Jeff Lenoce | The Nine Club With Chris Roberts - Episode 104

[Bubblegum Tate]

[rejectpaul]

Sick! This is one to look forward too after work! Haven’t listened to a 9 club since j lay! Gotta find myself the time for Turner as well!

Can’t wait to hear Lenoce though!

[Burt Ward]

Lenoce started following me on insta today. Coincidence? I think not. I woulda listened anyway Jeff.

[shit_for_brains]

At the end they start up the "we're going to charge more for boards" conversation and I know they're reading this but you'll see me on a fuckin revive board before I pay $60 a deck for you to sustain a 25 person team. Maybe if Baker didn't have 20 Lenoce-level producers pockets wouldn't be so tight. Theotis Beasley used to have a Bentley. Fuck you.

[pizzafliptofakie]

Funny, I wasn’t aware that they actually ran that highlights page. I made a comment on it and last time I was able to check it was the highest rated comment. But it looks like they took down the whole video, assumably because of the negative feedback.   

[shark tits]

yo, call me a piece of shit but do we even need pros? i'm 41 goddamn yrs old, unless 2$ is going into ricky oyola's pocket so he can change it into quarters and get on the billiards table, i don't care if anyone makes money of skating again.
i consume boards and i kick em down to the next man but idc about johnny hotshot billboard for such and such a company.
if that fat red prick can sell boards for less, why can't other folks?
i'm not gonna buy from him but i'll order direct from chapman or something, i don't need a logo.
real subtle, crob. it's like all the industry heads got together and made it worth 9club's while to mention this periodically so we're prepared when it happens.
oh yeah, that will also be the final nail in local shops' coffins.

[micky682]

$60 is already a lot for a piece of wood I’ll use for 3 weeks.

[cheetahsheets]

yo, call me a piece of shit but do we even need pros? i'm 41 goddamn yrs old, unless 2$ is going into ricky oyola's pocket so he can change it into quarters and get on the billiards table, i don't care if anyone makes money of skating again.
i consume boards and i kick em down to the next man but idc about johnny hotshot billboard for such and such a company.
if that fat red prick can sell boards for less, why can't other folks?
i'm not gonna buy from him but i'll order direct from chapman or something, i don't need a logo.
real subtle, crob. it's like all the industry heads got together and made it worth 9club's while to mention this periodically so we're prepared when it happens.
oh yeah, that will also be the final nail in local shops' coffins.

The fuck are you talking about with local shops? They get the shittiest end of the stick with the current situation. Their profit margins are getting lower because of inflation affecting woodshops/distribution, so if anything it should help them. Maybe if you are talking about online retail being competitive sure, but that’s already happened and the shops that survived survived

[shark tits]

Expand Quote

yo, call me a piece of shit but do we even need pros? i'm 41 goddamn yrs old, unless 2$ is going into ricky oyola's pocket so he can change it into quarters and get on the billiards table, i don't care if anyone makes money of skating again.
i consume boards and i kick em down to the next man but idc about johnny hotshot billboard for such and such a company.
if that fat red prick can sell boards for less, why can't other folks?
i'm not gonna buy from him but i'll order direct from chapman or something, i don't need a logo.
real subtle, crob. it's like all the industry heads got together and made it worth 9club's while to mention this periodically so we're prepared when it happens.
oh yeah, that will also be the final nail in local shops' coffins.

[close]

The fuck are you talking about with local shops? They get the shittiest end of the stick with the current situation. Their profit margins are getting lower because of inflation affecting woodshops/distribution, so if anything it should help them. Maybe if you are talking about online retail being competitive sure, but that’s already happened and the shops that survived survived

what the fuck i'm talking about w/ local shops is if they have to sell decks for more, people will buy from them less and that's how the world could end.
and that's how the world will end.
mail order $40 blanks will replace the brick and mortars and pro industry.
every generation the nerds get their revenge in skateboarding this revenge of the nerds is brought to you by schrockmaster j, josh katz and the annoyance of execution, the blandest there is the blandest there was the blandest there ever will be, john hill.

