McSame picked a women VP

[sebastian toombs]

you guys are still talking about this?  isnt the election over?

[Al Bania]

So McCain has Greenspan and Phil Graham helping him formulate his economic policy and nobody even raises questions in the mainstream media about this.  It boggles the mind.  Anyone else notice how Phil Graham has those shifty, beady little eyes?  He looks very diabolical and evil. 

That 2nd article that dagger linked is just from yesterday's Washington Post, I'm sure there will be more shit about it today and through the weekend.
The fact that the Wash.Post put that out there is pretty interesting.

But either way, just as McLame's chief advisor said -this election is not about the issues, its about the personalities of the candidates.

Shit is just getting really, really scary.

Populist, Millenarianistic, Fascism here we come!

[sebastian toombs]

stoked some gents hacked into palins yahoo email address...   hope they nabbed some incriminating stuff before it all got shut down

[grimcity]

So McCain has Greenspan and Phil Graham helping him formulate his economic policy and nobody even raises questions in the mainstream media about this.  It boggles the mind.  Anyone else notice how Phil Graham has those shifty, beady little eyes?  He looks very diabolical and evil. 

Greenspan (who I agree shares an assload of responsibility) was on the news this past week saying that this is the worst economic situation of his career... considering that the dude's been working since before dinosaurs, that's pretty fucked:


Privatized profit, socialized debt. I really don't understand how anyone that is against government oversight/regulation could ever utter the words "let the free market decide." There is no free market, just unchecked capitalism raping the economy and job market by a goddamned oligarchy.

Special thanks to Reagan, Bush, Clinton, and Bush for the fisting!

[NickDagger]

mhm.

Also if anyone's wondering what exactly is going on(I sure was), I found this helpful and hilarious:

http://100wordblog.files.wordpress.com/2008/02/subprime.pps

[Sleazy]

good find nick

[sweets]

good find nick

[grimcity]

Expand Quote

good find nick

[close]

[NickDagger]

In early March 2007, she invited the state Senate's leaders to her office for a preview of the pipeline legislation. To the astonishment of the five senators and their aides, she barely said a word for the hour. As staff members explained her signature plan, the governor was preoccupied with her two BlackBerries.

"It was so bizarre. We all talked about it afterwards," said a legislative source, one of three participants in the meeting who recounted the governor's silence. "We all said, 'What was that? Was she even paying attention?' "

[NickDagger]

    rubico 09/17/08(Wed)12:57:22 No.85782652

    Hello, /b/ as many of you might already know, last night sarah palin’s yahoo was “hacked” and caps were posted on /b/, i am the lurker who did it, and i would like to tell the story.

    In the past couple days news had come to light about palin using a yahoo mail account, it was in news stories and such, a thread was started full of newfags trying to do something that would not get this off the ground, for the next 2 hours the acct was locked from password recovery presumably from all this bullshit spamming.

    after the password recovery was reenabled, it took seriously 45 mins on wikipedia and google to find the info, Birthday? 15 seconds on wikipedia, zip code? well she had always been from wasilla, and it only has 2 zip codes (thanks online postal service!)

    the second was somewhat harder, the question was “where did you meet your spouse?” did some research, and apparently she had eloped with mister palin after college, if youll look on some of the screenshits that I took and other fellow anon have so graciously put on photobucket you will see the google search for “palin eloped” or some such in one of the tabs.

    I found out later though more research that they met at high school, so I did variations of that, high, high school, eventually hit on “Wasilla high” I promptly changed the password to popcorn and took a cold shower…

    >> rubico 09/17/08(Wed)12:58:04 No.85782727

    this is all verifiable if some anal /b/tard wants to think Im a troll, and there isn’t any hard proof to the contrary, but anyone who had followed the thread from the beginning to the 404 will know I probably am not, the picture I posted this topic with is the same one as the original thread.

    I read though the emails… ALL OF THEM… before I posted, and what I concluded was anticlimactic, there was nothing there, nothing incriminating, nothing that would derail her campaign as I had hoped, all I saw was personal stuff, some clerical stuff from when she was governor…. And pictures of her family

    I then started a topic on /b/, peeps asked for pics or gtfo and I obliged, then it started to get big

    Earlier it was just some prank to me, I really wanted to get something incriminating which I was sure there would be, just like all of you anon out there that you think there was some missed opportunity of glory, well there WAS NOTHING, I read everything, every little blackberry confirmation… all the pictures, and there was nothing, and it finally set in, THIS internet was serious business, yes I was behind a proxy, only one, if this shit ever got to the FBI I was fucked, I panicked, i still wanted the stuff out there but I didn’t know how to rapidshit all that stuff, so I posted the pass on /b/, and then promptly deleted everything, and unplugged my internet and just sat there in a comatose state

    Then the white knight fucker came along, and did it in for everyone, I trusted /b/ with that email password, I had gotten done what I could do well, then passed the torch , all to be let down by the douchebaggery, good job /b/, this is why we cant have nice things.

