, try language exchange. There are apps and websites that bring people together for this purpose. A lot of men and women both use it for dating but I think most are pretty serious about learning.

Here are some language exchange networks:

iTalki: Has paid tutors professional and amateur, also free social network which is intended to connect  language partners.

Hello Talk: Kind of like Facebook in that it has a feed of posts (helpful for asking the community random language questions), chat, etc.

Tandem: Strictly profiles and connections.

All three have voice and video chat.

Good luck.

[Sila]

The few posts here have covered basically everything. In addition to those, I'd watch movies with or without subtitles or anything else where you'd hear the language being spoken in a fluid and conversational manner. Learning other languages is great, especially when you begin to start dreaming in another language. That's when you really know you're learning.

[cucktard]

Before I moved to Japan I took 2 semesters of intensive Japanese (first class I couldn’t actually get into for credit, so I just sat in, an option if you don’t want to pay as much).

Unles you are naturally talented, I’ve noticed there is a big difference in actual communicative ability between someone who took lessons, and someone who just came over and tried to pick it up.

[Freelancevagrant]

In Hebrew there’s a few methods but the most effective is called ulpan, which is basically an immersion class, but they offer it online as well.  What I’ve heard is that Ulpan is great but can be inhibiting due to the nature of immersion.   I know people who were learning Hebrew, but were doing duo lingo and watching Israeli tv without subtitles just to pick up on the words they were learning and how they are pronounced and used properly in conversation. The majority of them now speak damn near flawless modern Hebrew.

The big thing with learning Hebrew is that you should learn to speak a little bit, before you learn to read it. I was taught the other way around when I was learning it many moons ago. my grandfather was teaching me and he had a thick Galician Yiddish accent, and taught me the alef bet (alphabet) first. In Hebrew and Yiddish there’s different dialects and different pronunciations in each dialect. So as a result I know now speak Ashkenazi Hebrew with a thick Galician Yiddish accident. The shits of this is that there’s a big difference in Modern Hebrew, which is spoken conversationally in Israel and among a lot of the diaspora, and Ashkenazi Hebrew.

If anyone has interest in learning it though (or Yiddish) feel free to hit me up I’d love to help!

[Hmmmm Nice Bike]

 
New App coming soon. Looks like a cool concept.  Company did a soft launch recently. In first two weeks, 117k messages exchanged between 10 different countries

Woah, even Tony Hawk uses this app 0:41

[Hmmmm Nice Bike]

In Hebrew there’s a few methods but the most effective is called ulpan, which is basically an immersion class, but they offer it online as well.  What I’ve heard is that Ulpan is great but can be inhibiting due to the nature of immersion, a few people I know who were learning Hebrew were doing duo lingo and watching Israeli tv without subtitles just to pick up on the words they were learning and how they are pronounced and used properly in conversation.

The big thing with learning Hebrew is that you should learn to speak a little bit, before you learn to read it. I was taught the other way around when I was learning it many moons ago. my grandfather was teaching me and he had a thick Galician Yiddish accent, and taught me the alef bet (alphabet) first. In Hebrew and Yiddish there’s different dialects and different pronunciations in each dialect. So as a result I know now speak Ashkenazi Hebrew with a thick Galician Yiddish accident. The shits of this is that there’s a big difference in Modern Hebrew, which is spoken conversationally in Israel and among a lot of the diaspora, and Ashkenazi Hebrew.

If anyone has interest in learning it though (or Yiddish) feel free to hit me up I’d love to help!

I've started studying Hebrew last year around early autumn, and so far I've learned the alef bet, how to read and how to speak a little bit but i'm basically at a toddler level right now, which is still pretty cool I suppose. I can put together some simple phrases like very basic conversation starters or asking for stuff but struggle continuing a conversation.

I've been using the book "Colloquial Hebrew" and making flashcards for myself on the website quizlet which also allows me to take tests, but also I'll occasionally watch or listen to Hebrew spoken media online. My fiance is Russian Israeli and not religious at all, so I'm just trying to learn modern Hebrew.

