Author Topic: Changes under Trump 2.0  (Read 188620 times)

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TheLurper

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Re: Changes under Trump 2.0
« Reply #450 on: February 04, 2025, 03:58:01 PM »

Whooooa there... easy big fella. I mean indoctrinated into low standards, each kid just another $15k brick in the wall just to meet the lowest expectations.

With all the federal red tape it seems like the doe has been a failed project. I would like to see teachers have more freedom (obviously with discretion from the local PTA).

There's been quite a few times at parent teacher conferences where teachers are consistently saying things like "we're only doing this to satisfy regulations" (especially in regards to common core math). Aiming everyone to be just at the bare minimum. I mean the report cards in elementary didn't even allow the teachers to grade at "above average" when a student was absolutely crushing it in a subject. They grade like this so that the next semester of reporting they can up it a notch in order to show "improvement over time' to pad the districts reporting metrics. Why not acknowledge these things when they happen and move the kids killing it to the next threshold. It seems like no child left behind has had the consequences of everyone trailing behind. These are the types of things I don't like and prevent me from having the doom and gloom perspective that some may have. And I can't relate to Mr. Lawndale's post in the slightest (although it did give me a chuckle).

I can't speak to the DOE as I don't fully understand their role. Instead, I've always understood education as a very local issue in America and relying primarily on local funding, input, and so on.

You are going to find a wide variety in the quality of schools no matter which type you pick. The thought that the category of school determines its ability to educate is a little too simple.

Charters: These range from amazing to complete scams. 
Private: Same
Religious Private: Range from awesome with a bit of religion tossed in to schools that teach dinosaurs walked the earth when Jesus turned water into wine and walked on water.
Public: Huge spectrum as well, but there is always public oversight.
Home: The range here is also huge. Kids not learning the absolute basics of even how to read to kids being indoctrinated with religious nonsense to kids being overachievers. Although, I do worry about kids who are homeschooled and face unpleasant home lives whether by neglect or abuse. No escape from hell.  The idea that parents are always right or always safe is absurd. A lot of children need the chance to escape their parent's abuse and idiocy.

Looking at the schools alone also doesn't account for the negative influence environments and parents. Kids in super poor families face all sorts of issues in their neighborhoods. Kids aren't going to kick ass if they're hungry, tired, afraid, and stressed all the time. 8 hours in the classroom with the most caring teacher in the world won't erase the other 16 hours a day fighting for an existence. And, wealthy parents are pretty fucking dumb. They push the schools to encourage sports instead of academics.
https://press.uchicago.edu/ucp/books/book/chicago/R/bo149570065.html

And, parental "discipline" isn't necessarily good for kids either, unless we are trying to teach them to be the lowest ranking person in any institution.
https://www.ucpress.edu/books/unequal-childhoods/paper

Finally, I'm biased. I collected a lot of degrees and I only went to public schools. My public high school is in the top 20 schools in the state I grew up in. That school, despite the problems and my rebellious fuck authority mentality, gave me a huge advantage in life. An advantage I could have never afforded through a voucher. My mom was a single mom without a lot of money. We couldn't afford an extra 7K in tuition costs + transportation to an expensive rich kid private school. Nor would she have had the ability to teach me. My computer classes, math classes, and foreign language classes surpassed where she felt comfortable in late middle school. She wasn't going to teach me HTML, trig/pre-calc, or the basics of Spanish, but my high school did.

We could potentially set up all schools to be like Oak Lane Country Day School, where Chomsky went as a child, but the cost would be astounding. Public education has its issues but for the for-profit-education scares me the most and homeschooling makes me uncomfortable. Yea, some parents are qualified to teach their kids, a lot of parents aren't and their poor kids are starting off life with a huge disadvantage. And, anecdotally, I'm yet to meet a home schooled kid who was able to socialize well with their peers. Both home school kids that skated my local park were difficult to interact with. Not saying they were bad, but they struggled interacting with their peers.
« Last Edit: February 04, 2025, 04:20:18 PM by TheLurper »

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m477

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Re: Changes under Trump 2.0
« Reply #451 on: February 04, 2025, 05:42:31 PM »
Do you know what the word "indoctrinate" means?