[NickDagger]

Fascinating piece on Mccain and POWs that were left behind in Vietnam, turns out he is one of the reasons many of POWs were never returned.

http://www.nationinstitute.org/p/schanberg09182008pt1

[Rocuronium]

I thought of a funny retort:

Next time the douches from the RNC congratulate themselves because she has "executive experience" remember: so did Bush.

....and as we know, he continues to bankrupt every organization he touches.


So join my petition to:
Send W to Iran!
Send W to North Korea!
Send W to the Afghan-Pakistan border!

the man's a walking calamity, the 10 plagues combined into one, a natural disaster.

By the way, in order to shut any McCain supporters up just ask them who they voted for in 2004.
If they tell the truth (Bush): ask them why anyone should respect their political opinions and choices ever again.
If they lie (Kerry, or did not vote for anyone): then it must be because they disagreed with the bush doctorine, so why are they backing up his candidate now?

[Ronald Wilson Reagan]

Expand Quote

So McCain has Greenspan and Phil Graham helping him formulate his economic policy and nobody even raises questions in the mainstream media about this.  It boggles the mind.  Anyone else notice how Phil Graham has those shifty, beady little eyes?  He looks very diabolical and evil. 

[close]

Greenspan (who I agree shares an assload of responsibility) was on the news this past week saying that this is the worst economic situation of his career... considering that the dude's been working since before dinosaurs, that's pretty fucked:


Privatized profit, socialized debt. I really don't understand how anyone that is against government oversight/regulation could ever utter the words "let the free market decide." There is no free market, just unchecked capitalism raping the economy and job market by a goddamned oligarchy.

Special thanks to Reagan, Bush, Clinton, and Bush for the fisting!

ESPECIALLY REAGAN. FUCK HIS DEAD ASS. He was the guy who came up with the nutcase plan to deregulate industry, and made it become the party standard. The BUshes or Clinton wouldn't have gone this way if it wasn't for Reagan's popularization of the idea.
Hey, where are our let the market decide anti-regulation people?
Newton, you are one, right? I guess I can stop going backward to show the overwhelming evidence that big business, when unregulated, is predatory and destructive to the whole economy. Y'all gonna shut up about these idealistic situations that will never occur and face the fact that regulation is necessary yet?

[NickDagger]

[NickDagger]

rss feed: http://www.236.com/video/get_your_war_on.xml

http://www.236.com/video/2008/sarah_palin_to_the_nth_power_9002.php

[Rocuronium]

FROM THE NYT:

Finger-Pointing in Financial Crisis Is Directed at Bush

Article Tools Sponsored By
By MARK LANDLER and SHERYL GAY STOLBERG
Published: September 19, 2008

WASHINGTON — For his entire presidency, George W. Bush has tried to avoid the fate of his father, brought low by a feeble economy. Now, as the financial crisis radiates far beyond Wall Street, Mr. Bush faces an even grimmer prospect: being blamed, at least in part, for an economic breakdown.

“There will be ample opportunity to debate the origins of this problem,” Mr. Bush said in the Rose Garden on Friday. “Now is the time to solve it.”

But in Washington, on Wall Street and on the presidential campaign trail, the debate has already begun.

Senator Barack Obama, the Democratic presidential nominee, denounces what he calls the Bush administration’s “failed philosophy.”

Senator John McCain, the Republican, claimed Friday that “the administration did nothing” to rein in the mortgage giants Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac, even though the White House did push some reforms on Capitol Hill.

These experts, from both political parties, say Mr. Bush’s early personnel choices and overarching antipathy toward regulation created a climate, that, if it did not set off the turmoil, almost certainly aggravated it.

The president’s first two Treasury secretaries, for instance, lacked the kind of Wall Street expertise that might have helped them raise red flags about the use of complex financial instruments that are at the heart of the crisis.

[NickDagger]

If Obama loses now, it should be clear we live in a  racist country.

[NickDagger]

Sam Harris from Newsweek:

What is so unnerving about the candidacy of Sarah Palin is the degree to which she represents—and her supporters celebrate—the joyful marriage of confidence and ignorance. Watching her deny to Gibson that she had ever harbored the slightest doubt about her readiness to take command of the world's only superpower, one got the feeling that Palin would gladly assume any responsibility on earth:

"Governor Palin, are you ready at this moment to perform surgery on this child's brain?"

"Of course, Charlie. I have several boys of my own, and I'm an avid hunter."

"But governor, this is neurosurgery, and you have no training as a surgeon of any kind."

"That's just the point, Charlie. The American people want change in how we make medical decisions in this country. And when faced with a challenge, you cannot blink."

