Author Topic: Alien Workshop x Right Wing ?!  (Read 36759 times)

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runa

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Alien Workshop x Right Wing ?!
« on: January 18, 2013, 03:50:47 AM »
Can someone explain this to me?

On Alex Jones' infowars.com they have these decks that are supposed to be a collaboration between them and Alien Workshop, is this legit? It's scary to think that the Workshop would be behind this.

http://www.infowarsshop.com/Divide-And-Conquer-Skate-Deck_p_852.html

Dirty_Ratlips

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Re: Alien Workshop x Right Wing ?!
« Reply #1 on: January 18, 2013, 04:10:05 AM »
Its on the website...

"The Infowars "Divide and Conquer" skate deck strikes down the false left/right, republican/democrat paradigm.  Open minds and don't be a slave to tyranny."

   

hellmanovo

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Re: Alien Workshop x Right Wing ?!
« Reply #2 on: January 18, 2013, 04:45:55 AM »
fucking hell shut up alien workshop you wankers stop trying to be something more special than a bunch of well dressed dudes that are good at riding skateboards

BarcelonaCEO

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Re: Alien Workshop x Right Wing ?!
« Reply #3 on: January 18, 2013, 05:40:05 AM »
dude, that's why you kids need to start going to class and stop taking oxy and crack, seriously 'merica is fucked.

You dont even understand there is no such thing as democracy, slavery is still going so badly, I would even say it is the most fascist regime since the nazis. This graphic is about the government controlling the media, the media controlling the general public opinion on politics, and therefore the government controlling people destiny.

Until america gets his own universal health care system poor people will still die without a chance. If you dont have money then you are worth less than shit. Human rights are bullshit. All this fuels the drug and hampa problem.

But whatever, the president is black so everything is good.

TMKF

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Re: Alien Workshop x Right Wing ?!
« Reply #4 on: January 18, 2013, 05:43:52 AM »
Alien Workshop has always had graphics exposing government control and conspiracies. The brainwash graphic came out in the mid 90s and the "divide and conquer" graphic came out in 2000 for the election. They also had the sheeple graphic and many others. Look at some of the imagery in their videos, Workshop has always been into this stuff, it's nothing new. I think it's rad and with the pro liberty, free minded and conspiracy theme this is a great collab. I bought both boards and the tee shirt yesterday, just as I bought Spencer Hamilton's first pro board exposing GMO and Monsanto a couple weeks ago.

Infowars and may come off as "right wing" especially now that we have a president whos a democrat it would seem they are ultra critical and focus mostly on the left. However they criticize the republican party just as much as especially when they're in office. I don't think labeling them "right wing" is a fair and should be left up the mainstream media in an attempt to prersuade you not to visit their site(another divide & conquer tactic). I mean sure they are pro second amendment and pro life but they are also anti war and pro civil liberties and came out against the patriot act, bail outs, ndaa etc. Infowars is more of a constitutionalist libertarian leaning news website along with Alex Jones who has been an avid Ron Paul supporter for years, and as I said very critical of the right wing, neocons and republican party.
« Last Edit: January 18, 2013, 05:48:09 AM by TMKF »

Beer Keg Peg Leg

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Re: Alien Workshop x Right Wing ?!
« Reply #5 on: January 18, 2013, 05:49:48 AM »
lol of course you read infowars.

TMKF

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Re: Alien Workshop x Right Wing ?!
« Reply #6 on: January 18, 2013, 05:52:44 AM »
dude, that's why you kids need to start going to class and stop taking oxy and crack, seriously 'merica is fucked.

You dont even understand there is no such thing as democracy, slavery is still going so badly, I would even say it is the most fascist regime since the nazis. This graphic is about the government controlling the media, the media controlling the general public opinion on politics, and therefore the government controlling people destiny.

Until america gets his own universal health care system poor people will still die without a chance. If you dont have money then you are worth less than shit. Human rights are bullshit. All this fuels the drug and hampa problem.

But whatever, the president is black so everything is good.

I agree with alot of what youre saying but how would having a bunch of corrupt liars and white collar criminals running our healthcare system make it any better?

chockfullofthat

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Re: Alien Workshop x Right Wing ?!
« Reply #7 on: January 18, 2013, 06:03:02 AM »
dude, that's why you kids need to start going to class and stop taking oxy and crack, seriously 'merica is fucked.

You dont even understand there is no such thing as democracy, slavery is still going so badly, I would even say it is the most fascist regime since the nazis. This graphic is about the government controlling the media, the media controlling the general public opinion on politics, and therefore the government controlling people destiny.

