Author Topic: Independent are still the best (change my mind)  (Read 8447 times)

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bad joke

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Re: Independent are still the best (change my mind)
« Reply #60 on: January 25, 2020, 09:43:19 PM »
so uh wat trucks should i buy

munchbox

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Re: Independent are still the best (change my mind)
« Reply #61 on: January 25, 2020, 09:49:32 PM »
so uh wat trucks should i buy

kreepers
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palelight

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Re: Independent are still the best (change my mind)
« Reply #62 on: January 26, 2020, 12:56:24 AM »
are the aftermarket cylinder bushings also shorter than stock? im trying to get something close to the height of the ace classic deckside bushings

Aftermarket cylinder next to the aftermarket conical, if there's a difference in height I'd say it's close to negligible.


Indy cylinder next to an Ace. Ace is a mm or so taller. A thicker washer in this case would compensate.


Here's an Ace next to a stock Thunder, you can see here the Ace is right in between the Thunder and an aftermarket Indy,

munchbox

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Re: Independent are still the best (change my mind)
« Reply #63 on: January 26, 2020, 01:40:54 AM »
Expand Quote
are the aftermarket cylinder bushings also shorter than stock? im trying to get something close to the height of the ace classic deckside bushings
[close]

Aftermarket cylinder next to the aftermarket conical, if there's a difference in height I'd say it's close to negligible.


Indy cylinder next to an Ace. Ace is a mm or so taller. A thicker washer in this case would compensate.


Here's an Ace next to a stock Thunder, you can see here the Ace is right in between the Thunder and an aftermarket Indy,


thanks your help. i owe you a gnar when i can give em
is thunder the tallest bottom bushing on the market? my problem would be solved if they made a barrel in the same height. never owned a pair but the thunder supercush look shorter than their stock bottoms.

i recently put the ace bottom with a stock thunder top on my thunders and it is working perfectly when tightened flush. the ace bushing with the washer seems like it is squished and doesnt fit the trucks geo but its working magic. this setup is giving me the best stability ive ever had not only for landing but setting up tricks. its still a broken in 86a and will turn when i want it to but wont wobble during trick setup which i struggled with. the 90a thunder top with a bones washer is firm but gives me the full range of turn to wheelbite if i get careless.

my theory is that the ace barrel bushing is hard when squished up but since its 86a, it has to give in and flex when my body wants to turn. i couldnt replicate this feeling when replacing it with a shorter and harder barrel bushing. the set up stability was mushy and wobbly on a venture 90a barrel. it really is a strange thing that shouldnt work as described. could you explain it?

at the moment im looking for tall and soft bottom bushings cause knowing ace quality control, this magic might not last me long. all i know is ML bottoms are basically ace height. those pictures ruled out indy aftermarket. is supercush ace height?
« Last Edit: January 26, 2020, 01:43:25 AM by off »
while cool-guying is a real phenomenon, studies show that 83% of all cool-guying incidents can be attributed to the cool-guyee being an awkward weirdo

palelight

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Re: Independent are still the best (change my mind)
« Reply #64 on: January 26, 2020, 02:00:44 AM »

thanks your help. i owe you a gnar when i can give em
is thunder the tallest bottom bushing on the market? my problem would be solved if they made a barrel in the same height. never owned a pair but the thunder supercush look shorter than their stock bottoms.

i recently put the ace bottom with a stock thunder top on my thunders and it is working perfectly when tightened flush. the ace bushing with the washer seems like it is squished and doesnt fit the trucks geo but its working magic. this setup is giving me the best stability ive ever had not only for landing but setting up tricks. its still a broken in 86a and will turn when i want it to but wont wobble during trick setup which i struggled with. the 90a thunder top with a bones washer is firm but gives me the full range of turn to wheelbite if i get careless.

my theory is that the ace barrel bushing is hard when squished up but since its 86a, it has to give in and flex when my body wants to turn. i couldnt replicate this feeling when replacing it with a shorter and harder barrel bushing. the set up stability was mushy and wobbly on a venture 90a barrel. it really is a strange thing that shouldnt work as described. could you explain it?

at the moment im looking for tall and soft bottom bushings cause knowing ace quality control, this magic might not last me long. all i know is ML bottoms are basically ace height. those pictures ruled out indy aftermarket. is supercush ace height?