The prospects of a Palin administration are far more frightening, in fact, than those of a Palin Institute for Pediatric Neurosurgery. Ask yourself: how has "elitism" become a bad word in American politics? There is simply no other walk of life in which extraordinary talent and rigorous training are denigrated. We want elite pilots to fly our planes, elite troops to undertake our most critical missions, elite athletes to represent us in competition and elite scientists to devote the most productive years of their lives to curing our diseases. And yet, when it comes time to vest people with even greater responsibilities, we consider it a virtue to shun any and all standards of excellence. When it comes to choosing the people whose thoughts and actions will decide the fates of millions, then we suddenly want someone just like us, someone fit to have a beer with, someone down-to-earth—in fact, almost anyone, provided that he or she doesn't seem too intelligent or well educated.

[Dr Newton]

I've given up on you guys a long time ago, but I really am curious here. Does that guy not know the definition of "elitism" as it is being negatively applied to Barack Obama?

[Sleazy]

Newton, can you talk a bit about what policy's from Mccain that your backing and what ones from Obama that you dislike.

[Dr Newton]

Newton, can you talk a bit about what policy's from Mccain that your backing and what ones from Obama that you dislike.

I have an intense hatred for Barack Obama, and I disagree with virtually everything he stands for economically -- higher taxes on the rich, wealth redistribution to the UN, "making government cooler," the fact that he won't drill ANWR, his spending programs that will increase this country's debt, the fact that his numbers do not add up when it comes to his ideas for social spending, etc. Socially I tend to agree with the Democrats, but I'm not even sold in that area. He's not talking about increasing social freedoms. Instead, he chose a running mate that has built a career partially on fighting the piece of shit drug war, and censoring rap CDs. Big government socially and economically.... no thank you. He also pulled this shit last week:

http://www.nypost.com/seven/09152008/postopinion/opedcolumnists/obama_tried_to_stall_gis_iraq_withdrawal_129150.htm


That's right. The Chosen One is continuing the politicize a war for his own personal gain! Fuck Barack Obama.

[Al Bania]

Expand Quote

Newton, can you talk a bit about what policy's from Mccain that your backing and what ones from Obama that you dislike.

[close]

I have an intense hatred for Barack Obama, and I disagree with virtually everything he stands for economically -- higher taxes on the rich, wealth redistribution to the UN, "making government cooler," the fact that he won't drill ANWR, his spending programs that will increase this country's debt, the fact that his numbers do not add up when it comes to his ideas for social spending, etc. Socially I tend to agree with the Democrats, but I'm not even sold in that area. He's not talking about increasing social freedoms. Instead, he chose a running mate that has built a career partially on fighting the piece of shit drug war, and censoring rap CDs. Big government socially and economically.... no thank you. He also pulled this shit last week:

http://www.nypost.com/seven/09152008/postopinion/opedcolumnists/obama_tried_to_stall_gis_iraq_withdrawal_129150.htm


That's right. The Chosen One is continuing the politicize a war for his own personal gain! Fuck Barack Obama.

ok.
you answered part of the question,
now for the first part - what Mccain policies are you backing?
or are you just going to go with their style of only answering the part of the questions that you want to say, and ignoring the other half of the question?

[Sleazy]

For each policy of Barak that you don't care for could you please explain what the Mccain plan is that addresses that issue and why it addresses it better. I'm not calling you out, I'll do the same below on why I support Obama. I find policies more important than politicians so I'll spare you all the obvious Mccain\Palin jabs.

I'm about as swing as you get when it comes to voters so making your case will mean more wind in your parties sail. I'm asking this not just because I want to hear your opinions on his policies, it's also because I have no idea about MCCains policies. I've tried researching it but they didn't have his policies on their site or anywhere that I could find them on the web last time I looked. (edit: I just looked and they have a new site that talks to his policies a bit. I read through them a bit but only in energy. I'll review them more as I have time).

I think talking about policies is the most productive way to convert people like myself so hopefully you feel the same and will step up to defend your choice.

Here's the big issues that concern me and how I feel Obama's stated policies address them:

Corporations Gone Wild
They've been shitting all over us for a long time, taking all they can and not putting anything back.
- Obama's tax plan calls for higher taxes for companys that do things that go against working Americans like outsourcing jobs. I personally have been laid off on average once a year from corporate jobs since graduating college. And I wasn't one of a few. Each time about 50% of the staff went and shops were setup overseas to lower cost.

Economy
Our current economic recession is very heavy in retail, manufacturing, transportation, etc... (consumer spending type industries)
- Obama's tax plan is the opposite of trickle down which is geared not only to give citizens who make under 250 tax breaks just for fun, this will also increase the disposable incomes of the majority of Americans who will turn around and spend that money on clothes, travel, applances, ect... which will revitalize those industries and help strengthen the economy. If you give more tax relief or even just continue the Bush tax relief to the super rich, then this will have no effect on consumer spending. I know this may be bad for your family out in the Hills but for 94% of Americans, it's a bad thing and eventhough my wife and I could realistically be effected by this tax increase one day, I fully back it.