Until america gets his own universal health care system poor people will still die without a chance. If you dont have money then you are worth less than shit. Human rights are bullshit. All this fuels the drug and hampa problem.

But whatever, the president is black so everything is good.

Fuck you, cunt.

smokecrack

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Re: Alien Workshop x Right Wing ?!
« Reply #8 on: January 18, 2013, 06:10:15 AM »
Alex Jones, you had one chance at legitimacy and guess what you did?



lol

Piers Morgan debates Alex Jones

full

Alex Jones vs Piers Morgan On Gun Control - CNN 1/7/2013

kookin' it to da maxx

ChillMurray

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Re: Alien Workshop x Right Wing ?!
« Reply #9 on: January 18, 2013, 06:36:49 AM »
If you live in the states and listen to anything Piers Morgan has to say I feel bad for you but you're probably one of the individuals that opposes people owning guns.
RIP Pimp C

Chico Dusty

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Re: Alien Workshop x Right Wing ?!
« Reply #10 on: January 18, 2013, 06:56:20 AM »
Alex Jones of Krooked?

jim

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Re: Alien Workshop x Right Wing ?!
« Reply #11 on: January 18, 2013, 07:31:06 AM »
yall are sheep
Does it hurt when you skate?
If no: Go skate
If yes: Go skate

TMKF

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Re: Alien Workshop x Right Wing ?!
« Reply #12 on: January 18, 2013, 07:47:32 AM »
Alex Jones, you had one chance at legitimacy and guess what you did?



lol

Piers Morgan debates Alex Jones

full

Alex Jones vs Piers Morgan On Gun Control - CNN 1/7/2013

kookin' it to da maxx

Alex Jones goes off like that everyday on his radio show. Peirs Morgan knew exactly what would happen if he had him on his show. He also knew it would get his ratings up as well as further his agenda because we've been conditioned to think that anyone yelling about anything(except for sports games of course) is kooky. If you actually listen to what Alex Jones is saying rather than the way he's saying it he wasnt really saying anything kooky at all, in fact the majority of it was accurrate. What I found interesting was how Peirs just let him do that, when a few nights prior the very well spoken Larry Pratt was on his show also defending the second amendment and Peirs was interupting him and calling him names and looking like a kook. Alex Jones is a passionate guy but he's also a sensationalist and in my opinion him going off was entertaining but probably didn't do him any favors. There are many voices in the liberty movement that was his version. However even Alex was holding back, the stats he gave about violent crime were actually wrong playing down how much it's dropped over the last 20 years. I know most of you have been trained that anything other than a monotone NPR voice talking about politics is kooky, so how's this....

Choose Your Own Crime Stats

Reality Check: An "Apples to Apples" comparison of U.S. and U.K. violent crime rates by Ben Swann

Doubtful Peirs will have one of these guys on his show. As you can see the 20% number that Alex Jones was given is actually watered down. I think it was important for him to point out the psychatropic drugs, because that is something that's involved in all these shootings and violent behavior is even listed as one of the side effects however is being ignored by the media. What do you expect though? Main stream media is pretty much state run media, the pundits are lap dogs of the establishment of both political parties. The liberal stations promote the democratic party talking points and Fox promotes the the republican leadership and establishment. How can anyone trust NBC, CNN or Fox? They are all dependent on big corporations(that are in bed with the government on both sides) advertising dollars, so you can't expect them not to be liars and shills, they are essentially corporate/state run.

Here's Larry Pratt on Peirs and as you can see he is well spoken and makes a good argument so Peirs interupts him and calls him names...

GOA's Larry Pratt DESTROYS CNN's Piers Morgan on CT Shooting

Why didn't he do that with Alex Jones? Because he wanted Alex to blow up and come off as kooky in an attempt to discredit second amendment advocates. At the end of the day it was a big story all over the news and on some level got people thinking and some have even said it couldn't helped wake some people up.

The deal is with the whole Peirs Morgan thing is that Peirs is not an American citizen and he is on TV every night attempting to interpret the US constitution and tell American's what rights they should and shouldn't have. He does this by standing on the graves of dead children(even he admitted that on twitter), just as the president used the imagery of the children behind him in his speech just a couple days ago...it's sickening and it's clear propaganda.

"I'm being accused of 'standing on the graves of dead Sandy Hook children' - if that's what it takes to get action, so be it," -Peirs Morgan







« Last Edit: January 18, 2013, 08:03:10 AM by TMKF »

TMKF

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Re: Alien Workshop x Right Wing ?!
« Reply #13 on: January 18, 2013, 07:52:04 AM »
Alex Jones of Krooked?

