Marc Johnson on the nine club...

[Casey Jones]

it was kinda gnarly when roger put skate shoe brands on blast saying they all make shitty shoes given everyone else in the room

[Murray Hewitt]

MJ just seems like an overwhelming personality to be around. So exhausting.

[Hevonen]

it was kinda gnarly when roger put skate shoe brands on blast saying they all make shitty shoes given everyone else in the room

It's a fact though, not as black and white as roger said but still true, and it's a big reason why they are struggling. Shutting up about it won't help anyone, if skate shoe companies want to succeed again they need to match the big ones in quality and be vocal about it

[Matze]

MJ and I are kind of similar when it comes to lying, blaming and dealing with problems.
First he blamed himself for not acting good while being in the contract, saying he's sorry a couple of times and telling he's not the victim. He makes you think he is very reflects a lot and questions his whole behavior. He does not. Rather than that he's presenting Carroll as being the one who is responsible for the whole situation.

Marc is super good at explaining his situation and manipulating everyone - if you give him the freedom to do it. He did not talk about it with anyone for half a year and is now choosing to speak about it with his friends in public? That super safe terrain. I know that shit, I do it all the time if I don't wanna face the real problem. It's a pattern to distract everyone from the real thing. And he does it so gently and not offending anyone, so you sure will believe him. The stuff he's telling makes sense 100% to every listener, but is only a way of self presenting.

Oh, I love blaming people on the internet for shit they do, so it makes me feel better and I can distract from my problems. Same same.

[bo golden]

I was really hoping Carroll was going to come in the room and they were gonna hug this shit out and he would get back on Chocolate.  I think skateboarding needs something like that.  Great episode, regardless.

[GeorgeHanson]

I was really hoping Carroll was going to come in the room and they were gonna hug this shit out and he would get back on Chocolate.  I think skateboarding needs something like that.  Great episode, regardless.

I was hoping for a death match with a broken in half pool cue commentated by Phelps.

[Iceman]

MJ and I are kind of similar when it comes to lying, blaming and dealing with problems.
First he blamed himself for not acting good while being in the contract, saying he's sorry a couple of times and telling he's not the victim. He makes you think he is very reflects a lot and questions his whole behavior. He does not. Rather than that he's presenting Carroll as being the one who is responsible for the whole situation.

Marc is super good at explaining his situation and manipulating everyone - if you give him the freedom to do it. He did not talk about it with anyone for half a year and is now choosing to speak about it with his friends in public? That super safe terrain. I know that shit, I do it all the time if I don't wanna face the real problem. It's a pattern to distract everyone from the real thing. And he does it so gently and not offending anyone, so you sure will believe him. The stuff he's telling makes sense 100% to every listener, but is only a way of self presenting.

Oh, I love blaming people on the internet for shit they do, so it makes me feel better and I can distract from my problems. Same same.

if you're that self-aware of your issue why do you continue? just curious.

[bo golden]

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I was really hoping Carroll was going to come in the room and they were gonna hug this shit out and he would get back on Chocolate.  I think skateboarding needs something like that.  Great episode, regardless.

[close]

I was hoping for a death match with a broken in half pool cue commentated by Phelps.

LOL. Not sure i could deal with that commentary.

[The Woodsman]

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All the "he should have been better with his money" people need to take a step back, think about if you started getting less money from your boss every 2 weeks. How would you react? Asked to not get paid for 5 months? Nope.

[close]

Those two things aren't the same.

Living paycheck to paycheck literally means that if you miss a paycheck you can't live. If you have savings and you miss a check it's an inconviance and it would completely suck and justify him switching sponsor and all that, but a guy who's had a career like his and lived the way he has (I've seen his house in photos in some old interview in a mag and it was large and nice and I think it had a bit of land with it too) should have some money saved. I love MJ and his skating but if your income is say 10k a month and your living expenses are also 10k then that's mismanaging money, and that's living paycheck to paycheck.

[close]

You've seen his house. You're an expert.