Foriegn Policy and Iraq
The article you pasted seems in accurate to me. Apart from being obviously biased it also just this writers opinion on whether or not Obama's time table is accurate. He feels it's not accurate and his first assumption is that the Obama administration won't be able to start work on any of it's policies until febuary next year. Given that there is only 40 or so days left until the election is over and that this article is obviously coming from a biased source, I'd say this isn't very credible and I'd trust Obama's clearly stated plans over this.

- Obama has a time table for withdraw on the table. If you think he's not thinking about reelection your crazy so he will have to have troups out before the next election. Whether he's able to hit 16 month goal or if it ends up being 6 months before the next election, at least with him I know it'll be in the next four years. MCCain would just be more of the bush horizon and lies.
- He's willing to not "politicize" diplomacy, by not playing the good guys, bad guys game with other countrys like Iran, Venasula, etc... and to actually sit down and talk with these people.

Energy
He's put forth a detailed plan for taking us away from foriegn Oil dependence and is commited to preserving our coast lines and wildlife for future generations. I'd like to think I could take my grand kids to a nice beach without having to go to Asia and by that time we will surely be back in the same boat if we don't change to a different source of energy. While you may dissagree about what the next energy source should be, I think you'd be foolish to think that we don't need to move away from oil and Obama is the only candidate that has a policy that addresses this on the table.

Mccain is not only not moving us away from Oil, he's discouraging domestic production of ethonal and encouraging importing of it. He's actually creataing a situation we're we'd also be more likely to be dependent on foriegn ethanol if we made the switch but really he's just keeping the oil on top as would be expected.

John McCain will repeal the 54 cents per gallon tax on imported sugar-based ethanol, increasing competition, and lowering prices of gasoline at the pump.


John McCain will roll back corn-based ethanol mandates, which are contributing to the rising cost of food.

http://www.johnmccain.com/Issues/JobsforAmerica/relief.htm

Why would he do this? Surely his plan includes some way of addressing the oil situation and the inflation, recession and lower standard of living that accompanies it. Well here's his plan.

John McCain believes we should send a strong message to world markets. Under his plan, the United States will be telling oil producing countries and oil speculators that our dependence on foreign oil will come to an end - and the impact will be lower prices at the pump.

http://www.johnmccain.com/Issues/JobsforAmerica/relief.htm

Wow, who would of thought that would work. To bad Obama didn't think of simply telling them to lower prices, maybe he's not as smart as his degrees would suggest.

Mccain's answer to cheaper, cleaner energy

Nuclear power is a proven, reliable, zero-emission source of energy, and it is time to recommit to advancing our use of nuclear power.

I guess radoactive waste is technically clean???




Come on Newton, your smarter then this. Obviously this guy is looking out for oil\corporations and not trying to fix our real problems. If your down for chearing for your team, that's cool, but at least admidt that that's what your doing.

[Dr Newton]

I'm about as swing as you get when it comes to voters so making your case will mean more wind in your parties sail. I'm asking this not just because I want to hear your opinions on his policies, it's also because I have no idea about MCCains policies. I've tried researching it but they didn't have his policies on their site or anywhere that I could find them on the web last time I looked. (edit: I just looked and they have a new site that talks to his policies a bit. I read through them a bit but only in energy. I'll review them more as I have time).

HAHA, you're a "swing voter".... have you voted for one non-DNC candidate in your life? I've heard nothing from you but liberal positions on ever issue you've discussed.

Here's the big issues that concern me and how I feel Obama's stated policies address them:

Corporations Gone Wild
They've been shitting all over us for a long time, taking all they can and not putting anything back.
- Obama's tax plan calls for higher taxes for companys that do things that go against working Americans like outsourcing jobs. I personally have been laid off on average once a year from corporate jobs since graduating college. And I wasn't one of a few. Each time about 50% of the staff went and shops were setup overseas to lower cost.

Corporations are going overseas.... and you think raising taxes is going to cause them to want to come back? Barack Obama cannot tax corporation's incomes that are made overseas to begin with. This punitive measure would probably just drive them from doing business within the United States at all. The top 10% of earners Barack Obama wants to raise taxes on provide about 80% of the US job market in the form of small to mid sized businesses. Only a tiny portion of these people are "fat cat CEOs" drawing huge corporate bonuses. Raising the costs of these businesses will lead to cutbacks in terms of the employment opportunities that they provide. I personally am in favor of implementing the FairTax to solve this problem, so I disagree with John McCain.