Hahahaha

Where is the Gipper on this topic? It's still pretty early out west...

oyolar

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Re: Alien Workshop x Right Wing ?!
« Reply #14 on: January 18, 2013, 09:00:11 AM »
Alien Workshop has always had graphics exposing government control and conspiracies. The brainwash graphic came out in the mid 90s and the "divide and conquer" graphic came out in 2000 for the election. They also had the sheeple graphic and many others. Look at some of the imagery in their videos, Workshop has always been into this stuff, it's nothing new. I think it's rad and with the pro liberty, free minded and conspiracy theme this is a great collab. I bought both boards and the tee shirt yesterday, just as I bought Spencer Hamilton's first pro board exposing GMO and Monsanto a couple weeks ago.

Infowars and may come off as "right wing" especially now that we have a president whos a democrat it would seem they are ultra critical and focus mostly on the left. However they criticize the republican party just as much as especially when they're in office. I don't think labeling them "right wing" is a fair and should be left up the mainstream media in an attempt to prersuade you not to visit their site(another divide & conquer tactic). I mean sure they are pro second amendment and pro life but they are also anti war and pro civil liberties and came out against the patriot act, bail outs, ndaa etc. Infowars is more of a constitutionalist libertarian leaning news website along with Alex Jones who has been an avid Ron Paul supporter for years, and as I said very critical of the right wing, neocons and republican party.

I think it's important to have alternative news sources like Infowars, but if you think that Alex Jones is anything more than a crazy conspiracy theorist, I don't know what to tell you. And saying "pro-life" and "constitutional libertarian" is a contradiction.

TMKF

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Re: Alien Workshop x Right Wing ?!
« Reply #15 on: January 18, 2013, 09:36:47 AM »
Expand Quote
Alien Workshop has always had graphics exposing government control and conspiracies. The brainwash graphic came out in the mid 90s and the "divide and conquer" graphic came out in 2000 for the election. They also had the sheeple graphic and many others. Look at some of the imagery in their videos, Workshop has always been into this stuff, it's nothing new. I think it's rad and with the pro liberty, free minded and conspiracy theme this is a great collab. I bought both boards and the tee shirt yesterday, just as I bought Spencer Hamilton's first pro board exposing GMO and Monsanto a couple weeks ago.

Infowars and may come off as "right wing" especially now that we have a president whos a democrat it would seem they are ultra critical and focus mostly on the left. However they criticize the republican party just as much as especially when they're in office. I don't think labeling them "right wing" is a fair and should be left up the mainstream media in an attempt to prersuade you not to visit their site(another divide & conquer tactic). I mean sure they are pro second amendment and pro life but they are also anti war and pro civil liberties and came out against the patriot act, bail outs, ndaa etc. Infowars is more of a constitutionalist libertarian leaning news website along with Alex Jones who has been an avid Ron Paul supporter for years, and as I said very critical of the right wing, neocons and republican party.
[close]

I think it's important to have alternative news sources like Infowars, but if you think that Alex Jones is anything more than a crazy conspiracy theorist, I don't know what to tell you. And saying "pro-life" and "constitutional libertarian" is a contradiction.

How so? One of the only real jobs of the government is to "protect life, liberty and the persuit of happiness". That's about as constitutional as it gets depending on how you interpret it. I used to be pro choice too when I was younger(public school educated) until I did the researched the history and found out it was founded and all based on eugenics and not womens right.

TheRealDeal

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Re: Alien Workshop x Right Wing ?!
« Reply #16 on: January 18, 2013, 09:38:36 AM »
Expand Quote
Alien Workshop has always had graphics exposing government control and conspiracies. The brainwash graphic came out in the mid 90s and the "divide and conquer" graphic came out in 2000 for the election. They also had the sheeple graphic and many others. Look at some of the imagery in their videos, Workshop has always been into this stuff, it's nothing new. I think it's rad and with the pro liberty, free minded and conspiracy theme this is a great collab. I bought both boards and the tee shirt yesterday, just as I bought Spencer Hamilton's first pro board exposing GMO and Monsanto a couple weeks ago.