However, I still feel like perhaps there's something else I'm missing out on that I should be doing as well to help my skills improve.

This is a question for everyone in general and not just Hebrew learners, but how much time should someone dedicate daily towards studying a new language?

[TheLurper]

Study all the time. Write out shit over and over again, review flash cards, and just constantly practice.

I think most of the apps good at vocab building but that is it.

[Lloyd Braun]

Obviously immersion would be the easiest but as mentioned is not always practical. Learning a language is very difficult, but if your motivated it can certainly be done without living in a foreign country. The apps are good for vocabulary building but not much else IMO.

I would suggest to anyone that can afford to do so, take private lessons online 1-3 times a week. I used Preply which has tons of teachers with tons of languages varying from like $10-$50 an hour. But you can certainly find a quality teacher for under $20hr, I’m sure there is other sites offering the same service but Im only familiar with Preply.

Outside of lessons, study vocabulary and grammar structure in your target language. You need the basic grammar structure to have basic conversations then grow your vocabulary to suit your speaking ability. If you have a basic grasp of the language change your phone to that language. Download google translate and translate words you don’t know save them and study those. Listen to music and learn the lyrics. On your commutes look around and see if you can describe what your seeing to yourself in the new language, take notes if you can.

[Willie]

Before I moved to Japan I took 2 semesters of intensive Japanese (first class I couldn’t actually get into for credit, so I just sat in, an option if you don’t want to pay as much).

Unles you are naturally talented, I’ve noticed there is a big difference in actual communicative ability between someone who took lessons, and someone who just came over and tried to pick it up.

I had a bunch of “Learn Japanese” tapes and books in high school and in hindsight they were basically useless. With Japanese (and probably any other language that uses a different alphabet) I think it’s pretty much essential to learn that first before proceeding. It might take a month or so to learn kana but it definitely puts you on a better footing for understanding the language. I still can’t really internalize any Japanese language lessons in Romaji.

Chinese is weird in that there is no alphabet or syllabary to learn but I can’t imagine learning Chinese without learning characters and the specific tones with the words. I only had two Chinese classes and didn’t have a chance to continue studying but that was infinitely more useful than the hundreds and hundreds of hours I listened to Chinese movies (I couldn’t have even recognized then if one was mandarin or Cantonese).


To the original point: I tried a bit of Duolingo (in Japanese) when it first came out and thought it would have really difficult to pick up anything without some previous background in the language.

[The Drew]

I taught myself Japanese.

I started by learning hiragana and katakana (you can that fairly simply in a week or two... I had a poster I made and stuck on the toilet door and learnt whilst pooping)
Kanji is way more intensive... I used an algoryhthmic program (Mnemosyne) to learn the meanings and readings (I have forgotten a lot of them because I don't study anymore but I knew the 2000 or so at one point)
I also used that program to make my own pattern sentences using new words and grammar forms and would just repeat them over and over again... I did this until I had a basic understanding and use of the language so I could live here without any major problems..
I did that for 4 yrs or so everyday and then stopped studying completely.

I think I may have used Rosetta stones audio lessons when I first started... and just repeated them out a loud like a dork


I am learning french now (but not as intensely) just a little bit each day on duolingo (just to kill time on the train)
the hard things I find with french are all the gender related words and pronunciation... but I don't have to learn an entirely new alphabet so that is positive.

I think repetition is the key... kind of like skatebarding

[S.]

I taught myself Japanese.

I started by learning hiragana and katakana (you can that fairly simply in a week or two... I had a poster I made and stuck on the toilet door and learnt whilst pooping)
Kanji is way more intensive... I used an algoryhthmic program (Mnemosyne) to learn the meanings and readings (I have forgotten a lot of them because I don't study anymore but I knew the 2000 or so at one point)
I also used that program to make my own pattern sentences using new words and grammar forms and would just repeat them over and over again... I did this until I had a basic understanding and use of the language so I could live here without any major problems..
I did that for 4 yrs or so everyday and then stopped studying completely.