Economy
Our current economic recession is very heavy in retail, manufacturing, transportation, etc... (consumer spending type industries)
- Obama's tax plan is the opposite of trickle down which is geared not only to give citizens who make under 250 tax breaks just for fun, this will also increase the disposable incomes of the majority of Americans who will turn around and spend that money on clothes, travel, applances, ect... which will revitalize those industries and help strengthen the economy. If you give more tax relief or even just continue the Bush tax relief to the super rich, then this will have no effect on consumer spending. I know this may be bad for your family out in the Hills but for 94% of Americans, it's a bad thing and eventhough my wife and I could realistically be effected by this tax increase one day, I fully back it. I actually support a movement called the FairTax, which John McCain does not support.

http:http://www.fairtax.org/site/PageServer?pagename=mfg_home/www.fairtax.org/site/PageServer?pagename=mfg_home

Foriegn Policy and Iraq
The article you pasted seems in accurate to me. Apart from being obviously biased it also just this writers opinion on whether or not Obama's time table is accurate. He feels it's not accurate and his first assumption is that the Obama administration won't be able to start work on any of it's policies until febuary next year. Given that there is only 40 or so days left until the election is over and that this article is obviously coming from a biased source, I'd say this isn't very credible and I'd trust Obama's clearly stated plans over this.

Pick out the facts from it if you want. I haven't seen it being covered in the mainstream media at all.

- Obama has a time table for withdraw on the table. If you think he's not thinking about reelection your crazy so he will have to have troups out before the next election. Whether he's able to hit 16 month goal or if it ends up being 6 months before the next election, at least with him I know it'll be in the next four years. MCCain would just be more of the bush horizon and lies.
- He's willing to not "politicize" diplomacy, by not playing the good guys, bad guys game with other countrys like Iran, Venasula, etc... and to actually sit down and talk with these people.

Troop with drawl has already started as of February of 2009. John McCain has expressed strong interest in troop with drawl from Iraq and the idea that he wouldn't have the troops out in four years is pretty absurd. He says he wants the troops out. If you're taking Obama's word for it, why not McCain's?

Energy
He's put forth a detailed plan for taking us away from foriegn Oil dependence and is commited to preserving our coast lines and wildlife for future generations. I'd like to think I could take my grand kids to a nice beach without having to go to Asia and by that time we will surely be back in the same boat if we don't change to a different source of energy. While you may dissagree about what the next energy source should be, I think you'd be foolish to think that we don't need to move away from oil and Obama is the only candidate that has a policy that addresses this on the table.

Mccain is not only not moving us away from Oil, he's discouraging domestic production of ethonal and encouraging importing of it. He's actually creataing a situation we're we'd also be more likely to be dependent on foriegn ethanol if we made the switch but really he's just keeping the oil on top as would be expected.

Expand Quote

John McCain will repeal the 54 cents per gallon tax on imported sugar-based ethanol, increasing competition, and lowering prices of at the pump.


John McCain will roll back corn-based ethanol mandates, which are contributing to the rising cost of food.

http://www.johnmccain.com/Issues/JobsforAmerica/relief.htm

[close]

In case you haven't noticed, ethanol has caused a crisis throughout the world.... food prices are soaring thanks to these idiotic mandates, and people across the world are literally starving to death. The government should not be controlling the factors of production to begin with, and if you disagree with that you need to vote for Barack Obama. The fact is that transitioning away from oil is not going to happen in five, ten, fifteen, or even twenty years -- most Americans need relief NOW. Hell, if cars ran on air tomorrow, there would still be oil dependence in America. How is every single person in the United States going to afford a new car? How is every single industry going to convert to new energy in just a few years? Investment in alternative energy does not solve these problems.

Why would he do this? Surely his plan includes some way of addressing the oil situation and the inflation, recession and lower standard of living that accompanies it. Well here's his plan.

Expand Quote

Expand Quote

John McCain believes we should send a strong message to world markets. Under his plan, the United States will be telling oil producing countries and oil speculators that our dependence on foreign oil will come to an end - and the impact will be lower prices at the pump.

http://www.johnmccain.com/Issues/JobsforAmerica/relief.htm

[close]

Wow, who would of thought that would work. To bad Obama didn't think of simply telling them to lower prices, maybe he's not as smart as his degrees would suggest.

[close]

Clear straw man argument....

Mccain's answer to cheaper, cleaner energy

Expand Quote

Nuclear power is a proven, reliable, zero-emission source of energy, and it is time to recommit to advancing our use of nuclear power.

[close]

I guess radoactive waste is technically clean???

Obama is extremely vague, but he says he would like to explore nuclear energy also. They're using it in Europe now, so to me it doesn't sound like much of a problem.

[NickDagger]

Stop posting.

[Sleazy]

Expand Quote

I'm about as swing as you get when it comes to voters so making your case will mean more wind in your parties sail. I'm asking this not just because I want to hear your opinions on his policies, it's also because I have no idea about MCCains policies. I've tried researching it but they didn't have his policies on their site or anywhere that I could find them on the web last time I looked. (edit: I just looked and they have a new site that talks to his policies a bit. I read through them a bit but only in energy. I'll review them more as I have time).