Infowars and may come off as "right wing" especially now that we have a president whos a democrat it would seem they are ultra critical and focus mostly on the left. However they criticize the republican party just as much as especially when they're in office. I don't think labeling them "right wing" is a fair and should be left up the mainstream media in an attempt to prersuade you not to visit their site(another divide & conquer tactic). I mean sure they are pro second amendment and pro life but they are also anti war and pro civil liberties and came out against the patriot act, bail outs, ndaa etc. Infowars is more of a constitutionalist libertarian leaning news website along with Alex Jones who has been an avid Ron Paul supporter for years, and as I said very critical of the right wing, neocons and republican party.
[close]

I think it's important to have alternative news sources like Infowars, but if you think that Alex Jones is anything more than a crazy conspiracy theorist, I don't know what to tell you. And saying "pro-life" and "constitutional libertarian" is a contradiction.

Care to explain either claim?

TMKF

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Re: Alien Workshop x Right Wing ?!
« Reply #17 on: January 18, 2013, 09:44:11 AM »
Expand Quote
Expand Quote
Alien Workshop has always had graphics exposing government control and conspiracies. The brainwash graphic came out in the mid 90s and the "divide and conquer" graphic came out in 2000 for the election. They also had the sheeple graphic and many others. Look at some of the imagery in their videos, Workshop has always been into this stuff, it's nothing new. I think it's rad and with the pro liberty, free minded and conspiracy theme this is a great collab. I bought both boards and the tee shirt yesterday, just as I bought Spencer Hamilton's first pro board exposing GMO and Monsanto a couple weeks ago.

Infowars and may come off as "right wing" especially now that we have a president whos a democrat it would seem they are ultra critical and focus mostly on the left. However they criticize the republican party just as much as especially when they're in office. I don't think labeling them "right wing" is a fair and should be left up the mainstream media in an attempt to prersuade you not to visit their site(another divide & conquer tactic). I mean sure they are pro second amendment and pro life but they are also anti war and pro civil liberties and came out against the patriot act, bail outs, ndaa etc. Infowars is more of a constitutionalist libertarian leaning news website along with Alex Jones who has been an avid Ron Paul supporter for years, and as I said very critical of the right wing, neocons and republican party.
[close]

I think it's important to have alternative news sources like Infowars, but if you think that Alex Jones is anything more than a crazy conspiracy theorist, I don't know what to tell you. And saying "pro-life" and "constitutional libertarian" is a contradiction.
[close]


Care to explain either claim?

Nah he doesn't, that's what he's been taught by state run media and public education so he must be right.

chockfullofthat

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Re: Alien Workshop x Right Wing ?!
« Reply #18 on: January 18, 2013, 09:44:51 AM »
Look out everyone the libertarian tag team is back!!!!

TMKF

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Re: Alien Workshop x Right Wing ?!
« Reply #19 on: January 18, 2013, 09:50:12 AM »
Look out everyone the libertarian tag team is back!!!!


Hahahaha it'd be sick if we actually looked like that. Can't wait for the Gipper to get on here!

Aleister gnarly

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Re: Alien Workshop x Right Wing ?!
« Reply #20 on: January 18, 2013, 10:26:27 AM »
Fear of war, fear of the economy, fear of terrorists, fear of plagues, fear of toxic food, fear of guns or people with guns.  By keeping you in a contast state of fear you  are being enslaved.  Fear=slavery.  How could you not understand this graphic?  It is spelled out for you.....divide and conquer. 
« Last Edit: January 18, 2013, 10:31:00 AM by Aleister gnarly »

COMMUNITYPACK

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Re: Alien Workshop x Right Wing ?!
« Reply #21 on: January 18, 2013, 10:30:55 AM »
I don't know much, but I know that you're an idiot if you don't think gun control laws should be tighter in this country.

It has nothing to do with the recent killings and everything to do with stupidity.

You can own an automatic assault rifle, but you can't get the free health care that you'll need for shooting your own nut sack off.

Sorry America, but this country is fucked.

Hercules Rockefeller

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Re: Alien Workshop x Right Wing ?!
« Reply #22 on: January 18, 2013, 10:38:00 AM »
You can own an automatic assault rifle, but you can't get the free health care that you'll need for shooting your own nut sack off.


this should be on every poster on anti-NRA-demos.

oyolar

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Re: Alien Workshop x Right Wing ?!
« Reply #23 on: January 18, 2013, 11:06:11 AM »
Expand Quote
Expand Quote
Expand Quote
Alien Workshop has always had graphics exposing government control and conspiracies. The brainwash graphic came out in the mid 90s and the "divide and conquer" graphic came out in 2000 for the election. They also had the sheeple graphic and many others. Look at some of the imagery in their videos, Workshop has always been into this stuff, it's nothing new. I think it's rad and with the pro liberty, free minded and conspiracy theme this is a great collab. I bought both boards and the tee shirt yesterday, just as I bought Spencer Hamilton's first pro board exposing GMO and Monsanto a couple weeks ago.