[shit_for_brains]

If my local shop bumps deck prices up I won't buy them there. Flat out. No business has a right to exist and if times are getting tough they're getting tough for me last.

[Allen.]

yo, call me a piece of shit but do we even need pros? i'm 41 goddamn yrs old, unless 2$ is going into ricky oyola's pocket so he can change it into quarters and get on the billiards table, i don't care if anyone makes money of skating again.
i consume boards and i kick em down to the next man but idc about johnny hotshot billboard for such and such a company.
if that fat red prick can sell boards for less, why can't other folks?
i'm not gonna buy from him but i'll order direct from chapman generator or something, i don't need a logo.
real subtle, crob. it's like all the industry heads got together and made it worth 9club's while to mention this periodically so we're prepared when it happens.
oh yeah, that will also be the final nail in local shops' coffins.

[cheetahsheets]

Literally this conversation would only happene with Americans. In every other country you pay an arm and a leg for hardgoods as it is. Look every single other industry in human existence this happens too. I’ve been going to the same barber for roughly 12 years. 12 years ago a haircut was $10, and now it’s 16$, every two years my man upped the shit by 1$. Still has every customer he ever had practically. The industry fucked themselves over by not doing a gradual change like every other product I know of. Since the middle of bush’s term I’m pretty sure inflation in the United States has gone up over 100%, which is fucked. Gas was less then a dollar in the 90s, it’s over three in most places now indicating an increase of over 200% since then. Has anyone that commented complaining about this ever worked on the books for a bussiness or white collar job? Not trying to sound like an elitist but I genuinely want to know because this at least to me seems like bussiness 101.

[schralp pal]

Baker is selling boards direct on their website for $60 already. I think they are keeping the shops prices the same so they don’t pinch them.

[A.J.K.]

Literally this conversation would only happene with Americans. In every other country you pay an arm and a leg for hardgoods as it is. Look every single other industry in human existence this happens too. I’ve been going to the same barber for roughly 12 years. 12 years ago a haircut was $10, and now it’s 16$, every two years my man upped the shit by 1$. Still has every customer he ever had practically. The industry fucked themselves over by not doing a gradual change like every other product I know of. Since the middle of bush’s term I’m pretty sure inflation in the United States has gone up over 100%, which is fucked. Gas was less then a dollar in the 90s, it’s over three in most places now indicating an increase of over 200% since then. Has anyone that commented complaining about this ever worked on the books for a bussiness or white collar job? Not trying to sound like an elitist but I genuinely want to know because this at least to me seems like bussiness 101.

You're forgetting that wages haven't risen since the 1970s. So you can bash our American friends all you want, but it is not at all unreasonable to take issue with rising prices for goods when what they earn has likely not kept pace.

I haven't watched the interview yet, but if Baker is really contemplating bumping prices up, then they'll be sending a ton of people into the arms of Revive, local shop boards, blanks, etc. I don't see at all how that strategy will work.

In this discussion I am reminded of those Crailtap warehouse tour videos, and being astounded at the amount of trinkety shit (beer accessories, sunglasses, dice, etc.) they make. People who ride skateboards shouldn't have to subsidize the ridiculous over extension of brands into products that can be purchased at a dollar store for much cheaper.

[Hairy Ballsagna]

[/quote]

In this discussion I am reminded of those Crailtap warehouse tour videos, and being astounded at the amount of trinkety shit (beer accessories, sunglasses, dice, etc.) they make. People who ride skateboards shouldn't have to subsidize the ridiculous over extension of brands into products that can be purchased at a dollar store for much cheaper.
[/quote]

I suspect that trinkety shit is subsidizing the boards, not the other way around. If you can buy that shit at a dollar store, what do you think it means for Crailtap's profit margin?

[shit_for_brains]

In this discussion I am reminded of those Crailtap warehouse tour videos, and being astounded at the amount of trinkety shit (beer accessories, sunglasses, dice, etc.) they make. People who ride skateboards shouldn't have to subsidize the ridiculous over extension of brands into products that can be purchased at a dollar store for much cheaper.
[/quote]

I suspect that trinkety shit is subsidizing the boards, not the other way around. If you can buy that shit at a dollar store, what do you think it means for Crailtap's profit margin?
[/quote]

That they're focusing on the wrong thing?

