Author Topic: Why does the Rising Sun flag get a pass?  (Read 5013 times)

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TheLurper

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Re: Why does the Rising Sun flag get a pass?
« Reply #30 on: June 19, 2022, 10:13:43 AM »
Not sure if just a design change or a change of meaning but Capcom removed it from E. Honda's stage in SFII.

This was where I first saw it and just assumed it was a design thing rather than a political thing.



« Last Edit: June 19, 2022, 10:22:18 AM by TheLurper »

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cucktard

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Re: Why does the Rising Sun flag get a pass?
« Reply #31 on: June 19, 2022, 10:18:58 AM »
Not sure if just a design change or a change of meaning but capcom removed it from E. Honda's stage in SFII.

This was where I first saw it and just assumed it was a design thing rather than a political thing.





With that game being popular worldwide, especially in Asia, it’s safe to say they removed it to avoid offending the rest of their Asian market
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Spectre

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Re: Why does the Rising Sun flag get a pass?
« Reply #32 on: June 19, 2022, 11:29:48 AM »
Expand Quote
Not sure if just a design change or a change of meaning but capcom removed it from E. Honda's stage in SFII.

This was where I first saw it and just assumed it was a design thing rather than a political thing.




[close]

With that game being popular worldwide, especially in Asia, it’s safe to say they removed it to avoid offending the rest of their Asian market


This is correct there's even articles about it

Hefe43

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Re: Why does the Rising Sun flag get a pass?
« Reply #33 on: June 19, 2022, 12:05:53 PM »



I thought this deck was a weird follow up to the red silhouette. White guy with a rising sun is lame, especially when you’re THE guy in skating. It wasn’t until I saw the hosoi doc a decade later that i realized it was for tweaker hosoi’s legal fund.

OG Top Gun has the trifecta. Rising sun on a black pilot, black pilot is called Sundown, and Sundown’s squadron is the Sundowners.

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Re: Why does the Rising Sun flag get a pass?
« Reply #34 on: June 19, 2022, 12:19:30 PM »
Probably due to general lack of education about the flag. Most Americans probably see the rising sun flag and just think Japan, and not the context surrounding the flag.
in some parts of Canada where Japanese folk were put in imprisonment camps during the war, it's not wise to wear a rising sun on your clothing.

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Re: Why does the Rising Sun flag get a pass?
« Reply #35 on: June 19, 2022, 12:56:22 PM »
It doesn’t.

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Re: Why does the Rising Sun flag get a pass?
« Reply #36 on: June 19, 2022, 01:49:34 PM »
As well as the Stars and Stripes or the Union Jack or basically every other flag. All are built on oppression, theft, and blood of the innocent.

Logic

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Re: Why does the Rising Sun flag get a pass?
« Reply #37 on: June 19, 2022, 02:59:43 PM »
In a similar vein to how the swatsika was a symbol well before Hitler made use of it and changed the way in which it is perceived, would it not also be possible to change how a symbol is perceived through popularisation and in turn disassociate the negative connotations? I'm not trying to say that people should go out waving the swatsika/rising-sun etc by any means, I just find it surreal how little time it can take for a symbol to become taboo.

In the case of the rising sun though, I can see how people would be unaware of its implications.




TheLurper

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Re: Why does the Rising Sun flag get a pass?
« Reply #38 on: June 19, 2022, 04:36:32 PM »
In a similar vein to how the swatsika was a symbol well before Hitler made use of it and changed the way in which it is perceived, would it not also be possible to change how a symbol is perceived through popularisation and in turn disassociate the negative connotations? I'm not trying to say that people should go out waving the swatsika/rising-sun etc by any means, I just find it surreal how little time it can take for a symbol to become taboo.

In the case of the rising sun though, I can see how people would be unaware of its implications.

In a similar vein, but also completely different, I wonder how swear words become swear words.

Like, how did tabarnak become a swear word in Quebec?

Quote from: ChuckRamone
I love when people bring up world hunger. It makes everything meaningless.
"That guy is double parked."
"Who cares? There are people starving to death! Besides, how does that affect you? Does it lessen the joy of parking?

Donatello

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Re: Why does the Rising Sun flag get a pass?
« Reply #39 on: June 19, 2022, 06:34:55 PM »
it's just a dope design. looks cooler than Japan's regular flag imo.

