Wheels Thread

[PuffinMuffin]

Man people are playing themselves in this thread. The whole thread has been talking about how bad the cores are for this formula, and people are still ordering the ones with cores.

For real, if they aren't selling ones without cores, just wait for the commercial release that (hopefully) won't have any cores in sight.

From what it sounds like, at least the 93a V6 56mm will get a legit release, so I'm happy.

I feel like I should just make a thread about this formula with all this info at the top so people stop playing themselves.

I honestly can't tell the difference between cored and uncored, they slide the same after they're worn in. I've been skating them nearly every day for almost a month. If I had to guess they removed the core due to increased manufacturing costs.

[cucktard]

I was also wondering that if this new formula is more expensive, a hub might mean less material used and a reduction in cost, but I have absolutely no idea if that’s the case.

[LebowskisRug]

Expand Quote

Man people are playing themselves in this thread. The whole thread has been talking about how bad the cores are for this formula, and people are still ordering the ones with cores.

For real, if they aren't selling ones without cores, just wait for the commercial release that (hopefully) won't have any cores in sight.

From what it sounds like, at least the 93a V6 56mm will get a legit release, so I'm happy.

I feel like I should just make a thread about this formula with all this info at the top so people stop playing themselves.

[close]

I honestly can't tell the difference between cored and uncored, they slide the same after they're worn in. I've been skating them nearly every day for almost a month. If I had to guess they removed the core due to increased manufacturing costs.

Maybe I missed it but what's your take so far?

[oak leaf]

i ride spit 99s and 97s, both in conical full. i feel like even with 56s the roads are so rough i can get pitched if im not careful. what am i missing that allows people to get away with sub 50s? i was a kid during the small wheel era but also only pushed around parking lots lol

edit: like how the hell are people even cruising at archives on 50s? seems hellish

[PuffinMuffin]

Expand Quote

Expand Quote

Man people are playing themselves in this thread. The whole thread has been talking about how bad the cores are for this formula, and people are still ordering the ones with cores.

For real, if they aren't selling ones without cores, just wait for the commercial release that (hopefully) won't have any cores in sight.

From what it sounds like, at least the 93a V6 56mm will get a legit release, so I'm happy.

I feel like I should just make a thread about this formula with all this info at the top so people stop playing themselves.

[close]

I honestly can't tell the difference between cored and uncored, they slide the same after they're worn in. I've been skating them nearly every day for almost a month. If I had to guess they removed the core due to increased manufacturing costs.

[close]

Maybe I missed it but what's your take so far?

I really like them. My feet hurt less riding these compared to 97a F4s. At 52mm with Thunders there isn't much wheelbite, and it takes so many fewer pushes to maintain speed. They took me a couple of sessions to get used to. The slide feels different, but not necessarily bad. I feel I'd rather ride 101 F4s if I was only skating Cali parks. But there's no smooth concrete in town, so these get ridden daily. 

[LebowskisRug]

I mean I have skated a lot of rough Cali parks and live in SD where most street spots are pretty normal to slightly rough... but ya they suck at the smooth parks no doubt.

[Xen]

Man people are playing themselves in this thread. The whole thread has been talking about how bad the cores are for this formula, and people are still ordering the ones with cores.

For real, if they aren't selling ones without cores, just wait for the commercial release that (hopefully) won't have any cores in sight.

From what it sounds like, at least the 93a V6 56mm will get a legit release, so I'm happy.

I feel like I should just make a thread about this formula with all this info at the top so people stop playing themselves.

They're dumping dead stock for $$$. No reason to buy the cored sample except to support/check them out at this point.

I was also wondering that if this new formula is more expensive, a hub might mean less material used and a reduction in cost, but I have absolutely no idea if that’s the case.

It's PP, I wouldn't put it past them to boost the price to recoup R&D (hence selling samples still); other wheel co wheels with cores are the same price as non-cored wheels.

Anyone skate any of the Snot wheels from the last couple drops (from this year)?

Yes, 52mm, 101a with cores (Boogerthane). They're HARD. Really hard, and fast. Like old Ricta Chrome Core hard (but not chalky). Right up there with OJs/Ricta for hard ass white wheels. Not bouncy at all.

