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Basically what you're saying here, is that it's not Nike's problem that they use exploitative labor, because ultimately it's governmental and trade organizational policies that create conditions so miserable that people are willing to work in the sweat shops in the first place. I do not and will never agree with this.
nope, you're confused again. it's not nike's responsibility to solve the issues of exploitative labor. it is however their problem that their brand is associated with those practices and they've responded by trying to solve the problems in some novel and interesting ways. just because they aren't doing exactly what you think they should be doing (which you still haven't made clear) is no reason to assert that they're the problem itself. clear now?
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How did the in house inspectors miss the human trafficking in Malaysia again?
i'll let you answer this one. "Have you ever actually considered that the factory owners take the Nike inspectors(and most investigators) on phony tours?" you made that one too easy.
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And again, while I basically agree with you that WTO and other policies are at fault here as much as anyone. That doesn't excuse Nike of paying people pennys while spending millions to make it look like they aren't. I know it make sense on some corporate .pdf somewhere. But if you could stop and actually just think about that for a second, I feel you'd probably get it too. Maybe.
first, the WTO and policies are ENTIRELY at fault. no one else involved even comes close. second, the pay scale is not set by nike. its set by the govt and business owners in their respective countries. if you can find a factory anywhere in america that can handle the volume they require and do it for anything even near the price, let me know. oh yah, there aren't any. china, vietnam, pakistan, thailand all spent years subduing their people, their currency, their respective labor markets and influencing trade agreements via the WTO to position themselves where they are. now there simply aren't any options left on the table that make sense when it comes to the kind of volume they demand. i mean, you're not going to buy shoes at twice the price, so they can't feasibly make them at twice the price. you don't need a corporate spreadsheet to know that.
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I liked this paragraph. It's almost as if you're accidentally arguing against Nike using slumlord exploitative factories without even knowing it! That you're saying Nike couldn't even pay their workers better if they wanted to because of the sketchy factories they use, is the problem.
not what i'm saying. i'm saying that most, if not all, of the factories out there that can do that kind of volume are that way and that it's pretty much sanctioned via the govt there under the influence of the WTO and world bank policy. if there's only peanuts on the table, you can't just decide to eat almonds.
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Meh, again you're right about the root causes but that's not to say we shouldn't expose wrong when we see it and hope the policies which in part lead to them one day get changed.
totally agree.
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Why do you think the WTO policies are the way they are? Corporations write them brah.
true, but i think using the general word "corporations" without making a distinction between which ones are actively involved in the policy process is unfair and naive. talk about walmart, talk about target, talk about the people who actually have members on those boards that actually make that happen. but give credit where it's due when there is action in the other direction. demonizing and generalizing has never helped any cause. informed and specific criticism, and sustained pressure is what works. and it's this method, incidentally, that got nike to go from being the flamethrowing assholes they were, to getting into the good fight (not exactly on the front line and doing what they could from where they stand. so the proofs in the pudding.
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Embarrassing the fuck out of them to the point that they have to spend so much it's more cost effective to either move production back here or actually take care of their workers elsewhere has as much of a chance as affecting changing as just constantly screaming about the WTO. We actually know people like Eric and can say shit about sweat shops. Who do I contact about the WTO? Hold on I'll email my congressman!
true. but again, thats what they're already doing. they were embarrassed by their own responses and media attention they got in the early days of "fuck nike" when all they were doing was attack ads and shit. then someone got the bright idea to actually do something about the problem and as far as i can see, they're doing a lot. they may or may not be doing enough, but then again, i wasn't arguing that they were the saviour of the sweatshops. i'm just saying given their recent progress, the demonizing is a bit out of place. give credit where it's due. have you even seen the factories that lakai uses? soletech? any other company? nope, because it's not in the media and no one posted a video of them on youtube. which means your viewpoint is still that of a pawn because they got you looking right with the media hype and there's more real shit happening on the left.
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Stop talking about Sweat Shops, Nike and all the other shit get bulid in Asia for the American Market... it just silly.
They dont want to produce it by herself, they want to buy it cheap as possible and the want to sell it expencive as possible - nobody give a shit about the people in Laos, Vietnam or Cambodia and how they earn there money.
If you give me the nike money - i swear i can build up an factory in Asia where they can build shoes in good quality for an fair price under good conditions for the workers. But the industrie dont want that - they will change the factorys from time to time to give pressure in the market and get the shoes for a better price - for a better profit - nothing else.
Back in the days Companys have produced shoes in USA - now the produce shoes for half price - and shoes get cheaper the last 10 Years?
The changed production from korea to china, from china to Vietnam and now the produce in Laos and Cambodia... to save money in production.... you fill that if you buy a pair of Dunks - "oh 20cent cheaper again... thanks good that nike change the factory again!"
just a stupid game... on the shoulders of the workers in asia, but with an great shareholder value for the big & fat white man.