You should take more care in using terms like that when discussing the public school system, because while you are clearly aligning yourself with its detractors, your misuse of that word makes it seem for very different reasons.

Haha, man I don't know what to tell you! Its funny you recommend that I take more care with my words because I made an effort for each of my posts to be as benign and honest as possible. And even then I still got Betsy Devoed! Par for the course though, I know how this place works and it did make me laugh. I see you edited your post, are you still asking if I know what the word means? It means to teach, and I was always taught to be reasonably skeptical of the government.

https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/indoctrinate

in·​doc·​tri·​nate in-ˈdäk-trə-ˌnāt
indoctrinated; indoctrinating
Synonyms of indoctrinate
transitive verb
1
: to imbue with a usually partisan or sectarian opinion, point of view, or principle
2
: to instruct especially in fundamentals or rudiments : TEACH

I'm sure I can't be the only one that has used this term in reference to the government (it can be used in a myriad of ways). Appreciate everyones insights, I'll see myself out.

EdLawndale

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Re: Changes under Trump 2.0
« Reply #452 on: February 04, 2025, 06:08:16 PM »
I'm sorry, I still don't think you are using the word correctly. When one objects to indoctrination in an educational setting, it really only refers to the subject matter the pupils are being taught.
"Was just about to say, wtf is up with this EdLawndale guy?"


pugmaster

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Re: Changes under Trump 2.0
« Reply #453 on: February 04, 2025, 06:08:42 PM »
Demonizing educators and characterizing them as purposely "indoctrinating," where they are trying to spread some particular agenda with ulterior motives, drives me absolutely nuts. Teachers want students to be empathetic. Teachers want students to be able to take the perspective of other people. Teachers want their students to be successful academically, socially, and emotionally.

It is really fascinating how short the attention span of adults is in modern times. When COVID-19 happened, so many families didn't realize what it is like to spend 24 hrs a day with their child(ren), let alone a room of 20-30 kids for a whole day. Then, one day, everyone seemed to completely forget how hard the job of teachers is, how underpaid and overworked they are. We don't have librarians anymore... THEY'RE PORNOGRAPHERS TRYING TO MAKE MY JOEY A TRANSGENDER !!!

Just like how we all watched January 6th happen in real-time and knew exactly what happened.... but now ... J 6 was just a trip to the capitol.

Give me a fucking break.

I don't know much about geopolitics, economics, and a million other things. I do know public education. Here is the thing: the better our educational system is...EVERYONE BENEFITS. So many students have different life experiences that they really do need a safe space at school and abundant funding. I don't even ask some students I work with how their weekend or holiday break was because I know they're in foster care or identified as homeless. Rather, I welcome tell them that I am happy to see them. One school I worked at in a low socio-economic area had something called "backpack buddies" so that the poorest of students would get a bag full of food on Fridays and before major breaks because they rely so much on schools for food. Educators and related service providers often keep their rooms/offices supplied with snacks because you can't teach when basic needs are not met.

A documentary about kids living in motels in Anaheim some years back was so damn sad. These kids lived really close to Disneyland, but their lives were nothing further from "the happiest place on earth." I recall the kids being asked to identify when they eat certain meals (e.g., in the morning you eat breakfast, in the afternoon you eat lunch, in the evening you eat dinner) and the kids didn't even have the language for those concepts.

People have no idea how fucked over children are, who are born in to a system where the "Christians" on the right give two fucks about them and the people who dedicate their lives to helping them are made out to be monsters.

I dislike many things about the Democratic party, but I will never forgive or forget the GOP for the things I have seen in my adult years.
Never forget:
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TheLurper

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Re: Changes under Trump 2.0
« Reply #454 on: February 04, 2025, 06:49:16 PM »
I think this might have been posted already

Trump floats idea to have American soldiers displace Palestinians to redevelop it into the Jersey Shore. Trump supporters who made fear-mongering emotional claims about Egypt, Jordan, and Palestinians refuse acknowledge that they were wrong about why Egypt and Jordan weren't accepting all the refugees at the height of Israel's war.
https://www.nytimes.com/2025/02/01/world/middleeast/arab-nations-reject-trump-evacuate-gaza.html



Quote from: ChuckRamone
I love when people bring up world hunger. It makes everything meaningless.
"That guy is double parked."
"Who cares? There are people starving to death! Besides, how does that affect you? Does it lessen the joy of parking?