Slide is nowhere near F4 or STF still (but what is), they're [less] grippy than OJs, gotta push to get them moving. If you skate smooth plaza or parks, these will hold up for sure. Not for the faint of heart on regular streets where 99a would be ideal. Shape is reaaaaaaal nice, like a thinner STF V1, i.e, a classic shape on the thinner side.

Much better than the 1.0 versions they released without a doubt.

[rocklobster]

Setup some Autobahn 54mm Dual Duro Street Slims yesterday and they felt pretty horrible compared to F4s, even when worn down to 50mm, impossible to maintain any speed just cruising around the park. Not complete shit but I needed a reminder how good Spitfires are by riding 2nd tier wheels.

[tzhangdox]

Skated some curbs on the 93as today (Rockridge BART, pretty rough ground). Felt super nice to ride around, way better than a hard wheel. Powerslides pretty well too but definitely gripped, caught and stuck much more than 99a f4s doing slappies. Made my usual slappies noticeably less consistent. Seems like the slide is very good when you're just trying to do a powerslide, but in other cases it can definitely still perform like a soft ish wheel (but still better than a cruiser wheel). A shame because I really don't wanna ride around on hard wheels anymore after this lol but these definitely hinder my skating in several cases

[JRainey]

I got some of the 56mm 93a no-core V4. They have to get sent to europe before I can test. I was recently skating 56mm CF 97a F4s and switched back to 99a of the same wheel to compare.

97d F4 is much nicer in the rough stuff, but I noticed on smooth asphalt they were a little sluggish and never really slid at the end of 180s for example.

Back to 99a worn down to 54mm and they surely don't feel as good on the rough roads getting to the spot, but once I get to the smooth ground they just feel right.

Will be interested in how the Bones bridge the gap. I'll probably put in a couple more days on the 97a F4 whenever they show up so I can have that feeling fresh for comparison. I basically live in rural europe, so many rough roads, but some are really worked-in and glassy and that's a dream on hard wheels. Absolutely no polished concrete. No skatepark.

[lilboosie]

i wanna say i found it here not long ago, but does anyone have the email for the dlx warranty stuff

i know it was an address to a specific person but i forgot it and who. they helped out when i had a warped deck a while back

anyways i got some 55 skate like a girl f4 classics and only had a couple sessions. one has a chunk off already and another wheel has some small pulling or stripping. like a hang nail or string cheese stripping.

never had issued with f4s and wouldnt care if this wasnt just 2 sessions in. as in it getting worse

[rocklobster]

i wanna say i found it here not long ago, but does anyone have the email for the dlx warranty stuff

i know it was an address to a specific person but i forgot it and who. they helped out when i had a warped deck a while back

anyways i got some 55 skate like a girl f4 classics and only had a couple sessions. one has a chunk off already and another wheel has some small pulling or stripping. like a hang nail or string cheese stripping.

never had issued with f4s and wouldnt care if this wasnt just 2 sessions in. as in it getting worse

[email protected]

[lilboosie]

ty!!! <2

[tzhangdox]

Skated some atf shape 95a bones with the hubs today, schoolyard, black top asphalt. Unlike the 93a and 90a which are well in hybrid and cruiser wheel territory respectively, these definitely feel and sound like a traditional hard wheel.

They basically feel like a 99a formula four, but maybe very slightly worse if we're splitting hairs. Compared to my friends' 99a 53mm radials, the bones felt maybe the slightest bit harder if anything at all (weird because these are 95a), and slid ever so slightly worse (but definitely better than a 97a f4). When it comes to maintaining speed I don't really notice a difference, pretty hard to tell, they're both good quality wheels and neither feels slow.

I don't think the cores should necessarily make too much of a difference here, I did a slide test with my hands on this butter box so the cores shouldn't have affected the slide feel in that scenario vs the f4s which fared slightly better.

This was my first session on them so maybe they're going to break in more and feel better than f4s. The more difficult slide might also be due to the fact that these wheels are wide as fuck, like noticeably wider than an equivalent 54mm conical full which is already wider than I like. Felt like I had dumbbells on the ends of my axles when doing flip tricks.