Infowars and may come off as "right wing" especially now that we have a president whos a democrat it would seem they are ultra critical and focus mostly on the left. However they criticize the republican party just as much as especially when they're in office. I don't think labeling them "right wing" is a fair and should be left up the mainstream media in an attempt to prersuade you not to visit their site(another divide & conquer tactic). I mean sure they are pro second amendment and pro life but they are also anti war and pro civil liberties and came out against the patriot act, bail outs, ndaa etc. Infowars is more of a constitutionalist libertarian leaning news website along with Alex Jones who has been an avid Ron Paul supporter for years, and as I said very critical of the right wing, neocons and republican party.
[close]

I think it's important to have alternative news sources like Infowars, but if you think that Alex Jones is anything more than a crazy conspiracy theorist, I don't know what to tell you. And saying "pro-life" and "constitutional libertarian" is a contradiction.
[close]


Care to explain either claim?
[close]

Nah he doesn't, that's what he's been taught by state run media and public education so he must be right.

Well, first off, the Constitution does not claim to protect "life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness." That's the Declaration of Independence, so claiming that that is a function of the government is a tenuous argument (the DoI is not a rule of law document). But regardless, pro-life individuals believe life to begin at conception, a tricky claim to prove as there is little to no scientific backing for when life begins. Their belief system is based on a (generally) religious one and hence, is a belief system that is based on "faith" more so than "facts." Libertarianism is a political philosophy that believes in as little government intrusion into private and personal matters as possible. What is a larger intrusion than telling a woman what she can and can't do with a ball of cells in her own personal body? Libertarian philosophy holds the body to be an almost sacred space and an individual can do as they please with their own body so long as it does not harm other unequivocally living people. A zygote does not fall into this definition. Can one be against abortion and be a Constitutional Libertarian? Yes. But the implication of "pro-life" is that one believes laws should be enacted to ban abortions, which is a step by the government to control a person's actions and morality--a step antithetical to Libertarianism.  That is why I believe that they are incongruous belief systems.

To claim that abortion, which has existed in some form for thousands of years, is based on the eugenics movement, which really came into the spotlight in the early 1900s, is a horrible argument. You're picking and choosing which history of abortion and access to abortion you prefer because saying that abortion only had its roots in eugenics allows you to claim that there is no other legitimate argument for it. It's an ad hominem attack. And regardless of that, it never existed in a solely eugenics sphere and it very easily passes into women's rights and the rights of a person to their bodily space more generally.

As for Alex Jones being a conspiracy theorist, I said that because of his severe distrust of all other news sources, his belief that reality cannot exist in a way explained by other people, and his tendency to ignore the most reasonable explanation for a situation in favor of tying together flimsy facts and disparate events into a more complex, overarching narrative that can be clearly traced back to some oppressive "elite puppetmasters."

Oh, and just so you know, my most formative education was at a private university that is one of the bastions and founders of libertarian economic and social thought. Nice try though.
« Last Edit: January 18, 2013, 11:26:04 AM by oyolar »

swagdragon123

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Re: Alien Workshop x Right Wing ?!
« Reply #24 on: January 18, 2013, 11:06:37 AM »

TMKF

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Re: Alien Workshop x Right Wing ?!
« Reply #25 on: January 18, 2013, 11:11:12 AM »
I don't know much, but I know that you're an idiot if you don't think gun control laws should be tighter in this country.

It has nothing to do with the recent killings and everything to do with stupidity.

You can own an automatic assault rifle, but you can't get the free health care that you'll need for shooting your own nut sack off.

Sorry America, but this country is fucked.

You're right you don't know much and you don't understand freedom. Heroin is illegal but you can go get some right now if you want. If automatic weapons were illegal(which they pretty much are) a criminal could get one if they wanted to. Therefore making a law against them will only prevent those who follow the law to not being able to defend themselves against criminals who seek them out, it's as simple as that. I don't think you understand how rare a fully automatic weapon is, you have to jump though a bunch of hoops, background checks and pay for fees and licenses to own them. I'm also wondering how this relates to healthcare? Why should a health care provider be required to give anyone something for free? You think the government should make automatic weapons illegal and pay for the population to have healthcare...the same government that's caught day after day involved in corruption and insider trading for their own benefit? The same government that gave 2000 weapons including automatic assault rifles and grenades to Mexican drug cartels in Fast and Furious? No thanks, I'll just take care of myself and if I choose to have a weapon to defend myself or just because I'm into guns that right is guaranteed and is protected under the constitution. I understand where you're coming from but we've already established that criminals can and will get whatever they want from drugs to weapons so how much sense does it make to have a single shot rifle to defend yourself against a criminal that has a semi auto or even an automatic weapon. I'm not some big gun guy, I just understand freedom, and you can't be truly free without the right to protect yourself. Once you start to restrict(which they've already done) its a slippery slope. You think the government actually cares about less violence? The US government are the biggest killers in the world, they've killed millions of innocent people with the continued illegal undeclared wars and drone attacks...this is about control and always was.