Plan9Customs

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Re: Changes under Trump 2.0
« Reply #455 on: February 04, 2025, 07:13:40 PM »
Expand Quote
As a parent, I don’t see the removal of the department of education as a big deal. If anything I see it as a bonus of less indoctrination on my kid...
[close]

You seem well-intentioned. Can you describe the indoctrination you're talking about? Do you have examples of your kids being indoctrinated?

Also, do you see any irony in using DOE data in the ability to make your arguments?

No. He’s avoiding this completely and posting anything but. He did post the definition though, just not what they are being ‘indoctrinated’ with. Btw, my son grew up in Yubatuckey (Yuba City) and even in that shithole of inbred dipshits there was a STEM program as well as other after school programs for gifted kids. Hell, my kid was taking high school classes in jr high and college classes in high school(these were through the public school programs), so maybe you need to get more involved in actual finding a good school, pulling your child out of public options and sending them to a charter or private or help them with their studies on your time or hire a tutor. If it’s possible for these to exist in public schools in a very uneducated close minded town, there’s options maybe you haven’t looked hard enough for.
Still looking forward to hearing what your child is being indoctrinated with at school though.

TastyBurrito

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Re: Changes under Trump 2.0
« Reply #456 on: February 04, 2025, 07:21:44 PM »
Expand Quote
sad

headline: Trump proposes permanent displacement of Gazans with Netanyahu at White House

https://www.reuters.com/world/trump-netanyahu-set-pivotal-talks-middle-east-agenda-2025-02-04/
[close]

Thanks for sharing this. ✌️


I remember when people protested Kamala by not voting because she didn't condemn the Gaza attacks soon enough.

I also remember Trump saying he'd help Israel finish the job the entire time people were pining about Kamala.

Now we're here and he's fulfilling his promise and people who protest voted all have Shocked Pikachu face.


pugmaster

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Re: Changes under Trump 2.0
« Reply #457 on: February 04, 2025, 07:37:27 PM »
Never forget:
Rusty_Berrings, 360 frip, Yapple Dapple, Bubblegum Tate, Marc Johnson

alien porkchop

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Re: Changes under Trump 2.0
« Reply #458 on: February 04, 2025, 07:38:42 PM »
I think this might have been posted already

Trump floats idea to have American soldiers displace Palestinians to redevelop it into the Jersey Shore. Trump supporters who made fear-mongering emotional claims about Egypt, Jordan, and Palestinians refuse acknowledge that they were wrong about why Egypt and Jordan weren't accepting all the refugees at the height of Israel's war.
https://www.nytimes.com/2025/02/01/world/middleeast/arab-nations-reject-trump-evacuate-gaza.html

one poster mentioned it previous. the statements he made are officially the wildest shit i have heard him say so far. this is me being alarmed.
Sometimes you eat the dogshit. Sometimes the dogshit eats you.

WashingtonNECKTIE

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Re: Changes under Trump 2.0
« Reply #459 on: February 04, 2025, 07:43:40 PM »
Wow sorry, didn't realise I was dealing with a sick cunt here

Too Frank To Fred

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Re: Changes under Trump 2.0
« Reply #460 on: February 04, 2025, 09:46:40 PM »
Well, its about 90% certain I have to shut down a federally funded Transitional Living Program for homeless youth largely due to panic and uncertainty in the Federal government. I really thought the City, County and State would come through for us but no one wants to give up more money in this climate. Our federal funding ends in Sept but I think we are going to try to plan a meaningful closure way before then.

In theory the Feds would normally release a RFP in March and then we'd submit a grant in April but we know it's not going to happen. This program has been running since 1986 and housed thousands of young people... I took it over in 2016... Anyway, sorry for the ramble... a lot to process...