I think I may have used Rosetta stones audio lessons when I first started... and just repeated them out a loud like a dork


I am learning french now (but not as intensely) just a little bit each day on duolingo (just to kill time on the train)
the hard things I find with french are all the gender related words and pronunciation... but I don't have to learn an entirely new alphabet so that is positive.

I think repetition is the key... kind of like skatebarding

I respect your discipline and dedication!

I could never learn a language like that. My native language is German and I am pretty fluent in English and Spanish. I have always struggled with languages in high school, because I had a hard time memorizing Vocabulary and Grammar structures. In my junior year I spent one year at an American high-school. I lived with an American host-Family and rarely spoke German for a whole year. After a few months I would even dream in English. After high-school I decided to go on an extended trip to Latin America. Before I went, I took a two week class on basic Spanish. When I got back I decided to study English and Spanish at university, partly because I was lazy and partly because of my ongoing fascination with the US and Latin America.

At university I struggled a bit with Spanish language classes. I decided to do an immersion experience in Colombia and stayed in Bogota for three months in a shared apartment with Colombians and a French guy. I skated a lot and neither the skaters nor my flat mates spoke English so I was forced to speak Spanish all the time. I also met a girl who I spent a lot of time with, who only spoke Spanish. I have a degree in English and Spanish now and I teach English for a living. I attribute most of my language skills to my immersions and to watching movies and reading books.

For me studying grammar and vocabulary doesn‘t work at all to study a language. I need emotions and purpose to build the necessary patterns to understand and speak a new language. That may be different for another person, though. If you are like me I recommend you study some grammar of the language you want to learn, but also watch movies and Listen to music. If possible Immersions are the best way to master a new language, though as language is more of a subconscious thing than a conscious one.

[McDuff]

I’m trying to learn French through a podcast called coffee break. They’re 15 min episodes/lessons. I have to listen to an episode more than once, but I think the key is using it (as stated above). I listen driving to/at work and respond to people with the things I’ve learned...

[AnotherHardDayAtTheOffice]

I think the most important point is to realize that there are different types of learners. Some people need to consciously learn grammatical structures, others favour immersion or practical exercises. At the end of the day though, no matter which type you are, you need a little bit of everything: You need to know about grammar, you need to talk to people, you need to watch video clips or movies and you need to read in a foreign language. Learning a language can be broken down into different, interconnected skills (speaking, writing, reading, listening) and ideally, you need to train all of them.

Learning software can definitely help, but as a foreign language teacher, I'd say that I wouldn't put all my money on it. If you're a beginner, I strongly advise cartoons and children's books over adult novels and stupid video clips on the internet over whole movies. I watched interviews with football players (or even Daveeeed) when I learned Spanish. Also, language exchanges are great, too! You'll met new people and potentially make new friends. I know we're in the middle of a pandemic, but still.

But the most important part is: Have fun and enjoy! Learning a foreign language is a little bit like skateboarding. Learning the first phrases and grammar is quite similar to learning how to ollie or how to roll down a hill.

[cilantro]

I speak English and Spanish fluently. Spanish was my first language but I was forced to not speak it in public school, so I can speak it well but slang and mannerisms get lost in translation for me sometimes.
Here’s what helped me to relearn Spanish:
-practice it at work, learn spanish vocab for whatever you work with (I live right by MX border so this is necessary to do regardless)
-listen to spanish music, learn the lyrics, sing along and translate what you don’t know (I fuckin’ LOVE me some Juan Gabriel, Chalino Sanchez, Los Crudos, some Eskorbuto... hell yeah B) )
-get over looking dumb.
Yeah, you might pronounce it like shit but occasionally you’ll meet somebody who really appreciates that you’re trying to communicate. My mom was so used to getting shut down cuz of her terrible English but she never gave up, now manages over 100 employees who don’t speak a lick of spanish.