TMKF

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Re: Alien Workshop x Right Wing ?!
« Reply #26 on: January 18, 2013, 12:03:33 PM »
Expand Quote
Expand Quote
Expand Quote
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Alien Workshop has always had graphics exposing government control and conspiracies. The brainwash graphic came out in the mid 90s and the "divide and conquer" graphic came out in 2000 for the election. They also had the sheeple graphic and many others. Look at some of the imagery in their videos, Workshop has always been into this stuff, it's nothing new. I think it's rad and with the pro liberty, free minded and conspiracy theme this is a great collab. I bought both boards and the tee shirt yesterday, just as I bought Spencer Hamilton's first pro board exposing GMO and Monsanto a couple weeks ago.

Infowars and may come off as "right wing" especially now that we have a president whos a democrat it would seem they are ultra critical and focus mostly on the left. However they criticize the republican party just as much as especially when they're in office. I don't think labeling them "right wing" is a fair and should be left up the mainstream media in an attempt to prersuade you not to visit their site(another divide & conquer tactic). I mean sure they are pro second amendment and pro life but they are also anti war and pro civil liberties and came out against the patriot act, bail outs, ndaa etc. Infowars is more of a constitutionalist libertarian leaning news website along with Alex Jones who has been an avid Ron Paul supporter for years, and as I said very critical of the right wing, neocons and republican party.
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I think it's important to have alternative news sources like Infowars, but if you think that Alex Jones is anything more than a crazy conspiracy theorist, I don't know what to tell you. And saying "pro-life" and "constitutional libertarian" is a contradiction.
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Care to explain either claim?
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Nah he doesn't, that's what he's been taught by state run media and public education so he must be right.
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Well, first off, the Constitution does not claim to protect "life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness." That's the Declaration of Independence, so claiming that that is a function of the government is a tenuous argument (the DoI is not a rule of law document). But regardless, pro-life individuals believe life to begin a conception,  tricky claim to prove as there is little to no scientific backing for when life begins. Their belief system is based on a (generally) religious one and hence, is a belief system that is based on "faith" more so than "facts." Libertarianism is a political philosophy that believes in as little government intrusion into private and personal matters as possible. What is a larger intrusion than telling an woman what she can and can't do with a ball of cells in her own personal body? Libertarian philosophy holds the body to be an almost sacred space and an individual can do as they please with their own body so long as it does not harm other unequivocally living people. A zygote does not fall into this definition. Can one be against abortion and be a Constitutional Libertarian? Yes. But the implication of "pro-life" is that one believes laws should be enacted to ban abortions, which is a step by the government to control a person's actions and morality--a step antithetical to Libertarianism.  That is why I believe that are incongruous belief systems.

To claim that abortion, which has existed in some form for thousands of years, is based on the eugenics movement, which really came into the spotlight in the early 1900s, is a horrible argument. You're picking and choosing which history of abortion and access to abortion you prefer because saying that abortion only had its roots in eugenics allows you to claim that there is no other legitimate argument for it. It's an ad hominem attack. And regardless of that, it never existed in a solely eugenics sphere and it very easily passes into women's rights and the rights of a person to their bodily space more generally.

As for Alex Jones being a conspiracy theorist, I said that because of his severe distrust of all other news sources, his belief that reality cannot exist in a way explained by other people, and his tendency to ignore the most reasonable explanation for a situation in favor of tying together flimsy facts and disparate events into a more complex, overarching narrative that can be clearly traced back to some oppressive "elite puppetmasters."

Oh, and just so you know, my most formative education was at a private university that is one of the bastions and founders of libertarian economic and social thought. Nice try though.