All I'm saying is unless you're making almost nothing there is no reason to live paycheck to paycheck, if you scale back and save/invest you wouldn't be paycheck to paycheck at 40.
If your income is 10k then your expenses shouldn't be 10k also, even if they were only 9,500 over the course of 10 years you could save 60k, is it a fortune? No. But it'll get you through some bumps in the road and it'll mean you're not living paycheck to paycheck. 

[The Ghost of Lenny Kirk]

the part about putting lakai and chocolate before his family and his own life at times, and then getting burnt by those same companies on money, just makes me bummed on rick howard and mike carroll, because i wouldn't doubt that they've done this to other people on crailtap, but they just dont talk about it. im sure something similar probably happened to biebel before he left lakai. if by chance the adidas video didnt have mj in it, would this even be a conversation? he'd just be on adidas and slap would move on to the next topic.

[Level 60 Dwarf Paladin]

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All the "he should have been better with his money" people need to take a step back, think about if you started getting less money from your boss every 2 weeks. How would you react? Asked to not get paid for 5 months? Nope.

[close]

Those two things aren't the same.

Living paycheck to paycheck literally means that if you miss a paycheck you can't live. If you have savings and you miss a check it's an inconviance and it would completely suck and justify him switching sponsor and all that, but a guy who's had a career like his and lived the way he has (I've seen his house in photos in some old interview in a mag and it was large and nice and I think it had a bit of land with it too) should have some money saved. I love MJ and his skating but if your income is say 10k a month and your living expenses are also 10k then that's mismanaging money, and that's living paycheck to paycheck.

[close]

You've seen his house. You're an expert.

[close]

All I'm saying is unless you're making almost nothing there is no reason to live paycheck to paycheck, if you scale back and save/invest you wouldn't be paycheck to paycheck at 40.
If your income is 10k then your expenses shouldn't be 10k also, even if they were only 9,500 over the course of 10 years you could save 60k, is it a fortune? No. But it'll get you through some bumps in the road and it'll mean you're not living paycheck to paycheck. 

All I'm saying is that you seem to think you're his accountant when you, and a few others, actually don't know anything about his financial situation.

[Iceman]

yeah fuck crailtap for having their business finances destroyed by big corporate.

[bo bice]

I love MJ and I'm glad he seems in a better place now but that whole "what did I do wrong?" stuff was a bit much.  sounded like a kid asking why parents are divorcing or something like he doesn't understand budget cuts.  also the "fuck yeah I'll film a clip for the adidas video" stuff, while I get what he's saying, he seems to think this dismisses any accountability for how it went down.  like how could he not expect a fallout?  sounds like bad communication all around.  I do like that he paid homage to the 15 years he was there and that whole crew and era.   

[Matze]

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MJ and I are kind of similar when it comes to lying, blaming and dealing with problems.
First he blamed himself for not acting good while being in the contract, saying he's sorry a couple of times and telling he's not the victim. He makes you think he is very reflects a lot and questions his whole behavior. He does not. Rather than that he's presenting Carroll as being the one who is responsible for the whole situation.

Marc is super good at explaining his situation and manipulating everyone - if you give him the freedom to do it. He did not talk about it with anyone for half a year and is now choosing to speak about it with his friends in public? That super safe terrain. I know that shit, I do it all the time if I don't wanna face the real problem. It's a pattern to distract everyone from the real thing. And he does it so gently and not offending anyone, so you sure will believe him. The stuff he's telling makes sense 100% to every listener, but is only a way of self presenting.

Oh, I love blaming people on the internet for shit they do, so it makes me feel better and I can distract from my problems. Same same.

[close]

if you're that self-aware of your issue why do you continue? just curious.

I'm way better now. Until 2 years ago I commented on a lot of stuff on the internet and found myself in weird situations like that a lot. I try to be more oriented on the solution now rather than being clever about blaming others. It still happens and I feel super guilty. It's a subconscious thing that is just hard to change. And I might contradict myself because I did the same thing with the interpretation of Marc's mind.