The real veganshawn

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Re: Changes under Trump 2.0
« Reply #461 on: February 04, 2025, 09:54:19 PM »
Well, its about 90% certain I have to shut down a federally funded Transitional Living Program for homeless youth largely due to panic and uncertainty in the Federal government. I really thought the City, County and State would come through for us but no one wants to give up more money in this climate. Our federal funding ends in Sept but I think we are going to try to plan a meaningful closure way before then.

In theory the Feds would normally release a RFP in March and then we'd submit a grant in April but we know it's not going to happen. This program has been running since 1986 and housed thousands of young people... I took it over in 2016... Anyway, sorry for the ramble... a lot to process...

So sorry this is happening 😢
Cocteau Twins

Too Frank To Fred

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Re: Changes under Trump 2.0
« Reply #462 on: February 04, 2025, 09:57:18 PM »
Thanks Shawn. We will do our damndest to make sure the current residents and staff land on their feet before we actually close.

TastyBurrito

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Re: Changes under Trump 2.0
« Reply #463 on: February 04, 2025, 10:45:47 PM »
Thanks Shawn. We will do our damndest to make sure the current residents and staff land on their feet before we actually close.

Fuck. Sorry to hear this is happening to your program.

Hopefully things work out well for your residents and staff.

TheLurper

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Re: Changes under Trump 2.0
« Reply #464 on: February 04, 2025, 10:47:36 PM »
@Too Frank To Fred
That sucks. It is sad, while completely mislead, I do think some (easily fooled) people voted Trump because they wanted money to be spent on domestic spending helping Americans. Amazing how fast that fades and we are back to bootstrapping it.


Let's see if any of these stick:

Colombia Cancels Joint US/Colombia Oil Venture
https://financialpost.com/pmn/colombias-president-orders-national-oil-company-to-cancel-us-venture-over-environmental-concerns

Saudia Arabia will refuse to establish ties with Israel over Trump's threat to steal Palestinian land. Damn, even after we let them kill a Washington Post journalist with impunity and they funneled money into Trump's pockets
https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/saudi-arabia-says-it-wont-establish-ties-with-israel-without-creation-2025-02-05/

Canada might step on the gas negotiating trade agreements with the rest of the world. A deal with Ecuador was signed today, but obviously this already in the works. Hopefully, Canada puts its foot on the pedal and gets moving.
https://globalnews.ca/news/11002590/canada-ecuador-trade-deal-free-trade-trump-tariffs/

US AID potentially fucked. Musk's 15 year old little demons attempted to gain access classified information at US AID. Rubio, Musk, and Trump... but mainly Musk, respond by attempting to shut the entire agency. 10K employees told to return to the US to no job. Shutting it needs to be done through congress, but this administration has little care for the law and Republicans don't give a shit about the law or Constitution.
https://www.nytimes.com/2025/02/04/us/usaid-musk-trump-rubio-cuts.html
« Last Edit: February 05, 2025, 11:20:13 PM by TheLurper »

Quote from: ChuckRamone
I love when people bring up world hunger. It makes everything meaningless.
"That guy is double parked."
"Who cares? There are people starving to death! Besides, how does that affect you? Does it lessen the joy of parking?

Control

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Re: Changes under Trump 2.0
« Reply #465 on: February 05, 2025, 12:40:42 PM »
Children need to have respect & discipline in their life in order to successfully learn, this happens at home and at school. Some (most?) parents don't really care or think about this aspect and leave it in the hands of the government (not ideal). Growing up in the 80's and 90's I got the impression that most of my skate friends had parents like this... and they didn't turn out too well... some went to prison and some are dead (i'm sure everyone has similar unfortunate experiences).

You played loose with your use of the word indoctrination—either intentionally or just ignorantly. There's a reason dictionaries use chronologic definition, you know?

We'll say you're a fan of semantics. So this other thing you said above: what are the "hands of government" in schools that are interfering with indoctrinating respect and discipline into kids? (Damn, look what I did.) And are they federal or state hands?

And the correlation you're making — kids attending school leads to a life of imprisonment or premature death — are you worried kids will become convicts because of public school teachers, state-designed testing standards, or academic reporting?