[Sick Duck]

That trinket shit is mostly low quality sweatshop shit marked up way too high also

[cheetahsheets]

Expand Quote

Literally this conversation would only happene with Americans. In every other country you pay an arm and a leg for hardgoods as it is. Look every single other industry in human existence this happens too. I’ve been going to the same barber for roughly 12 years. 12 years ago a haircut was $10, and now it’s 16$, every two years my man upped the shit by 1$. Still has every customer he ever had practically. The industry fucked themselves over by not doing a gradual change like every other product I know of. Since the middle of bush’s term I’m pretty sure inflation in the United States has gone up over 100%, which is fucked. Gas was less then a dollar in the 90s, it’s over three in most places now indicating an increase of over 200% since then. Has anyone that commented complaining about this ever worked on the books for a bussiness or white collar job? Not trying to sound like an elitist but I genuinely want to know because this at least to me seems like bussiness 101.

[close]

You're forgetting that wages haven't risen since the 1970s. So you can bash our American friends all you want, but it is not at all unreasonable to take issue with rising prices for goods when what they earn has likely not kept pace.

I haven't watched the interview yet, but if Baker is really contemplating bumping prices up, then they'll be sending a ton of people into the arms of Revive, local shop boards, blanks, etc. I don't see at all how that strategy will work.

In this discussion I am reminded of those Crailtap warehouse tour videos, and being astounded at the amount of trinkety shit (beer accessories, sunglasses, dice, etc.) they make. People who ride skateboards shouldn't have to subsidize the ridiculous over extension of brands into products that can be purchased at a dollar store for much cheaper.

I’m American homie, just done a lot of bussiness with non-Americans in the skate industry, and have a somewhat decent understanding of how things work outside of here.

Also, you don’t think shop board prices will go up as well? I mean it’s the woodshops that need to deal with inflation the most, since they get the raw material(maple) that’s basically the initial input into the process chain.

[shit_for_brains]

Expand Quote

Expand Quote

Literally this conversation would only happene with Americans. In every other country you pay an arm and a leg for hardgoods as it is. Look every single other industry in human existence this happens too. I’ve been going to the same barber for roughly 12 years. 12 years ago a haircut was $10, and now it’s 16$, every two years my man upped the shit by 1$. Still has every customer he ever had practically. The industry fucked themselves over by not doing a gradual change like every other product I know of. Since the middle of bush’s term I’m pretty sure inflation in the United States has gone up over 100%, which is fucked. Gas was less then a dollar in the 90s, it’s over three in most places now indicating an increase of over 200% since then. Has anyone that commented complaining about this ever worked on the books for a bussiness or white collar job? Not trying to sound like an elitist but I genuinely want to know because this at least to me seems like bussiness 101.

[close]

You're forgetting that wages haven't risen since the 1970s. So you can bash our American friends all you want, but it is not at all unreasonable to take issue with rising prices for goods when what they earn has likely not kept pace.

I haven't watched the interview yet, but if Baker is really contemplating bumping prices up, then they'll be sending a ton of people into the arms of Revive, local shop boards, blanks, etc. I don't see at all how that strategy will work.

In this discussion I am reminded of those Crailtap warehouse tour videos, and being astounded at the amount of trinkety shit (beer accessories, sunglasses, dice, etc.) they make. People who ride skateboards shouldn't have to subsidize the ridiculous over extension of brands into products that can be purchased at a dollar store for much cheaper.

[close]

I’m American homie, just done a lot of bussiness with non-Americans in the skate industry, and have a somewhat decent understanding of how things work outside of here.

Also, you don’t think shop board prices will go up as well? I mean it’s the woodshops that need to deal with inflation the most, since they get the raw material(maple) that’s basically the initial input into the process chain.