[pizzafliptofakie]

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it was kinda gnarly when roger put skate shoe brands on blast saying they all make shitty shoes given everyone else in the room

[close]

It's a fact though, not as black and white as roger said but still true, and it's a big reason why they are struggling. Shutting up about it won't help anyone, if skate shoe companies want to succeed again they need to match the big ones in quality and be vocal about it

I think it's the other way around, if anything. It's all about marketing, and if the majority of the coolest pros are wearing these bigger brands, people will follow whether they admit it or not. And because of this, a lot of brands don't have the money or support to be as innovative or consistent with releases like Nike who pump out new shoes very regularly. But to say everyone else is just making shitty shoes is downright asinine and shows that he either doesn't skate very much or only wears "cool" shoes and wants to have a complex about it.

[Robert Baratheon]

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it was kinda gnarly when roger put skate shoe brands on blast saying they all make shitty shoes given everyone else in the room

[close]

It's a fact though, not as black and white as roger said but still true, and it's a big reason why they are struggling. Shutting up about it won't help anyone, if skate shoe companies want to succeed again they need to match the big ones in quality and be vocal about it

[close]

I think it's the other way around, if anything. It's all about marketing, and if the majority of the coolest pros are wearing these bigger brands, people will follow whether they admit it or not. And because of this, a lot of brands don't have the money or support to be as innovative or consistent with releases like Nike who pump out new shoes very regularly. But to say everyone else is just making shitty shoes is downright asinine and shows that he either doesn't skate very much or only wears "cool" shoes and wants to have a complex about it.

Good points. IT"S ALL ABOUT MARKETING.

And he sure as shit didn't address quality issues with Don Brown when he was on. And won't again if they ever have Carroll on.

I'm going to restate this below so the 'new users' and 'anons' can find it in either thread.  

And the part were Roger says that people are sick of shitty shoes, thus being the reason why kids are buying Nike, Adidas, and Converse, is utter bullshit. The kids buy what pros ride. That's why the pros get money from any company. Really lost a lot of respect for that dude. But I guess if you want to work in the industry, those are your new overlords. And they will exact a tribute. Enter Brink's MJ interview...

[Cthulhu!]

[Abyss1]

LOL did they really upload that

[natenola forever]

The living check to check this is kinda fucked, i guess none of these dudes saved a dollar they made back in the day. When he had his Emerica shoe he was probaly making anywhere from 250 grand a year to about half a million, i know taxes eat a lot of that up, but at some point everyone on a major shoe company was making a lot of money. He was also a major pro in late 90's early 2000s when all the big companies were killing it overseas before 9/11. I also understand most of the pros from that era purchased house during the housing bubble but thats still a bad finacial decision on their part.

[Getty]

I almost wonder if they steered the topic away from the departure from enjoi because it so mirrored the way he left crail: basically got spun, lost his shit, decided "fuck it" & bailed without communicating to anyone. MJ sounds like an invaluable asset to a company up til the point he burns out, freaks out & bails with no warning. I guess you take the bitter with the sweet when you hire this dude.

But fuck all that - how the hell can you have Marc fucking Johnson on the show & ask so little about SKATEBOARDING? Maybe I'm alone on this & everyone really wants to hear another tedious retracing of a dude's arc through the industry, babbling about shoe designs, business, etc. but man I would LOVE to turn this show over to Kelly for an episode (or anyone who's a genuine skate rat) and ask the kinda questions skate rats want to hear.

There's so many tricks from MJs parts I'd love to hear stories about: how long did this take to land? What's your technique for that trick? Tell me about how you even thought of doing that combo? My ears pricked up when Roberts asked if he was skating lately - I love hearing about what dudes are up to skate-wise, what tricks they're working on, how skating is feeling to them lately, etc. But of course that didn't go anywhere since Roberts really just wants to talk industry shit.

Oh well, still a fascinating watch. MJ sounds like kind of a mess, but I feel for a lot of what he's struggled with. And he's one of the greatest to ever step on a plank.

[mattchew]

The living check to check this is kinda fucked, i guess none of these dudes saved a dollar they made back in the day. When he had his Emerica shoe he was probaly making anywhere from 250 grand a year to about half a million, i know taxes eat a lot of that up, but at some point everyone on a major shoe company was making a lot of money. He was also a major pro in late 90's early 2000s when all the big companies were killing it overseas before 9/11. I also understand most of the pros from that era purchased house during the housing bubble but thats still a bad finacial decision on their part.