[close]

HAHA, you're a "swing voter".... have you voted for one non-DNC candidate in your life? I've heard nothing from you but liberal positions on ever issue you've discussed.

I voted for bush on his first term and I was planning too vote republican this time because I wanted to ensure that neither party had too much power before I found out who the candidates were, which are both things I've talked about on here in the past. As far as "nothing but liberal positions from me" goes, you'd know better than I would, I don't keep up with political, idelogical classification as I feel it is for non-thinkers but I'm fairly certain that I'm not liberal on issues like capital punishment, imigration, rascism, etc...

Expand Quote

Here's the big issues that concern me and how I feel Obama's stated policies address them:

Corporations Gone Wild
They've been shitting all over us for a long time, taking all they can and not putting anything back.
- Obama's tax plan calls for higher taxes for companys that do things that go against working Americans like outsourcing jobs. I personally have been laid off on average once a year from corporate jobs since graduating college. And I wasn't one of a few. Each time about 50% of the staff went and shops were setup overseas to lower cost.

[close]

Corporations are going overseas.... and you think raising taxes is going to cause them to want to come back? Barack Obama cannot tax corporation's incomes that are made overseas to begin with. This punitive measure would probably just drive them from doing business within the United States at all. The top 10% of earners Barack Obama wants to raise taxes on provide about 80% of the US job market in the form of small to mid sized businesses. Only a tiny portion of these people are "fat cat CEOs" drawing huge corporate bonuses. Raising the costs of these businesses will lead to cutbacks in terms of the employment opportunities that they provide. I personally am in favor of implementing the FairTax to solve this problem, so I disagree with John McCain.

There not going overseas, there just shipping the jobs there. The C managers and board don't want to move overseas. American corporations will stay in America but the jobs they create wont unless we make it more profitable to do so.

Economy
Our current economic recession is very heavy in retail, manufacturing, transportation, etc... (consumer spending type industries)
- Obama's tax plan is the opposite of trickle down which is geared not only to give citizens who make under 250 tax breaks just for fun, this will also increase the disposable incomes of the majority of Americans who will turn around and spend that money on clothes, travel, applances, ect... which will revitalize those industries and help strengthen the economy. If you give more tax relief or even just continue the Bush tax relief to the super rich, then this will have no effect on consumer spending. I know this may be bad for your family out in the Hills but for 94% of Americans, it's a bad thing and eventhough my wife and I could realistically be effected by this tax increase one day, I fully back it. I actually support a movement called the FairTax, which John McCain does not support.

http:http://www.fairtax.org/site/PageServer?pagename=mfg_home/www.fairtax.org/site/PageServer?pagename=mfg_home

There's more than one way to analyze equality and precentage of wealth is more fair in my opinion than a flat tax. I actually prefer a progressive tax. If your making over 250 a year then you need to give a little love back to the country that made that possible. Also, Barack's tax policies only restore the rich tax back to what it was under Regan, so he's not exactly raping them, just correcting the wrong that was done by Bush.

Expand Quote

- Obama has a time table for withdraw on the table. If you think he's not thinking about reelection your crazy so he will have to have troups out before the next election. Whether he's able to hit 16 month goal or if it ends up being 6 months before the next election, at least with him I know it'll be in the next four years. MCCain would just be more of the bush horizon and lies.
- He's willing to not "politicize" diplomacy, by not playing the good guys, bad guys game with other countrys like Iran, Venasula, etc... and to actually sit down and talk with these people.

[close]

Troop with drawl has already started as of February of 2009. John McCain has expressed strong interest in troop with drawl from Iraq and the idea that he wouldn't have the troops out in four years is pretty absurd. He says he wants the troops out. If you're taking Obama's word for it, why not McCain's?

Him not being willing to commit to a timetable makes me prefer and trust Obama's position more.

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Energy
He's put forth a detailed plan for taking us away from foriegn Oil dependence and is commited to preserving our coast lines and wildlife for future generations. I'd like to think I could take my grand kids to a nice beach without having to go to Asia and by that time we will surely be back in the same boat if we don't change to a different source of energy. While you may dissagree about what the next energy source should be, I think you'd be foolish to think that we don't need to move away from oil and Obama is the only candidate that has a policy that addresses this on the table.

Mccain is not only not moving us away from Oil, he's discouraging domestic production of ethonal and encouraging importing of it. He's actually creataing a situation we're we'd also be more likely to be dependent on foriegn ethanol if we made the switch but really he's just keeping the oil on top as would be expected.

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John McCain will repeal the 54 cents per gallon tax on imported sugar-based ethanol, increasing competition, and lowering prices of at the pump.