No problem. The 'Thunder' supercush as they're labelled at places like Tactics is actually wrong, they're DLX's bushings made for Ventures (which also fit Indy's). So yes, shorter than the Thunders by a good amount. The only aftermarket bushings that fit Thunders are the Thunder branded ones. No barrels (unless you get into the longboarder stuff, but I'm completely ignorant on that front, some other dudes here have experimented with them).

In terms of skate trucks, I'm fairly positive Thunder have the tallest bottom bushings. I only rode Thunders for maybe... two weeks, but after a a few days I threw on an Ace bottom as well to help with the wheelbite and make the turn a little less sketch. I think you'll be fine running the Ace bottom's on there, the height difference isn't enough to hurt the truck. Plus, the mixed duro is pretty close to Aces, you could even throw a Thunder 94 top bushing on there for quicker snap back (but then you're in deep frankenbushing territory).

As for why the Venture bottom barrel was acting weird, I'd have to say the height would probably be screwing it up. If you go back to the first page where I posted the pic of the Indy vs Thunder bushing the height difference is considerable (Indy and Ventures having the same size bottom bushings). When the geometry is off that much the yoke of the hanger won't seat correctly against the bushing, one side will make too much contact, the other side not enough, instant wobble because only half the bushing is interacting the way it should. Maintaining the proper bottom bushing height is important, the top bushing is where you can fuck around without too much consequence.

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Re: Independent are still the best (change my mind)
« Reply #65 on: January 26, 2020, 02:48:44 AM »
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forgive me if i somehow missed it, but could someone help me with just how flat the flat as fuck decks really are?
[close]

As Fuck.

munchbox

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Re: Independent are still the best (change my mind)
« Reply #66 on: January 26, 2020, 02:53:47 AM »
Expand Quote

thanks your help. i owe you a gnar when i can give em
is thunder the tallest bottom bushing on the market? my problem would be solved if they made a barrel in the same height. never owned a pair but the thunder supercush look shorter than their stock bottoms.

i recently put the ace bottom with a stock thunder top on my thunders and it is working perfectly when tightened flush. the ace bushing with the washer seems like it is squished and doesnt fit the trucks geo but its working magic. this setup is giving me the best stability ive ever had not only for landing but setting up tricks. its still a broken in 86a and will turn when i want it to but wont wobble during trick setup which i struggled with. the 90a thunder top with a bones washer is firm but gives me the full range of turn to wheelbite if i get careless.

my theory is that the ace barrel bushing is hard when squished up but since its 86a, it has to give in and flex when my body wants to turn. i couldnt replicate this feeling when replacing it with a shorter and harder barrel bushing. the set up stability was mushy and wobbly on a venture 90a barrel. it really is a strange thing that shouldnt work as described. could you explain it?

at the moment im looking for tall and soft bottom bushings cause knowing ace quality control, this magic might not last me long. all i know is ML bottoms are basically ace height. those pictures ruled out indy aftermarket. is supercush ace height?
[close]

No problem. The 'Thunder' supercush as they're labelled at places like Tactics is actually wrong, they're DLX's bushings made for Ventures (which also fit Indy's). So yes, shorter than the Thunders by a good amount. The only aftermarket bushings that fit Thunders are the Thunder branded ones. No barrels (unless you get into the longboarder stuff, but I'm completely ignorant on that front, some other dudes here have experimented with them).

In terms of skate trucks, I'm fairly positive Thunder have the tallest bottom bushings. I only rode Thunders for maybe... two weeks, but after a a few days I threw on an Ace bottom as well to help with the wheelbite and make the turn a little less sketch. I think you'll be fine running the Ace bottom's on there, the height difference isn't enough to hurt the truck. Plus, the mixed duro is pretty close to Aces, you could even throw a Thunder 94 top bushing on there for quicker snap back (but then you're in deep frankenbushing territory).