To quote CROB: This fuckin' guy...

Where are you getting this number from?

[RCB3]

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The living check to check this is kinda fucked, i guess none of these dudes saved a dollar they made back in the day. When he had his Emerica shoe he was probaly making anywhere from 250 grand a year to about half a million, i know taxes eat a lot of that up, but at some point everyone on a major shoe company was making a lot of money. He was also a major pro in late 90's early 2000s when all the big companies were killing it overseas before 9/11. I also understand most of the pros from that era purchased house during the housing bubble but thats still a bad finacial decision on their part.

[close]

To quote CROB: This fuckin' guy...

Where are you getting this number from?

There's been many interviews with pros that during the height of the golden years, monthly checks off shoe royalties would be 10, 20, 30 thousand a month. Sumner's shoe on Adio once had a royalty check of 300k for one month. Obviously that's quite rare, but I don't think it's out of the question to think he was making 250k-500k a year for at least several years.

Like I said before, I'm not denying he might be living paycheck to paycheck, but I don't feel sympathy for his little rant about providing for his kid as an excuse to go to Adidas. There's tons of pros with families and no shoe sponsors and suck it up by doing other gigs on the side to make ends meet.

I don't care he rides for Adidas and glad he's hooked up because I do think he's one of the greatest skaters ever and one of my favorites, but I just wish there was more talk where he admitted he was in the wrong. It just felt very mentally scripted when the chat shifted gears.

Maybe he needs to have a talk with Khakis to diversify his bonds...

[EXTRA SPICY]

Yo AV club Pals, who can make a filter so it removes Kelly Hart's laugh?
Crob, if you're reading this, make a pay subscribe without his laugh and I'll buy every episode of it. Mad cringes everytime...

[mattchew]

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The living check to check this is kinda fucked, i guess none of these dudes saved a dollar they made back in the day. When he had his Emerica shoe he was probaly making anywhere from 250 grand a year to about half a million, i know taxes eat a lot of that up, but at some point everyone on a major shoe company was making a lot of money. He was also a major pro in late 90's early 2000s when all the big companies were killing it overseas before 9/11. I also understand most of the pros from that era purchased house during the housing bubble but thats still a bad finacial decision on their part.

[close]

To quote CROB: This fuckin' guy...

Where are you getting this number from?

[close]

There's been many interviews with pros that during the height of the golden years, monthly checks off shoe royalties would be 10, 20, 30 thousand a month. Sumner's shoe on Adio once had a royalty check of 300k for one month. Obviously that's quite rare, but I don't think it's out of the question to think he was making 250k-500k a year for at least several years.

Sources?
Probably gonna end up eating Sumner's shoes on this one but 300K for a single month seems so fucking outlandish to me.

For example, Kerry Getz states he was getting $7000 a month for a baseline salary at DVS during that same time period, plus royalties, of which his best quarterly royalty check was $47,000. (http://www.jenkemmag.com/home/2015/04/09/the-cky-era-with-kerry-getz/)

My memory is hazy but I do not remember people giving a shit about Sumner or his shoe on Adio, whereas Getz was a fucking king and one of the most well regarded pro's, so it seems pretty crazy to think Sumner made more than double Getz's yearly royalties in a single month.

Again, I could be totally in the wrong here, Adio had that Bam and Hawk money, but I dunno...

[DannyDee]

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The living check to check this is kinda fucked, i guess none of these dudes saved a dollar they made back in the day. When he had his Emerica shoe he was probaly making anywhere from 250 grand a year to about half a million, i know taxes eat a lot of that up, but at some point everyone on a major shoe company was making a lot of money. He was also a major pro in late 90's early 2000s when all the big companies were killing it overseas before 9/11. I also understand most of the pros from that era purchased house during the housing bubble but thats still a bad finacial decision on their part.

[close]

To quote CROB: This fuckin' guy...