The Declaration of Independence and the Constitution go hand in hand, you don't have a Constitution without the Declaration of Independence. Life is listed as an unalienable right(meaning they cannot be altered by any law). I understand the definition of life is up for interpretation just as whether life begins at conception or not. I know that if a women is pregnant with a child and her husband pushes her down the stairs and she loses the child, he will be charged with assault and for murder. I understand it is her body but it is his child too and if she has a right to kill the child shouldn't he have one too? How ridiculous does that sound? All I'm saying is that it's not an oxy moron to be a constitutionalist libertarian and be pro life.

The modern abortion movement is completely based on eugenics. Margaret Sanger was one of the founders of the American Eugenics Society and later founded the American Birth Control League which became the International Planned Parenthood Federation. Dorothy Brush who also worked for Planned Parenthood was another founder of the American Eugenics Society along with JP Morgan and others. Today Planned Parenthood is the single largest provider of abortions in the US. They also get government funding meaning our tax dollars to carry these abortions out. That would be the like the government funding the NRA in the eyes of anti gun advocates.

Let me go through a few Marget Sanger quotes for you and you can decide what her intentions were....

"Birth control must lead ultimately to a cleaner race."

"There is only one reply to a request for a higher birthrate among the
intelligent, and that is to ask the government to first take the burden of
the insane and feeble-minded from your back. [Mandatory] sterilization for
these is the answer."

"[Slavs, Latin, and Hebrew immigrants are] human weeds ... a
deadweight of human waste ... [Blacks, soldiers, and Jews are a] menace to
the race."

"Eugenic sterilization is an urgent need ... We must prevent
Multiplication of this bad stock."

"Today eugenics is suggested by the most diverse minds as the most
adequate and thorough avenue to the solution of racial, political and
social problems.

"I think you must agree ... that the campaign for birth control is not
merely of eugenic value, but is practically identical with the final aims
of eugenics ... Birth control propaganda is thus the entering wedge for the
eugenic educator."

"On the contrary, the most urgent problem today is how to limit and
discourage the over-fertility of the mentally and physically defective."

"Give dysgenic groups [people with 'bad genes'] in our population
their choice of segregation or [compulsory] sterilization."

"We should hire three or four colored ministers, preferably with
social-service backgrounds, and with engaging personalities. The most
successful educational approach to the Negro is through a religious appeal.
We don't want the word to go out that we want to exterminate the Negro
population, and the minister is the man who can straighten out that idea if
it ever occurs to any of their more rebellious members."

Does that last quote sound familiar? Planned Parenthood is still carrying out Margaret Sanger's plan today with President Obama and Oprah Winfrey speaking on their behalf. Is her Eugenics plan working? Well let's see....

Minority women constitute only about 13% of the female population (age 15-44) in the United States, but they underwent approximately 36% of the abortions.

According to the Alan Guttmacher Institute, black women are more than 5 times as likely as white women to have an abortion

On average, 1,876 black babies are aborted every day in the United States.

78% of Planned Parenthood clinics are in minority communities.

If you wanna label yourself "Pro Choice" after knowing all this go right ahead, but I can't get down with this shit.

Sources:

Margaret Sanger's December 19, 1939 letter to Dr. Clarence Gamble, 255
Adams Street, Milton, Massachusetts. Original source: Sophia Smith
Collection, Smith College, North Hampton, Massachusetts. Also described in
Linda Gordon's Woman's Body, Woman's Right: A Social History of Birth
Control in America . New York: Grossman Publishers, 1976.

Margaret Sanger. The Pivot of Civilization , 1922. Chapter on "The
Cruelty of Charity," pages 116, 122, and 189. Swarthmore College Library
edition."

Margaret Sanger. "The Eugenic Value of Birth Control Propaganda."
Birth Control Review , October 1921, page 5.

Margaret Sanger, April 1932 Birth Control Review.

http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/ss6108a1.htm

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Eugenics_Society

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Margaret_Sanger


I figured I'd add this too because it is somewhat relevant with the discussion of eugenics and government.....

John Paul Holdren is the senior advisor to President Barack Obama on science and technology issues through his roles as Assistant to the President for Science and Technology, Director of the White House Office of Science and Technology Policy, and Co-Chair of the President?s Council of Advisors on Science and Technology (PCAST). This guy who is a senior advisor to the president(who openly backs planned parenthood) co authored a book called 'Econscience: Population, Resources, Environment' in which he called for forced abortions and depopulation. Here are some of those quotes:

"Indeed, it has been concluded that compulsory population-control laws, even including laws requiring compulsory abortion, could be sustained under the existing Constitution if the population crisis became sufficiently severe to endanger the society."