I also haven't tested them on a variety of surfaces yet. But based on my first impressions, these are a very good wheel but I'm not seeing any major reasons to pick them over a 99a f4, though that may change as I skate them more.

[tuesday]

Still no pictures of the Bones? Slap is slacking. Hope they got the old experimental graphic.

[FuzzGNU]

Still no pictures of the Bones? Slap is slacking. Hope they got the old experimental graphic.

I posted them many many pages ago, but mine are blank so there is not much to see.

https://www.slapmagazine.com/index.php?topic=82118.msg3803767#msg3803767

[FuzzGNU]

Skated some atf shape 95a bones with the hubs today, schoolyard, black top asphalt. Unlike the 93a and 90a which are well in hybrid and cruiser wheel territory respectively, these definitely feel and sound like a traditional hard wheel.

They basically feel like a 99a formula four, but maybe very slightly worse if we're splitting hairs. Compared to my friends' 99a 53mm radials, the bones felt maybe the slightest bit harder if anything at all (weird because these are 95a), and slid ever so slightly worse (but definitely better than a 97a f4). When it comes to maintaining speed I don't really notice a difference, pretty hard to tell, they're both good quality wheels and neither feels slow.

I don't think the cores should necessarily make too much of a difference here, I did a slide test with my hands on this butter box so the cores shouldn't have affected the slide feel in that scenario vs the f4s which fared slightly better.

This was my first session on them so maybe they're going to break in more and feel better than f4s. The more difficult slide might also be due to the fact that these wheels are wide as fuck, like noticeably wider than an equivalent 54mm conical full which is already wider than I like. Felt like I had dumbbells on the ends of my axles when doing flip tricks.

I also haven't tested them on a variety of surfaces yet. But based on my first impressions, these are a very good wheel but I'm not seeing any major reasons to pick them over a 99a f4, though that may change as I skate them more.

I know you said you rode the 93a with the core and it felt really soft. That's bizarre, and very interesting to hear. 93a without the core feels only very slightly softer than F4 99a. They don't feel even feel like a hyrbid cruiser wheel AT ALL, just a straight up trick wheel. While the 90a without a core however feels like an unapologetic cruiser wheel (down to the chunking issues, from what I've seen).

I think the cores really do effect this formula, but its so hard to predict in what ways on a duro to duro basis. However, I really do suspect they universally affect the ability to initiate powerslides though, because the 97a cored and 95a cored were notably harder to powerslide than the 93a without a core (and even the 90a without a core!). And it sounds like people who've tried the 93a WITH a core have not enjoyed the wheel very much, which says A LOT because it seems like everyone who has tried 93a WITHOUT the core has gushed over it as much as I have.

I think people in this thread have said the 95a without the cores slide well? And don't feel as rock hard like 95a cored we've experienced? I really want to try the 95a without a core now based on what has been said in this thread.

Just to distill my sentiments on what I've tried:
- The 97a WITH core are nearly unskateable in many respects, but was fun to mess around on. Vibrate your feet to hell.
- The 95a WITH core are a decent wheel but struggled with pebbles/cracks, and powerslide initiation.
- The 93a no core are my favorite wheel of all time. Period.
- The 90a no core are a cruiser (hybrid?) wheel that slides alright, but almost feels like its made obsolete by the 93a's extreme competence. Would probably make a really solid filmer wheel due to how quiet they are. Their powerslides are even near silent at times.

[LebowskisRug]

I agree with @tzhangdox on how the 93a feel and think that they are like a slightly harder cruiser wheel. They powerslide and then stick, and don't necessarily slide that great but not bad either. They're slow as shit at a nice skatepark and great on anything else. I don't know why you keep saying otherwise and think anyone who would get these over 99F4 would be a bit disappointed in the end.

[tuesday]

Expand Quote

Still no pictures of the Bones? Slap is slacking. Hope they got the old experimental graphic.

[close]

I posted them many many pages ago, but mine are blank so there is not much to see.

https://www.slapmagazine.com/index.php?topic=82118.msg3803767#msg3803767

@FuzzGNU thanks!