Where are you getting this number from?

[close]

There's been many interviews with pros that during the height of the golden years, monthly checks off shoe royalties would be 10, 20, 30 thousand a month. Sumner's shoe on Adio once had a royalty check of 300k for one month. Obviously that's quite rare, but I don't think it's out of the question to think he was making 250k-500k a year for at least several years.

Like I said before, I'm not denying he might be living paycheck to paycheck, but I don't feel sympathy for his little rant about providing for his kid as an excuse to go to Adidas. There's tons of pros with families and no shoe sponsors and suck it up by doing other gigs on the side to make ends meet.

I don't care he rides for Adidas and glad he's hooked up because I do think he's one of the greatest skaters ever and one of my favorites, but I just wish there was more talk where he admitted he was in the wrong. It just felt very mentally scripted when the chat shifted gears.

Maybe he needs to have a talk with Khakis to diversify his bonds...

Why should Marc tough it out with a second job to wait it out for a company that isn't paying him for 7 months so they can dump his product because they can't afford to live up to their contract. Who knows if Adidas would wait it out for him? No one has given Crailtap more in the way of footage since he got on, the guy worked his ass off.

I feel bad for Rick and Mike that their life's work might be falling apart, but that doesn't absolve them from shorting MJ and asking him to do something that seems quite unreasonable (wait 7 months without a primary source of income). Marc didn't handle it well at all if Carroll's side is to be believed, but that doesn't absolve them from fault. If they wanted to wait 7 months, then pay him 7 months of his full salary of the original deal.

[RCB3]

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The living check to check this is kinda fucked, i guess none of these dudes saved a dollar they made back in the day. When he had his Emerica shoe he was probaly making anywhere from 250 grand a year to about half a million, i know taxes eat a lot of that up, but at some point everyone on a major shoe company was making a lot of money. He was also a major pro in late 90's early 2000s when all the big companies were killing it overseas before 9/11. I also understand most of the pros from that era purchased house during the housing bubble but thats still a bad finacial decision on their part.

[close]

To quote CROB: This fuckin' guy...

Where are you getting this number from?

[close]

There's been many interviews with pros that during the height of the golden years, monthly checks off shoe royalties would be 10, 20, 30 thousand a month. Sumner's shoe on Adio once had a royalty check of 300k for one month. Obviously that's quite rare, but I don't think it's out of the question to think he was making 250k-500k a year for at least several years.

Like I said before, I'm not denying he might be living paycheck to paycheck, but I don't feel sympathy for his little rant about providing for his kid as an excuse to go to Adidas. There's tons of pros with families and no shoe sponsors and suck it up by doing other gigs on the side to make ends meet.

I don't care he rides for Adidas and glad he's hooked up because I do think he's one of the greatest skaters ever and one of my favorites, but I just wish there was more talk where he admitted he was in the wrong. It just felt very mentally scripted when the chat shifted gears.

Maybe he needs to have a talk with Khakis to diversify his bonds...

[close]

Why should Marc tough it out with a second job to wait it out for a company that isn't paying him for 7 months so they can dump his product because they can't afford to live up to their contract. Who knows if Adidas would wait it out for him? No one has given Crailtap more in the way of footage since he got on, the guy worked his ass off.

I feel bad for Rick and Mike that their life's work might be falling apart, but that doesn't absolve them from shorting MJ and asking him to do something that seems quite unreasonable (wait 7 months without a primary source of income). Marc didn't handle it well at all if Carroll's side is to be believed, but that doesn't absolve them from fault. If they wanted to wait 7 months, then pay him 7 months of his full salary of the original deal.

I was more referring to just his attitude about the situation during the interview and not the situation itself. Obviously that would suck to not be paid for that long, especially with the amount of work put in.

And mattchew, to answer your question, I heard that figure from an interview with Sumner, but it may very well be not 100% accurate. I was more or less just hinting to the fact that in the hey day of skating, people were making quite a bit if you had a shoe. The one that sold so well on Adio for him was that one that had the British flag on it. I used to see that thing everywhere, so it sort of made sense to me when I read it.