John McCain will roll back corn-based ethanol mandates, which are contributing to the rising cost of food.

http://www.johnmccain.com/Issues/JobsforAmerica/relief.htm

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In case you haven't noticed, ethanol has caused a crisis throughout the world.... food prices are soaring thanks to these idiotic mandates, and people across the world are literally starving to death. The government should not be controlling the factors of production to begin with, and if you disagree with that you need to vote for Barack Obama. The fact is that transitioning away from oil is not going to happen in five, ten, fifteen, or even twenty years -- most Americans need relief NOW. Hell, if cars ran on air tomorrow, there would still be oil dependence in America. How is every single person in the United States going to afford a new car? How is every single industry going to convert to new energy in just a few years? Investment in alternative energy does not solve these problems.

It's long term planning over short term. Take any intro economics class and you'll learn the virtues of long term planning and why it should be prefered.

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Why would he do this? Surely his plan includes some way of addressing the oil situation and the inflation, recession and lower standard of living that accompanies it. Well here's his plan.

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John McCain believes we should send a strong message to world markets. Under his plan, the United States will be telling oil producing countries and oil speculators that our dependence on foreign oil will come to an end - and the impact will be lower prices at the pump.

http://www.johnmccain.com/Issues/JobsforAmerica/relief.htm

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Wow, who would of thought that would work. To bad Obama didn't think of simply telling them to lower prices, maybe he's not as smart as his degrees would suggest.

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Clear straw man argument....

OK so then correctly interpret it for me. I pasted the text off his site, there's nothing missing there but if you think I missrepresented how shallow and absent his plan is, then please enlighten me.

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Mccain's answer to cheaper, cleaner energy

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Nuclear power is a proven, reliable, zero-emission source of energy, and it is time to recommit to advancing our use of nuclear power.

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I guess radoactive waste is technically clean???

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Obama is extremely vague, but he says he would like to explore nuclear energy also. They're using it in Europe now, so to me it doesn't sound like much of a problem.

Obama also has a real clean energy plan on the table. He's not just a continuation of the current energy priorites and technologies, he wants to try something different. He's just open to more options than Mccain.

[BriDen]

I'll just leave this here

[Gatoraids]

So did anyone else hear about the changes in the vice president debate to make things easier for Mrs Palin? Talk about sexist, if a woman needs things made easier for her, isn't that sexist? I don't think women firefighters have someone carry their hoses? Do women doctors have men do all the diagnosing? And this woman is suppossed to be second in command? Anyone who votes for her and Mcbush needs to have their head examined.

[Sleazy]

source?

[Dr Newton]

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I'm about as swing as you get when it comes to voters so making your case will mean more wind in your parties sail. I'm asking this not just because I want to hear your opinions on his policies, it's also because I have no idea about MCCains policies. I've tried researching it but they didn't have his policies on their site or anywhere that I could find them on the web last time I looked. (edit: I just looked and they have a new site that talks to his policies a bit. I read through them a bit but only in energy. I'll review them more as I have time).

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HAHA, you're a "swing voter".... have you voted for one non-DNC candidate in your life? I've heard nothing from you but liberal positions on ever issue you've discussed.

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I voted for bush on his first term and I was planning too vote republican this time because I wanted to ensure that neither party had too much power before I found out who the candidates were, which are both things I've talked about on here in the past. As far as "nothing but liberal positions from me" goes, you'd know better than I would, I don't keep up with political, idelogical classification as I feel it is for non-thinkers but I'm fairly certain that I'm not liberal on issues like capital punishment, imigration, rascism, etc...

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Here's the big issues that concern me and how I feel Obama's stated policies address them:

Corporations Gone Wild
They've been shitting all over us for a long time, taking all they can and not putting anything back.
- Obama's tax plan calls for higher taxes for companys that do things that go against working Americans like outsourcing jobs. I personally have been laid off on average once a year from corporate jobs since graduating college. And I wasn't one of a few. Each time about 50% of the staff went and shops were setup overseas to lower cost.

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Corporations are going overseas.... and you think raising taxes is going to cause them to want to come back? Barack Obama cannot tax corporation's incomes that are made overseas to begin with. This punitive measure would probably just drive them from doing business within the United States at all. The top 10% of earners Barack Obama wants to raise taxes on provide about 80% of the US job market in the form of small to mid sized businesses. Only a tiny portion of these people are "fat cat CEOs" drawing huge corporate bonuses. Raising the costs of these businesses will lead to cutbacks in terms of the employment opportunities that they provide. I personally am in favor of implementing the FairTax to solve this problem, so I disagree with John McCain.

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There not going overseas, there just shipping the jobs there. The C managers and board don't want to move overseas. American corporations will stay in America but the jobs they create wont unless we make it more profitable to do so.