Pretty large brush you're painting with.

Burt Ward

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Re: Changes under Trump 2.0
« Reply #466 on: February 05, 2025, 02:34:18 PM »
In the context of the insane times we're living in, saying children are being "indoctrinated" at school sounds awfully like "my children are being taught that LGBTQI+ people exist by pinko, groomer teachers, and I'm not down with my kids being taught that the least you can do is accept others for who they are". We all know this, so why say it?
Now, we used to say we put on our tights to put on the world. So I don't think it tarnishes the image at all.

m477

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Re: Changes under Trump 2.0
« Reply #467 on: February 05, 2025, 03:15:31 PM »
Quote from: Plan9Customs
No. He’s avoiding this completely and posting anything but. He did post the definition though, just not what they are being ‘indoctrinated’ with. Btw, my son grew up in Yubatuckey (Yuba City) and even in that shithole of inbred dipshits there was a STEM program as well as other after school programs for gifted kids. Hell, my kid was taking high school classes in jr high and college classes in high school(these were through the public school programs), so maybe you need to get more involved in actual finding a good school, pulling your child out of public options and sending them to a charter or private or help them with their studies on your time or hire a tutor. If it’s possible for these to exist in public schools in a very uneducated close minded town, there’s options maybe you haven’t looked hard enough for.
Still looking forward to hearing what your child is being indoctrinated with at school though.

Yep, I definitely was avoiding further engagement. I already answered it (see below bolded quote) and after pugs crash out post, I didn't really see the point in further discussion. I've been pretty transparent... either you get what I'm saying or you don't. And since you don't think I have well intentions, why do you even bother asking? But, since you asked a second time for specifics examples of my kid being indoctrinated by teachers, I'll humor you: That aint happining, the only ones indoctrinating him are mom and dad.

Expand Quote
I'll be god-damned if the American public school system is going to indoctrinate my kids about subjects that have no place being discussed in the classroom, like U.S. slavery, Japanese-American internment camps and Native American genocide.
[close]

Whooooa there... easy big fella. I mean indoctrinated into low standards, each kid just another $15k brick in the wall just to meet the lowest expectations.

With all the federal red tape it seems like the doe has been a failed project. I would like to see teachers have more freedom (obviously with discretion from the local PTA).

There's been quite a few times at parent teacher conferences where teachers are consistently saying things like "we're only doing this to satisfy regulations" (especially in regards to common core math). Aiming everyone to be just at the bare minimum. I mean the report cards in elementary didn't even allow the teachers to grade at "above average" when a student was absolutely crushing it in a subject. They grade like this so that the next semester of reporting they can up it a notch in order to show "improvement over time' to pad the districts reporting metrics. Why not acknowledge these things when they happen and move the kids killing it to the next threshold. It seems like no child left behind has had the consequences of everyone trailing behind. These are the types of things I don't like and prevent me from having the doom and gloom perspective that some may have. And I can't relate to Mr. Lawndale's post in the slightest (although it did give me a chuckle).

EdLawndale

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Re: Changes under Trump 2.0
« Reply #468 on: February 05, 2025, 04:06:28 PM »
Maybe you mean "inducted"? Either way, please stop.
"Was just about to say, wtf is up with this EdLawndale guy?"


m477

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Re: Changes under Trump 2.0
« Reply #469 on: February 05, 2025, 05:01:48 PM »
Maybe you mean "inducted"? Either way, please stop.
Don’t worry bud, I wouldn’t think so hard about it. I know this place is sensitive and saw myself out of the thread yesterday but didn’t want to be rude and leave plan9 hanging. No need to walk me out, I know where the door is.

fakie nollie

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Re: Changes under Trump 2.0
« Reply #470 on: February 05, 2025, 09:04:17 PM »
Don’t let the door hit your bussy

Atiba Applebum

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Re: Changes under Trump 2.0
« Reply #471 on: February 06, 2025, 12:09:29 AM »
Good words re: Texas’s looming school vouchers


http://www.instagram.com/reel/DFtqfbhva7D/?igsh=NTc4MTIwNjQ2YQ==


TastyBurrito

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Re: Changes under Trump 2.0
« Reply #472 on: February 06, 2025, 09:21:41 AM »
Good words re: Texas’s looming school vouchers


http://www.instagram.com/reel/DFtqfbhva7D/?igsh=NTc4MTIwNjQ2YQ==

This is a well thought out and articulate argument for being against vouchers. Too bad the voting base for Texas is as dumb as rocks and will just blindly believe Abbott. They can easily learn from Arizona's failures with vouchers and how low-income areas aren't using them and/or don't have options in their area to use them. Also adding that private schools coincidentally also raised tuition prices when the vouchers began.