[art hellman]

loved every minute of it. ? love MJ. ? loved MJ talking about Wes Kremer's part. ? love the lakai MJ xlk. love marc on adidas. ? 

[Paul Cicero]

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it was kinda gnarly when roger put skate shoe brands on blast saying they all make shitty shoes given everyone else in the room

[close]

It's a fact though, not as black and white as roger said but still true, and it's a big reason why they are struggling. Shutting up about it won't help anyone, if skate shoe companies want to succeed again they need to match the big ones in quality and be vocal about it

It's not a fact though. Lakai, Emerica have always had good shoes. People will say something along the lines of "I had some Lakai's and they blew out in a week", yeah well that happens sometimes with gear when you skate. I've been given Nikes and Adidas in the past and they have never ever been of a higher quality then any Lakai or Emerica shoe I've ever owned.

Emerica has been vocal about lifting their quality in the past (see the "higher quality" campaign) which I thought was a bold way to go when in reality they didn't really have to, but felt a need to because of bullshit statements spread by people like Roger and yourself.

Some of you guys love skating enough to sit on a website all day talking about every minor detail about it, but for whatever reason don't want to support the companies that have skateboardings best interests at heart. Actual skate companies. Not sportwear brands that are clearly in skating because it's cool right now and they can make money off it. If you love skateboarding then fucking support it.

[SonictheHedgehog]

But fuck all that - how the hell can you have Marc fucking Johnson on the show & ask so little about SKATEBOARDING? Maybe I'm alone on this & everyone really wants to hear another tedious retracing of a dude's arc through the industry, babbling about shoe designs, business, etc. but man I would LOVE to turn this show over to Kelly for an episode (or anyone who's a genuine skate rat) and ask the kinda questions skate rats want to hear.

There's so many tricks from MJs parts I'd love to hear stories about: how long did this take to land? What's your technique for that trick? Tell me about how you even thought of doing that combo? My ears pricked up when Roberts asked if he was skating lately - I love hearing about what dudes are up to skate-wise, what tricks they're working on, how skating is feeling to them lately, etc. But of course that didn't go anywhere since Roberts really just wants to talk industry shit.

Oh well, still a fascinating watch. MJ sounds like kind of a mess, but I feel for a lot of what he's struggled with. And he's one of the greatest to ever step on a plank.

This x1000. In particualr the Fully Flared stories

[Hevonen]

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it was kinda gnarly when roger put skate shoe brands on blast saying they all make shitty shoes given everyone else in the room

[close]

It's a fact though, not as black and white as roger said but still true, and it's a big reason why they are struggling. Shutting up about it won't help anyone, if skate shoe companies want to succeed again they need to match the big ones in quality and be vocal about it

[close]

It's not a fact though. Lakai, Emerica have always had good shoes. People will say something along the lines of "I had some Lakai's and they blew out in a week", yeah well that happens sometimes with gear when you skate. I've been given Nikes and Adidas in the past and they have never ever been of a higher quality then any Lakai or Emerica shoe I've ever owned.

Emerica has been vocal about lifting their quality in the past (see the "higher quality" campaign) which I thought was a bold way to go when in reality they didn't really have to, but felt a need to because of bullshit statements spread by people like Roger and yourself.

Some of you guys love skating enough to sit on a website all day talking about every minor detail about it, but for whatever reason don't want to support the companies that have skateboardings best interests at heart. Actual skate companies. Not sportwear brands that are clearly in skating because it's cool right now and they can make money off it. If you love skateboarding then fucking support it.

Kook Away.

I had two pairs of lakais 7 years ago, and skated a hole in them in a day, and after a week they were completely thrashed. A year ago I wanted to give them a new chance since the gap from the last purchase was reasonable. This time they didn't blow up as fast but got really soggy in a week or so. Same with most skate shoe brands I've tried in the recent years. This is basically the only thing I base my argument on haha, but a lot of people I talk to feel the same way.

Of course the majority of the issue is the big corps infinite marketing budget and good strategy, but shitty quality leaves a bad taste for a long time to a lot of people