[tzhangdox]

Expand Quote

Skated some atf shape 95a bones with the hubs today, schoolyard, black top asphalt. Unlike the 93a and 90a which are well in hybrid and cruiser wheel territory respectively, these definitely feel and sound like a traditional hard wheel.

They basically feel like a 99a formula four, but maybe very slightly worse if we're splitting hairs. Compared to my friends' 99a 53mm radials, the bones felt maybe the slightest bit harder if anything at all (weird because these are 95a), and slid ever so slightly worse (but definitely better than a 97a f4). When it comes to maintaining speed I don't really notice a difference, pretty hard to tell, they're both good quality wheels and neither feels slow.

I don't think the cores should necessarily make too much of a difference here, I did a slide test with my hands on this butter box so the cores shouldn't have affected the slide feel in that scenario vs the f4s which fared slightly better.

This was my first session on them so maybe they're going to break in more and feel better than f4s. The more difficult slide might also be due to the fact that these wheels are wide as fuck, like noticeably wider than an equivalent 54mm conical full which is already wider than I like. Felt like I had dumbbells on the ends of my axles when doing flip tricks.

I also haven't tested them on a variety of surfaces yet. But based on my first impressions, these are a very good wheel but I'm not seeing any major reasons to pick them over a 99a f4, though that may change as I skate them more.

[close]

I know you said you rode the 93a with the core and it felt really soft. That's bizarre, and very interesting to hear. 93a without the core feels only very slightly softer than F4 99a. They don't feel even feel like a hyrbid cruiser wheel AT ALL, just a straight up trick wheel. While the 90a without a core however feels like an unapologetic cruiser wheel (down to the chunking issues, from what I've seen).

I think the cores really do effect this formula, but its so hard to predict in what ways on a duro to duro basis. However, I really do suspect they universally affect the ability to initiate powerslides though, because the 97a cored and 95a cored were notably harder to powerslide than the 93a without a core (and even the 90a without a core!). And it sounds like people who've tried the 93a WITH a core have not enjoyed the wheel very much, which says A LOT because it seems like everyone who has tried 93a WITHOUT the core has gushed over it as much as I have.

I think people in this thread have said the 95a without the cores slide well? And don't feel as rock hard like 95a cored we've experienced? I really want to try the 95a without a core now based on what has been said in this thread.

Just to distill my sentiments on what I've tried:
- The 97a WITH core are nearly unskateable in many respects, but was fun to mess around on. Vibrate your feet to hell.
- The 95a WITH core are a decent wheel but struggled with pebbles/cracks, and powerslide initiation.
- The 93a no core are my favorite wheel of all time. Period.
- The 90a no core are a cruiser (hybrid?) wheel that slides alright, but almost feels like its made obsolete by the 93a's extreme competence. Would probably make a really solid filmer wheel due to how quiet they are. Their powerslides are even near silent at times.

I totally believe that the cores affect the feel of the wheel, but there's no way it should affect the 93a this much, especially since the cores should make the wheel feel harder according to the powell guy, and we've found the cored 93a to feel like a soft hybrid wheel. Maybe there's a lot of manufacturing variance with these prototypes, or they straight up just labelled some of the packages wrong.

Don't get me wrong, I think the 93as are really good. Super impressed they were able to make wheels like the 90s and 93s that are soft/hybrid, handle rough ground incredibly, but still slide. Its just they lack the feel and response of a hard trick wheel and I don't think I'm willing to get used to that. The 95a with cores are still very good, just don't see why I'd ride these over f4s, they feel pretty similar.

[FuzzGNU]

I agree with @tzhangdox on how the 93a feel and think that they are like a slightly harder cruiser wheel. They powerslide and then stick, and don't necessarily slide that great but not bad either. They're slow as shit at a nice skatepark and great on anything else. I don't know why you keep saying otherwise and think anyone who would get these over 99F4 would be a bit disappointed in the end.

I keep saying it because it is completely disconnected from the objective reality of the wheels I have been skating. Like some of the descriptions people are giving of the cored 93a are objectively different from the wheels I am skating, not even a matter of opinion or perception.

These things definitely don't stick. They slide nearly as well as F4 99a. They are NOT slow as shit at a skatepark (90a WERE very slow on flat, however). The 93a without a core that I had are at the minimum 1:1 with F4 99a in pretty much every way except for the slide initiation being slightly more difficult on the 93a. Aside from that one factor (and grinds) they equal or better them in every other category.