But yea, we'll just see poor, public schools become poorer.

God, I hate this timeline where Biff has hold of the Sports Almanac. 

Jehoshaphat Augustus

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Re: Changes under Trump 2.0
« Reply #473 on: February 06, 2025, 10:21:15 AM »
Don’t let the door hit your bussy
its actually an elite technique when i'm alone and wanna get hungry on it 

TastyBurrito

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Re: Changes under Trump 2.0
« Reply #474 on: February 06, 2025, 11:17:21 AM »
Trump is directing the DOJ to investigate "pro-choice" protesters under the guise of the FACE Act because it's "anti-Christian" terrorism.

Google "Iran before Muslim Revolution" and that's where we're at. Then Google "Iran after Muslim Revolution" and that's where we'll be heading.


h00man

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Re: Changes under Trump 2.0
« Reply #475 on: February 06, 2025, 12:43:13 PM »
It's almost as if we were all warned about Project 2025 and the underlining intent behind it to make America a Christian nation....

but no, lowering the cost of eggs and gas are more important.
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Re: Changes under Trump 2.0
« Reply #476 on: February 06, 2025, 12:46:57 PM »
The moral panic created by the Republican Party is just flat out wild. Ask someone what the direct problem is; there is NO PROBLEM. They were told it’s a problem by the uneducated, paranoid, ignorant stakeholders who unfortunately have influence & power. I’ve been reading a lot about this as it’s part of my education & discipline & while I’m happy to know that I’m not insane as I feel gaslit by these clowns, it’s just astonishing to see it happening textbook style in front of me.



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Re: Changes under Trump 2.0
« Reply #477 on: February 06, 2025, 01:12:14 PM »
It's almost as if we were all warned about Project 2025 and the underlining intent behind it to make America a Christian nation....

but no, lowering the cost of eggs and gas are more important.

I'd have a tiny, tiny modicum of respect for the "cost of eggs" people if they'd been shown any kind of tangible, objective plan on how the cost of eggs were going to be reduced, maybe a timeline, any kind of coherent, reality based explanation, even if it was a shitty, unethical way to reduce costs, but no, all they needed to hear was "planes crash because of brown people and lesbians and also eggs will be cheaper".

(the word "eggs" is interchangeable with many other goods and materials here)
« Last Edit: February 06, 2025, 01:23:51 PM by GnarAlarm »

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Re: Changes under Trump 2.0
« Reply #478 on: February 06, 2025, 04:08:04 PM »
Eggs are expensive again due to a highly contagious strain of bird flu that has reduced the number of chickens available for egg production. The outbreak began in early 2022 and has affected millions of birds in the United States.

Because science. Something the average Trump voter does not acknowledge.

sexualhelon

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Re: Changes under Trump 2.0
« Reply #479 on: February 06, 2025, 06:03:25 PM »
The moral panic created by the Republican Party is just flat out wild. Ask someone what the direct problem is; there is NO PROBLEM. They were told it’s a problem by the uneducated, paranoid, ignorant stakeholders who unfortunately have influence & power. I’ve been reading a lot about this as it’s part of my education & discipline & while I’m happy to know that I’m not insane as I feel gaslit by these clowns, it’s just astonishing to see it happening textbook style in front of me.

This is what gets me, to be honest. It's not the Republican party or the Democratic party - it's both. You're always forced to vote for someone from one of two sides. They want you to blame the other party but in reality they're one in the same. You don't think Mom and Dad are on the same team? They're just playing good cop/bad cop with you. Maybe they were two different people at some point but now they're married.