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Economy
Our current economic recession is very heavy in retail, manufacturing, transportation, etc... (consumer spending type industries)
- Obama's tax plan is the opposite of trickle down which is geared not only to give citizens who make under 250 tax breaks just for fun, this will also increase the disposable incomes of the majority of Americans who will turn around and spend that money on clothes, travel, applances, ect... which will revitalize those industries and help strengthen the economy. If you give more tax relief or even just continue the Bush tax relief to the super rich, then this will have no effect on consumer spending. I know this may be bad for your family out in the Hills but for 94% of Americans, it's a bad thing and eventhough my wife and I could realistically be effected by this tax increase one day, I fully back it. I actually support a movement called the FairTax, which John McCain does not support.

http:http://www.fairtax.org/site/PageServer?pagename=mfg_home/www.fairtax.org/site/PageServer?pagename=mfg_home

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There's more than one way to analyze equality and precentage of wealth is more fair in my opinion than a flat tax. I actually prefer a progressive tax. If your making over 250 a year then you need to give a little love back to the country that made that possible. Also, Barack's tax policies only restore the rich tax back to what it was under Regan, so he's not exactly raping them, just correcting the wrong that was done by Bush.

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- Obama has a time table for withdraw on the table. If you think he's not thinking about reelection your crazy so he will have to have troups out before the next election. Whether he's able to hit 16 month goal or if it ends up being 6 months before the next election, at least with him I know it'll be in the next four years. MCCain would just be more of the bush horizon and lies.
- He's willing to not "politicize" diplomacy, by not playing the good guys, bad guys game with other countrys like Iran, Venasula, etc... and to actually sit down and talk with these people.

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Troop with drawl has already started as of February of 2009. John McCain has expressed strong interest in troop with drawl from Iraq and the idea that he wouldn't have the troops out in four years is pretty absurd. He says he wants the troops out. If you're taking Obama's word for it, why not McCain's?

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Him not being willing to commit to a timetable makes me prefer and trust Obama's position more.

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Energy
He's put forth a detailed plan for taking us away from foriegn Oil dependence and is commited to preserving our coast lines and wildlife for future generations. I'd like to think I could take my grand kids to a nice beach without having to go to Asia and by that time we will surely be back in the same boat if we don't change to a different source of energy. While you may dissagree about what the next energy source should be, I think you'd be foolish to think that we don't need to move away from oil and Obama is the only candidate that has a policy that addresses this on the table.

Mccain is not only not moving us away from Oil, he's discouraging domestic production of ethonal and encouraging importing of it. He's actually creataing a situation we're we'd also be more likely to be dependent on foriegn ethanol if we made the switch but really he's just keeping the oil on top as would be expected.

Expand Quote

John McCain will repeal the 54 cents per gallon tax on imported sugar-based ethanol, increasing competition, and lowering prices of at the pump.


John McCain will roll back corn-based ethanol mandates, which are contributing to the rising cost of food.

http://www.johnmccain.com/Issues/JobsforAmerica/relief.htm

[close]

[close]

In case you haven't noticed, ethanol has caused a crisis throughout the world.... food prices are soaring thanks to these idiotic mandates, and people across the world are literally starving to death. The government should not be controlling the factors of production to begin with, and if you disagree with that you need to vote for Barack Obama. The fact is that transitioning away from oil is not going to happen in five, ten, fifteen, or even twenty years -- most Americans need relief NOW. Hell, if cars ran on air tomorrow, there would still be oil dependence in America. How is every single person in the United States going to afford a new car? How is every single industry going to convert to new energy in just a few years? Investment in alternative energy does not solve these problems.

[close]

It's long term planning over short term. Take any intro economics class and you'll learn the virtues of long term planning and why it should be prefered.

Expand Quote

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Why would he do this? Surely his plan includes some way of addressing the oil situation and the inflation, recession and lower standard of living that accompanies it. Well here's his plan.

Expand Quote

Expand Quote

John McCain believes we should send a strong message to world markets. Under his plan, the United States will be telling oil producing countries and oil speculators that our dependence on foreign oil will come to an end - and the impact will be lower prices at the pump.

http://www.johnmccain.com/Issues/JobsforAmerica/relief.htm

[close]

Wow, who would of thought that would work. To bad Obama didn't think of simply telling them to lower prices, maybe he's not as smart as his degrees would suggest.

[close]

[close]

Clear straw man argument....

[close]

OK so then correctly interpret it for me. I pasted the text off his site, there's nothing missing there but if you think I missrepresented how shallow and absent his plan is, then please enlighten me.

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Mccain's answer to cheaper, cleaner energy

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Nuclear power is a proven, reliable, zero-emission source of energy, and it is time to recommit to advancing our use of nuclear power.

[close]

I guess radoactive waste is technically clean???

[close]

Obama is extremely vague, but he says he would like to explore nuclear energy also. They're using it in Europe now, so to me it doesn't sound like much of a problem.

[close]

Obama also has a real clean energy plan on the table. He's not just a continuation of the current energy priorites and technologies, he wants to try something different. He's just open to more options than Mccain.

Okay, well then vote for Barack Obama.

By the way, the FairTax is not a flat tax. You are commenting on a subject you know absolutely nothing about, once again.