I totally believe that the cores affect the feel of the wheel, but there's no way it should affect the 93a this much, especially since the cores should make the wheel feel harder according to the powell guy, and we've found the cored 93a to feel like a soft hybrid wheel. Maybe there's a lot of manufacturing variance with these prototypes, or they straight up just labelled some of the packages wrong.

Don't get me wrong, I think the 93as are really good. Super impressed they were able to make wheels like the 90s and 93s that are soft/hybrid, handle rough ground incredibly, but still slide. Its just they lack the feel and response of a hard trick wheel and I don't think I'm willing to get used to that. The 95a with cores are still very good, just don't see why I'd ride these over f4s, they feel pretty similar.

Yeah the reason I keep pointing out that the cores make a difference is because that is completely disconnected from what my 93a without a core feel like, so it HAS to be either the cores or a mislabeled 90a cored. I don't think its out of the question that the core could make the 93a feel mushy or something, but that is certainly not what the uncored 93a feel like at all.

You keep saying cruiser and hybrid and the 93a without the core do not feel like a hybrid wheel at all. They are very responsive. They only have slightly less groundfeel than F4 99a. They aren't muted (or bouncy) like F4 97a, for example. I would consider the F4 97a a hybrid wheel, and these are not that. They slide great, they don't stick (which is what happens with the slide for the 95a cored, for example).

I just don't understand how you are talking so confidently about cores vs. uncored when we know this formula relies on vibration for slides. Its clear that the cores make things harder to slide at the very least. It makes sense since you are essentially putting a capo/damper on the wheel or something with the core being harder and having a different vibration frequency. Why would you think that the core effecting things magically no longer applies to 93a cored, right?

[tzhangdox]

I don't think that mine is a mislabelled 90a. Because I had a set of cored 90as too and they were even softer and quieter than the cored 93s.

Dude, I'm conceding that the cores definitely have an effect on how the wheels feel, its literally the first sentence you quoted. But even if we remove slides from the equation completely, me and @LebowskisRug both say that it feels like a slightly harder, hybrid cruiser wheel thats bouncy and muted when it comes to purely riding whereas you say that they basically feel like a f4 99a, harder than 97a. Very odd because if anything the cores should make the wheels feel harder.

Not trying to invalidate your experience. Its probably down to manufacturing variance, different batches over time, or some sort of mislabelling on one of our ends, that drastic of a difference in our perceptions of hardness is seriously unlikely to be solely due to the cores. If you're willing to post a clip of you skating them, do some powerslides, reverts, pop a few tricks etc I'd be curious to see how your uncored 93as ride and sound. Happy to do the same

[LebowskisRug]

There isn't an actual valid engineering reason cited that the cores would effect how the wheel slides. Cores of wheels don't flex much and they aren't going to effect vibration transfer that much. They especially wouldn't make a wheel feel softer and slower.

I can say objectively that they slide worse. I dropped in from the same point and slappy noseslid and tailslid the same box 3 times each way on the 93 and 99 F4. The Bones slowed down dramatically by the end of the box. The Spits were tested second and there was less wax and they carried the slide better.

Next I averaged 3 distances from the same drop in going slightly uphill. The F4 were dramatically faster. I didn't even have to push to hit and grind and entire box whereas the Bones slowed down so much that I had to push about 10-15 feet from the box. Also on crooks the 93 slowed down and squealed on the metal coping. I would start the grind at the very end of the ledge and the Bones would grind about 3/4 of the distance before I need to pop out.

Relying on vibrations might be how they slide but doesn't explain how the few people that have tested these at a smooth area found em bouncy and slower. I honestly don't mind the bounce.

Same exact bearings in both wheels, same board, no wind on a calm day. So far I think I'm the only person that has tested the two compounds back to back at spots with different surface types.

[Xen]

Cored wheels (supposedly) provide less flex on landings/rolling over shit; that’s why you see them primarily in softer/cruiser wheels. Less deformation around the bearing (seat).

They also provide (usually) a uniform/flat bearing seat.