I’ve used those methods to learn some Russian, French and German, with Russian being my most successful “foreign” language. I can credit that to my friend in St Petersburg who showed me this sick ass band called Kino, easily one of my favorite groups ever now. Music really works y’all

[matty_c]

I agree I reckon the best way is just the immersion, like go to a place everyone’s speaking it. It’s real trippy when you start thinking in the language
I have forgotten heaps of it but I did French in highschool and we went to noumea for maybe ten days and I remember we all got heaps better at it

That’s psycho, TheDrew, I have heard Japanese is the hardest one there is

I agree about English ones being easier, lots of words in a lot of European languages are similar

I did get Rosetta Stone from the pirate bay a few years ago now, it’s probably worth checking torrent sites

[OldieButFrenchie]

I was lucky enough to grow up bilingual (adopted by French-german couple). That helps a lot cause you are used to switching accents and later I was able to pick up english really quickly. It felt like an easier version of german!
Then when I reconnected with my bio family in Colombia I worked on my Spanish a lot. (btw S., I felt good about myself in Bogota, cause I understood maybe 90% of what was being said, but then when I went to the coast, in Santa Marta, goddamn! with their accent, I understood 50% at most!).
So basically I'm pretty much fluent with French/english/spanish/german. But when I don't use one of those 4 for a long time (except French, my strongest one), I get rusty. You can forget a language as quick as you learn it! so right now my spanish is ok but my german has turned to shit almost.....

anyways I tend to recommend stuff where you don't feel like you are really working: like others said, listening to music, watching movies, reading comics, watching youtube stuff in another language.

It's also what I do for a living: I translate and subtitle mostly english-speaking shows for french TV.   

[burm]

I’m trying to learn French through a podcast called coffee break. They’re 15 min episodes/lessons. I have to listen to an episode more than once, but I think the key is using it (as stated above). I listen driving to/at work and respond to people with the things I’ve learned...

I’ve also been listening to Coffee Break French without any previous experience of that language. I feel like I’ve already gotten some basic understanding how the language works and the pronunciation and picked up a couple of phrases. Not yet close to conversational capasity though, but I have a friend who’s french so that would be the milestone I’m aiming for.

I like the fact that the focus is on conversation since I usually tend to pick up on the rules pretty easily but vocabulary is always the bottleneck. I’m Finnish so at school I have studied English, Swedish, German, Spanish and Japanese to varying degrees, but this is the first time I’m learning by myself.

The issue with the podcast format is that especially with something like French you have no clue how the word are actually written. That’s why I’ve been looking into other apps with flashcards and stuff. But I’m looking to semi-passively develop this over the next couple of years so I’m not putting much effort in.

Coffee Break gets extra points for Scottish hosts as well so you get to develop your Scottish accent too.

[S.]

I was lucky enough to grow up bilingual (adopted by French-german couple). That helps a lot cause you are used to switching accents and later I was able to pick up english really quickly. It felt like an easier version of german!
Then when I reconnected with my bio family in Colombia I worked on my Spanish a lot. (btw S., I felt good about myself in Bogota, cause I understood maybe 90% of what was being said, but then when I went to the coast, in Santa Marta, goddamn! with their accent, I understood 50% at most!).
So basically I'm pretty much fluent with French/english/spanish/german. But when I don't use one of those 4 for a long time (except French, my strongest one), I get rusty. You can forget a language as quick as you learn it! so right now my spanish is ok but my german has turned to shit almost.....

anyways I tend to recommend stuff where you don't feel like you are really working: like others said, listening to music, watching movies, reading comics, watching youtube stuff in another language.

It's also what I do for a living: I translate and subtitle mostly english-speaking shows for french TV.   

Yes, i experienced it in a similar way. It is pretty amazing how differently the Spanish sounds in different regions of Colombia. The cultures are very different too. In Medellin the accent is a bit similar to Argentia of all places. They pronounce „ll“ like „sh“ instead of „y“ like most places in the world. In Bogota People are super formal, they speak slowly and clearly. They barely ever use „tu“, instead they use the formal „usted“ even for friends or brothers. On the coast on the other hand they call everyone „hermano“ and they leave out syllables at the end of words a bit similar to Cuban Spanish. Generally the people from the coast „the Costenos“ are a bit discriminated against in Colombia. Most of them identify more with other Caribbeans from other countries than with the Colombians from other regions.