You spell business wrong a lot for knowing so much about it with big ol quotations there. Also what's the point you're trying to make? If prices go up prices will go up? Nobody's arguing that, just that we'll go find something cheaper.

[Mr. Fink]

Loved this episode. So glad that they mentioned Nickatina. The fact that Lenoce  skated differently that the rest of the Baker crew and wasn’t a loud personality always made him more interesting to me.

[Sick Duck]

Loved this episode. So glad that they mentioned Nickatina. The fact that Lenoce  skated differently that the rest of the Baker crew and wasn’t a loud personality always made him more interesting to me.

Yeah i’ve listened to most of it and it’s one of the better 9 clubs i’ve heard. Baker 3 and fully flared were huge for my skating as a teenager and lenoce was always a solid skater but i never knew much about him

[Francis Xavier]

$60 for a heat transfer graphic when it used to be screenprinted still sucks.

[Plop]

[cloudy]

In this discussion I am reminded of those Crailtap warehouse tour videos, and being astounded at the amount of trinkety shit (beer accessories, sunglasses, dice, etc.) they make. People who ride skateboards shouldn't have to subsidize the ridiculous over extension of brands into products that can be purchased at a dollar store for much cheaper.

hey, lets not single out crail here. bakerboys distribution hocks their fair share of trinkets as well.

"he went to jared zumiez!"

[Cuban_Lynx]

I always thought it was shitty Lenoce got his board pulled right after putting out his Shake Junt part, which is clearly one of his best. Makes sense if it was 5yo Fully Flared throwaway.

[cheetahsheets]

Expand Quote

Expand Quote

Expand Quote

Literally this conversation would only happene with Americans. In every other country you pay an arm and a leg for hardgoods as it is. Look every single other industry in human existence this happens too. I’ve been going to the same barber for roughly 12 years. 12 years ago a haircut was $10, and now it’s 16$, every two years my man upped the shit by 1$. Still has every customer he ever had practically. The industry fucked themselves over by not doing a gradual change like every other product I know of. Since the middle of bush’s term I’m pretty sure inflation in the United States has gone up over 100%, which is fucked. Gas was less then a dollar in the 90s, it’s over three in most places now indicating an increase of over 200% since then. Has anyone that commented complaining about this ever worked on the books for a bussiness or white collar job? Not trying to sound like an elitist but I genuinely want to know because this at least to me seems like bussiness 101.

[close]

You're forgetting that wages haven't risen since the 1970s. So you can bash our American friends all you want, but it is not at all unreasonable to take issue with rising prices for goods when what they earn has likely not kept pace.

I haven't watched the interview yet, but if Baker is really contemplating bumping prices up, then they'll be sending a ton of people into the arms of Revive, local shop boards, blanks, etc. I don't see at all how that strategy will work.

In this discussion I am reminded of those Crailtap warehouse tour videos, and being astounded at the amount of trinkety shit (beer accessories, sunglasses, dice, etc.) they make. People who ride skateboards shouldn't have to subsidize the ridiculous over extension of brands into products that can be purchased at a dollar store for much cheaper.

[close]

I’m American homie, just done a lot of bussiness with non-Americans in the skate industry, and have a somewhat decent understanding of how things work outside of here.

Also, you don’t think shop board prices will go up as well? I mean it’s the woodshops that need to deal with inflation the most, since they get the raw material(maple) that’s basically the initial input into the process chain.

[close]

You spell business wrong a lot for knowing so much about it with big ol quotations there. Also what's the point you're trying to make? If prices go up prices will go up? Nobody's arguing that, just that we'll go find something cheaper.

I have never written anything for a business, so I can assure you I’m not a good typer. I also tend to post on breaks at work, so I usually type the shit out quick.