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Re: Why does the Rising Sun flag get a pass?
« Reply #40 on: June 19, 2022, 06:48:24 PM »
The short answer is because Americans aren’t taught about how bad Japan was during that period.

We’re taught that Hitler was bad, and we (not the Russians) defeated him, and then we dropped two “well deserved” nukes on Japan after beating them in the Pacific. I didn’t learn about how absolutely demonic Japanese Imperialism was until my late 20s, and that was from a random twitter thread.

I think a lot of it has to do with America not being concerned with what Japan did because it happened to non-white people primarily. If Japan had did the shit they had done to China to like Canadians we’d be taught about it just as much.

Freelancevagrant

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Re: Why does the Rising Sun flag get a pass?
« Reply #41 on: June 19, 2022, 07:41:10 PM »
Because people aren’t taught about the rape of Nanking or Unit 731, or the other millions of crimes against humanity the Japan committed.
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Mike Oxwelling

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Re: Why does the Rising Sun flag get a pass?
« Reply #42 on: June 19, 2022, 07:50:03 PM »
Is this a get in front of the line for the roller coaster ride pass?   

Owen

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Re: Why does the Rising Sun flag get a pass?
« Reply #43 on: June 19, 2022, 08:21:17 PM »
I would suggest that it has something to do with the Jewish diaspora having a lot more clout and a louder voice in the USA and western world in general than those who lived under Japanese occupation.

As someone else pointed out, the horrific nature of the holocaust may be more relatable to the average American due to a similarity in appearance than say the Japanese's crimes against humanity being committed against those from Asian backgrounds who are likely considered to be more distant to many people.

Guess it's similar to the global/Western response to the war in Ukraine compared to the endless tragedies seen in Iraq, Syria, Congo, Tibet and Xinjiang, Palestine, Myanmar etc etc
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itspizzapie

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Re: Why does the Rising Sun flag get a pass?
« Reply #44 on: June 20, 2022, 01:51:18 AM »
put some 50+ cream and avoid being unprotected at the hottest hours of the day

if you follow these simple steps there are no reasons to be scared of the sun my son

Hevonen

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Re: Why does the Rising Sun flag get a pass?
« Reply #45 on: June 20, 2022, 02:31:17 AM »
Always thought it was just some classic japan art

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Re: Why does the Rising Sun flag get a pass?
« Reply #46 on: June 20, 2022, 02:55:52 AM »
What everyone else said
It’s all down to Lack of education

WWII is whitewashed in Japanese schools
For a country that has a cultural issue of not being able to apologize or own up to mistakes I don’t think that it will change (if I remember correctly they removed some of the shitty things they did to the ryuukyuu islands from texts 10 or so years ago)


Also what @SaySo and @GISM have said in this thread and in the past… because people aren’t taught about this, things like the Swazi and iron cross etc are fashion accessories (I haven’t seen them in a while because I live in bum fluff nowhere and avoid people… but I’ve seen a few people rocking them for no other reason than to be a fashion edge lord)

Same with the rising sun… it’s a favorite amongst bousouzoku arse knuckles… just to be edgy



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Re: Why does the Rising Sun flag get a pass?
« Reply #47 on: June 20, 2022, 05:32:48 AM »
A lot of people don't know what that flag is. They probably should, but that's a separate topic. I don't think it gets a pass from anyone who knows what it is. The more brand recognition your hate symbol has, the less it is tolerated.

JANUS

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Re: Why does the Rising Sun flag get a pass?
« Reply #48 on: June 20, 2022, 05:41:13 AM »
Expand Quote
In a similar vein to how the swatsika was a symbol well before Hitler made use of it and changed the way in which it is perceived, would it not also be possible to change how a symbol is perceived through popularisation and in turn disassociate the negative connotations? I'm not trying to say that people should go out waving the swatsika/rising-sun etc by any means, I just find it surreal how little time it can take for a symbol to become taboo.

In the case of the rising sun though, I can see how people would be unaware of its implications.
[close]

In a similar vein, but also completely different, I wonder how swear words become swear words.

Like, how did tabarnak become a swear word in Quebec?