"One way to carry out this disapproval might be to insist that all illegitimate babies be put up for adoption?especially those born to minors, who generally are not capable of caring properly for a child alone. If a single mother really wished to keep her baby, she might be obliged to go through adoption proceedings and demonstrate her ability to support and care for it. Adoption proceedings probably should remain more difficult for single people than for married couples, in recognition of the relative difficulty of raising children alone. It would even be possible to require pregnant single women to marry or have abortions, perhaps as an alternative to placement for adoption, depending on the society." 

"Adding a sterilant to drinking water or staple foods is a suggestion that seems to horrify people more than most proposals for involuntary fertility control. Indeed, this would pose some very difficult political, legal, and social questions, to say nothing of the technical problems. No such sterilant exists today, nor does one appear to be under development. To be acceptable, such a substance would have to meet some rather stiff requirements: it must be uniformly effective, despite widely varying doses received by individuals, and despite varying degrees of fertility and sensitivity among individuals; it must be free of dangerous or unpleasant side effects; and it must have no effect on members of the opposite sex, children, old people, pets, or livestock. "

"If some individuals contribute to general social deterioration by overproducing children, and if the need is compelling, they can be required by law to exercise reproductive responsibility?just as they can be required to exercise responsibility in their resource-consumption patterns?providing they are not denied equal protection."

Remember this isn't some mad scientist saying these things this is a senior advisor to President Obama and the White House who published this stuff in a book.

Sources:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Holdren

Ecoscience: Population, Resources, Environment

As for Alex Jones, I'm not going to spend my time defending him and his actions. I don't agree with him on every issue but I do find his website and show to be a useful tool in the liberty movement. I think he is one of the most aggressive voices out there, though I'm not always on board with his tactics. He always has informative guests on his show and I'd rather read articles from an independent news source such as his sites and others over state and corporate funded media. It's hard to label something a conspiracy theory just because the government who are known liars say it is.
« Last Edit: January 18, 2013, 12:48:34 PM by TMKF »

oyolar

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Re: Alien Workshop x Right Wing ?!
« Reply #27 on: January 18, 2013, 12:33:45 PM »
That's a horrible argument against birth control and abortion as well. It completely whitewashed the numerous services that Planned Parenthood offers and fails (again) to provide any arguments for modern pro-choice arguements. Your arguments against abortion is analogous to me saying, "I was all for gun rights until I looked at the history of firearms and discovered their roots in governmental oppression of dissidents, therefore we shouldn't have guns."

And your example of a legal precedent that I'm sure many people disagree with (a man charged with murder for killing a zygote/fetus while assaulting a women) is equally poorly argued. Allowing a man to have a choice over what a woman does with her body again infringes on an individual's bodily autonomy (pretty anti-Libertarian). Saying that it's his child, so he should have equal say ignores that fact that nothing has a right to use a person's body (in this case, a woman's) against his/her will. If he gets a say, what do we do when a woman does not want a child but the man does? Force her to carry it to term despite her wishes?

Finally, your attempt to say that Planned Parenthood is somehow orchestrating a "black genocide" based on Sanger's eugenic beliefs (which I feel it important to not was a widely accepted and respected science across the globe at tht period) greatly ignores the myriad ways that race, sex, and poverty interact in the modern world in favor of a narrative that provides one with a clearly defined enemy.

Ronald Wilson Reagan

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Re: Alien Workshop x Right Wing ?!
« Reply #28 on: January 18, 2013, 12:36:47 PM »
You guys genuinely don't have any idea how fucking stupid and indoctrinated you are do you? The best way to discredit an Alex Jones fan is to let him speak. BTW- Jones didn't come off as crazy because he was loud, he came off crazy because his rants jumped from one place to another without any logical reason or discussion of what he brought up. Gulf of Tonkin to pharmaceuticals to "building 7" while simultaneously refusing to engage in any level of discourse, just screaming ad hominem bullshit whenever he felt cornered. He jumped so much because he knew actually discussing what he brought up would make him look silly. America didn't think he was crazy because he was loud, they thought he was crazy because he was aimlessly ranting like a street-corner tin-foil-hat lunatic.

I wrote a long thing about how silly libertarians are to claim that the government's job is to protect life, while simultaneously wanting to end  all drug prohibitions and guns, but  if anybody reading this believes the points the Alex Jones nuts are making are better than Oyolars, then nothing will convince them no matter what.


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Re: Alien Workshop x Right Wing ?!
« Reply #29 on: January 18, 2013, 12:50:38 PM »
Guys, everything is ok. The president being black means all of our problems will be gone.