Autobahn, at one point, had both hard inner cores (101?) with softer thane outers (97a?) as well as softer inner cores (97a) and 101 duro thane. The former were supposed reduce vibration for an easier ride but still skate like a hard wheel, not so dissimilar to what bones is trying (but with out a special anti-vibe formula).

I’ve some cored 99a ricta on hand and they feel no different than the regular ricta I have, tho I’m not hucking so maybe I can’t feel the difference. They do, however, feel harder than 99a spits or stfs but softer than 101 Ricta.

[FuzzGNU]

Cored wheels (supposedly) provide less flex on landings/rolling over shit; that’s why you see them primarily in softer/cruiser wheels. Less deformation around the bearing (seat).

They also provide (usually) a uniform/flat bearing seat.

Autobahn, at one point, had both hard inner cores (101?) with softer thane outers (97a?) as well as softer inner cores (97a) and 101 duro thane. The former were supposed reduce vibration for an easier ride but still skate like a hard wheel, not so dissimilar to what bones is trying (but with out a special anti-vibe formula).

I’ve some cored 99a ricta on hand and they feel no different than the regular ricta I have, tho I’m not hucking so maybe I can’t feel the difference. They do, however, feel harder than 99a spits or stfs but softer than 101 Ricta.

(This is kind of a reply to all three of you)

Yes, while I agree with most of the above sentiments, even Bones doesn't fully know how this stuff interacts, hence the test batches. Since this is a really unique formula, all bets are off. Especially when this formula relies on specific vibration characteristics, even musician knows how the science of vibrations is very particular.

Again, not all polyurethane are made the same. Not all cores are made the same (duro and formula). Not all cores are even binded the same. As far as I know the Bones uses a (proprietary?) method of chemically bonding their "hubs" to their wheels.

We can't just blanket apply how other cores work on other polyurethanes to how these cores effect this formula. We are talking about things like 95a wheels that feel like ~101 wheels. We can't really take anything for granted in that regard.


Its interesting to hear about those Ricta wheels you are talking about being anti-vibration, since these are seemingly leaning into the vibration (the opposite).

[rocklobster]

Cored wheels (supposedly) provide less flex on landings/rolling over shit; that’s why you see them primarily in softer/cruiser wheels. Less deformation around the bearing (seat).

They also provide (usually) a uniform/flat bearing seat.

Autobahn, at one point, had both hard inner cores (101?) with softer thane outers (97a?) as well as softer inner cores (97a) and 101 duro thane. The former were supposed reduce vibration for an easier ride but still skate like a hard wheel, not so dissimilar to what bones is trying (but with out a special anti-vibe formula).

Rode a set of the 54mm Dual Duro 101a (think it was the Street Slims) ones recently, lasted 30 min in the session before going back to F4. The park wasn't crusty and the ground was good (by street standards) but I was losing so much speed. Not sure if it was the skinny profile or a mediocre formula, even my worn down 50mm F4 fared much better.



Even those these are listed as Torus (wider) shape, they still look skinny in pictures.



Would like to see which company can come up with a skinny wheel that handles crust and slides fast, sounds like an impossible task for an incredibly niche audience.

[JANUS]

Does anybody know if the preproduction 93a wheels are USA only? I’d like to give them a whirl on some shit Canadian pavement. Or must I DM them like a man?

[Sundaynuggets]

I’m curious to try out the 90a without the core if anyone doesn’t want theirs. Up for trade or to buy

[cucktard]

Does anybody know if the preproduction 93a wheels are USA only? I’d like to give them a whirl on some shit Canadian pavement. Or must I DM them like a man?

It’s a bit pricier to ship to Canada, but they can do it.
I’m getting 2 sets sent there. Shipping is about $20-25 for two sets of wheels.

[Landmine]

I threw the 93a 52mm wheels on the egg last night, skating a parking garage with fairly rough concrete (like a textured, skin  grater surface, similar to most ditches I skate).  I'm impressed.  They definitely "feel" similar to a 97a but soak up more of the rough surface if that makes sense.  Took a little bit more effort to powerslide, but slappy noseslides felt the same.  Whenever these get a real release I'll grab some in a V1 or V4 shape if they exist.