As for why the Venture bottom barrel was acting weird, I'd have to say the height would probably be screwing it up. If you go back to the first page where I posted the pic of the Indy vs Thunder bushing the height difference is considerable (Indy and Ventures having the same size bottom bushings). When the geometry is off that much the yoke of the hanger won't seat correctly against the bushing, one side will make too much contact, the other side not enough, instant wobble because only half the bushing is interacting the way it should. Maintaining the proper bottom bushing height is important, the top bushing is where you can fuck around without too much consequence.

yeah man i jumped two feet in the shit. sticking with these 151s and of course i had to mess with the last truck variables i could lol.

with the ace bottom bushing handling all the stability issues im highly tempted to get softer top bushings and loosen up the turn. the 90a top bushings are broken in, arent squishing out, and snap back well at flush tightness so i might drop duros there. i have a feeling the indy 88a top isnt soft enough to notice a much difference but they might last me longer than the thunders i have. the 78a indy top will be for shits and giggles but i might actually like em. as long as i can keep the deadzone when setting up, im happy.

messing with trucks was stressful as fuck. its really addicting due to frequenting truck threads and not knowing what i liked or was looking for. paid way too much in a short period of time to only really love one truck and i have only successfully sold 1 pair. gonna inquire about tensors and then im putting the needle down for good, barring a shock 151 titanium release ;D

bushing madness on the other hand is fun as fuck. at $3-$10 a pop, i can change a couple characteristics without have to buy a whole new chunk of metal. thanks for you insight its always much appreciated here
« Last Edit: January 26, 2020, 03:06:56 AM by off »
while cool-guying is a real phenomenon, studies show that 83% of all cool-guying incidents can be attributed to the cool-guyee being an awkward weirdo

Xen

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Re: Independent are still the best (change my mind)
« Reply #67 on: January 26, 2020, 10:26:01 PM »
Venom makes the closest to thunder bottom height but it's taller. Thunder s are the tallest bottom out...tho the stock Theeve hardcores are pretty damn close when new (thunder bottoms, like the rest, will squash down a bit.

Best to leave the thunder bottom stock or after market and mess with tops (low tops in Thunder for me, do I can get that nut on and have it still be loose).

givecigstosurfgroms

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Re: Independent are still the best (change my mind)
« Reply #68 on: January 27, 2020, 12:05:11 AM »
Indy dont make a 66.  Ace 66s are nice af.   Other then that indys fine, who cares.
"I just care about the river, I dont care about your back"

palelight

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Re: Independent are still the best (change my mind)
« Reply #69 on: January 27, 2020, 12:22:43 AM »
Indy dont make a 66.  Ace 66s are nice af.   Other then that indys fine, who cares.

I'd assume people in the 350+ pages of truck threads.

oldbummer

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Re: Independent are still the best (change my mind)
« Reply #70 on: January 27, 2020, 05:28:16 PM »
none of us just went and bought a caliper so we could actually measure bushing height

satan

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Re: Independent are still the best (change my mind)
« Reply #71 on: January 27, 2020, 07:48:29 PM »
none of us just went and bought a caliper so we could actually measure bushing height
I've got calipers but no access to stock bushings from all the big brands..
They're all gonna me pretty close. But yeah, some are ~1mm different in height.
And most aren't square so one side is thicker than the other. You put the high side in the center? If not it's gonna make the feel different left-to-right.
And wanna hear a mind fuck? They all could potentially have different compressed heights when you step on your board. And that'd make for a tiny geo change. Just messing with you guys and hoping to add to the madness..

https://www.harborfreight.com/search?q=Caliper
Pretty cheap..


edit for more madness
If you pull a stock, unused bushing out of new trucks it's already been compressed for months.
It's shorter than it used to be so you can't directly compare its height to a new aftermarket bushing.
Ya, just a tiny change in height..
And it'll have a height difference where it bulges into the yoke. I'd ignore that lump when taking measurements.
« Last Edit: January 27, 2020, 08:09:32 PM by satan »

palelight

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Re: Independent are still the best (change my mind)
« Reply #72 on: January 27, 2020, 08:35:04 PM »
none of us just went and bought a caliper so we could actually measure bushing height

Working on it.