Everyone seems super salty about this, and I don’t just mean this message board, but in general. It just blows my mind though when people freak out over it is all. You all can definitely go out and purchase stuff elsewhere, but I like to help out shops as much as possible. I don’t know how often you skate/go through decks, but an extra ten dollars really doesn’t affect me much considering I only go through boards once every month or two these days. When I was younger I went through 4-6 boards a month, but I was getting flowed boards too. I can definitely see how if you are going hard and don’t have a sponsor how it’s rough, or if you’re just a big dude/chick and snap em like twigs. I feel that most people don’t go through many boards when they end up getting jobs/have less time to skate. It was more of a rant about how I don’t understand people getting so upset about economics. Sorry if you felt it was directed at you. Also your one of my favorite posters, and every time I see your sig I have to watch it lol.

[A.J.K.]

That trinket shit is mostly low quality sweatshop shit marked up way too high also

Exactly, yeah, that's what I was trying to get at. Do I need a Chocolate or Deathwish or whatever branded *crappy accessory*? No, probably not, especially when they amount to dollar store items with a logo.

I suspect that trinkety shit is subsidizing the boards, not the other way around. If you can buy that shit at a dollar store, what do you think it means for Crailtap's profit margin?

This might have been true initially, but if Lenoce is talking about bumping prices up, the strategy appears not to be working.

Also, you don’t think shop board prices will go up as well? I mean it’s the woodshops that need to deal with inflation the most, since they get the raw material(maple) that’s basically the initial input into the process chain.

Sure, but this doesn't change the argument. If all boards go up the same amount, I would think more people will be turned off by expensive pro boards and opt for less expensive shop boards (despite the fact that the price of shop boards have risen in parallel).

It was more of a rant about how I don’t understand people getting so upset about economics. Sorry if you felt it was directed at you. Also your one of my favorite posters, and every time I see your sig I have to watch it lol.

People aren't getting mad at "economics," as if these are universal laws beyond human control. It's that people don't have disposable income to fund ever more expensive hobbies. This doesn't necessarily mean board manufactures (or someone else in the chain) are wrong to raise prices, but the rise in price is not paralleled with a rise in money to spend frivolously. Not to make this a huge issue--this is Slap--but skateboarding as an industry isn't immune from the broader socio-economic trends hurting much of North America and Europe.

[L33Tg33k]

Shit_for_brains seems to be a little militant about how he's never going to pay more. Didn't expect that outta you.

I'm not mad at brands for raising prices and I honestly think they should, but I personally am the type to go out hunting for the best deal. There will always be price point, clearance, and whatever else type of sale deck in my size and with a graphic that I like out there for me to purchase, and I will find them. I'm averaging in the $30-40 range. Even though I don't skate much, I am one of those fatties that will break boards skating flat so buying boards can become financial burden on me. Buying more than one a month is a fucking drag. I got a budget to keep. Even so, if for some reason I really like a board and I can only get it full price and that price is $60....I'll get it because it won't kill me.

[shit_for_brains]

Shit_for_brains seems to be a little militant about how he's never going to pay more. Didn't expect that outta you.

I'm not mad at brands for raising prices and I honestly think they should, but I personally am the type to go out hunting for the best deal. There will always be price point, clearance, and whatever else type of sale deck in my size and with a graphic that I like out there for me to purchase, and I will find them. I'm averaging in the $30-40 range. Even though I don't skate much, I am one of those fatties that will break boards skating flat so buying boards can become financial burden on me. Buying more than one a month is a fucking drag. I got a budget to keep. Even so, if for some reason I really like a board and I can only get it full price and that price is $60....I'll get it because it won't kill me.

In specific context to how Heath Brinkley and Jeff Lenoce talk about it I think my response makes sense. Everything they say is dripping with disdain for their customer. If you went to Target and there was a person who stopped you at the door and lectured you about how the world works and how things are going to start costing more so you better fuckin' get ready, asshole, would you ever go back? That's why Target just raises their prices and doesn't act like you owe them a favor.

It won't kill me either but if they act like they're entitled to my money they aren't going to get it.

[pizzafliptofakie]

Another thing that gets me with this argument is the fact that the market is WAY too oversaturated. There are way too many mouths to feed, and when everybody has their own cool new skateboard company, nobody does. It bothers me when people who haven’t had to pay for a skateboard in over ten years try to lecture (and in some cases blame) the consumer for poor marketing on their end.