Apparently it’s because of the overwhelming power the Catholic Church wielded in Quebec. As such, the use of sacred words was considered taboo, thereby making them excellent curse words. Examples: tabarnaque = tabernacle = the place where the church keeps the communion regalia. Esti = hostie = the piece of bread that Catholics eat at communion.
And you can mix and match for bonus points. Thus, “tabarnak esti!” is 2x the blasphemies, and twice as powerful.
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Re: Why does the Rising Sun flag get a pass?
« Reply #49 on: June 20, 2022, 06:23:28 AM »
Honest truth is it's because westerners are ignorant of it's history. White people know about Nazi's and the European side of WW2, anything east of that and they have no frame of reference.

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Re: Why does the Rising Sun flag get a pass?
« Reply #50 on: June 20, 2022, 06:33:13 AM »
Honest truth is it's because westerners are ignorant of it's history. White people know about Nazi's and the European side of WW2, anything east of that and they have no frame of reference.

Right, just don’t mention that around the VA or the legion. Those old guys who pretend to have fought in the pacific theatre are really committed to the gag.
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Re: Why does the Rising Sun flag get a pass?
« Reply #51 on: June 20, 2022, 08:00:21 AM »
Not sure if just a design change or a change of meaning but Capcom removed it from E. Honda's stage in SFII.

This was where I first saw it and just assumed it was a design thing rather than a political thing.





after SF4 Vanilla you will notice they have basically removed all mention of countries / locations now other than the odd like "Shanghai Street stage" or "London Metro" stage names. They are moving more towards fake locations like Metro City to just distance themselves as much as possible from possible stereotyping. they did just put a "canadian" guy in a few years ago though with move names like "Ontario Drop" smh...
ONTARIO CANADA

TheLurper

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Re: Why does the Rising Sun flag get a pass?
« Reply #52 on: June 20, 2022, 08:14:58 AM »
I looked up the SF Canadian character. What an odd character.

It seems for fighting game designers draw on the idea of the lumberjack and an exaggerated stereotype of a guy from Alberta/Manitoba to represent Canada.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LfELgF9DX-Q

Quote from: ChuckRamone
I love when people bring up world hunger. It makes everything meaningless.
"That guy is double parked."
"Who cares? There are people starving to death! Besides, how does that affect you? Does it lessen the joy of parking?

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Re: Why does the Rising Sun flag get a pass?
« Reply #53 on: June 20, 2022, 08:50:53 AM »
I was unaware of the rising sun symbol/ideology until my Korean wife explained it to me 10+ years ago. I never learned much about it in school.

For those that are curious, the Asian side of the story gets pretty dark. Read Pachinko by Min Jin Lee or talk to Northern elderly Australians.
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Re: Why does the Rising Sun flag get a pass?
« Reply #54 on: June 22, 2022, 06:16:52 AM »
Expand Quote
Expand Quote
Not sure if just a design change or a change of meaning but capcom removed it from E. Honda's stage in SFII.

This was where I first saw it and just assumed it was a design thing rather than a political thing.




[close]

With that game being popular worldwide, especially in Asia, it’s safe to say they removed it to avoid offending the rest of their Asian market
[close]


This is correct there's even articles about it


In Honda’s background the Rising Sun flag and the guy holding the sign only flash on and off when someone wins a round - every SFII player knows that!

beandemon

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Re: Why does the Rising Sun flag get a pass?
« Reply #55 on: June 22, 2022, 06:49:19 AM »
Eurocentrism.

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Re: Why does the Rising Sun flag get a pass?
« Reply #56 on: June 22, 2022, 11:04:30 AM »
I was unaware of the rising sun symbol/ideology until my Korean wife explained it to me 10+ years ago. I never learned much about it in school.

For those that are curious, the Asian side of the story gets pretty dark. Read Pachinko by Min Jin Lee or talk to Northern elderly Australians.

I never heard of the bombing of Darwin until I actually went to Darwin. Unbelievably fucked.
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Re: Why does the Rising Sun flag get a pass?
« Reply #57 on: June 22, 2022, 08:40:47 PM »
The use of the rising sun long predates japanese imperialism and wasn't created as a symbol to represent it. Plain and simple. There's nothing more to this.

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Re: Why does the Rising Sun flag get a pass?
« Reply #58 on: June 22, 2022, 09:10:31 PM »
The use of the rising sun long predates japanese imperialism and wasn't created as a symbol to represent it. Plain and simple. There's nothing more to this.
symbol of peace, just like the swazi
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Re: Why does the Rising Sun flag get a pass?
« Reply #59 on: June 22, 2022, 10:12:28 PM »
I was unaware of so many of these graphics because a lot of the, haven’t been used for over ten years…..