Oakland riots

[ChildoftheGhetto]

Fuck the police they killed Sean Bell.

[CeeyMar]

Fuck the police they killed Sean Bell.

Didn't they get away with that as well?

[RightCoastBiased]

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Fuck the police they killed Sean Bell.

[close]

Didn't they get away with that as well?

Yup, they were all acquitted.

[gravel pitch]

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We can sit around and ponder what might have happened. But I don't understand why anyone is trying to make excuses for this cop? He murdered an innocent man, and it should be treated as such. If this gets dropped to a manslaughter I pray that cop doesn't survive jail.

[close]

Because the crime of murder is based on intent. If he intended to kill him, then it's murder. If it was an accident, then it's manslaughter. And don't think manslaughter is a slap on the wrist, that crime carries serious prison time. Some people have gone to jail longer for manslaughter then for murder.

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Police have been getting away with murder for years now.
He should be put in jail for 1st degree murder... regardless of if it was an accident or not, he shouldn't have his gun out and there is a huge difference between a gun and a taser. He took someones life.

[close]

1st degree murder? You're a person, in this situation it'd be impossible for him to be charged with 1st degree murder. Go watch a law and order or something asshole and learn the law.

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We can sit around and ponder what might have happened. But I don't understand why anyone is trying to make excuses for this cop? He murdered an innocent man, and it should be treated as such. If this gets dropped to a manslaughter I pray that cop doesn't survive jail.

[close]

Maybe cause it's more plausable that this was an accident caused by some asshole's stupid mistake, rather then an execution infront of dozens of witnesses.

[close]

Holy fuck your a clown. Yet another post where you don't have a damn clue what you are talking about. 
http://criminal.findlaw.com/crimes/a-z/murder_first_degree.html

Maybe YOU need to learn what something is you piece of shit.

This was obviously pre-meditated.
Only someone like you would believe the cops story.

Damn I hate dealing with stupid people, but you're on a new level. Did you even read that link you posted? Can you even read?

In most states, first-degree murder is defined as an unlawful killing that is both willful and premeditated, meaning that it was committed after planning or "lying in wait" for the victim.

So in order for this to be 1st degree murder, this cop would have had to had known that not only would the victim be on the train, but was going to get into a fight, and thus present an oppurtunity for him to kill the victim. That's premeditation, and that's what defines 1st degree murder you fuckin imbecile.

If it was in fact murder, then it's 2nd degree, not 1st. How the fuck you can't understand this simple concept is beyond explanation to me. However it wasn't murder, it was an accident. He'll be charged with some form of manslaughter and possibly criminal negligance, do hard time, and have his life ruined. So really you should all calm down because there's no way he's going to walk away from this unscathed.

[CeeyMar]

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Fuck the police they killed Sean Bell.

[close]

Didn't they get away with that as well?

[close]

Yup, they were all acquitted.

That's bullshit 

[Ronald Wilson Reagan]

Hey gravel pitch, did you intentionally ignore my explaination of how it absolutely is possible for it to be first degree murder out of ignorance, or would you prefer not to address the obvious fact that it could be based on what I am saying? He didn't have to know anything about Oscar Grant  for it to be premeditated. If a guy goes out to a public square armed to the teeth and starts massacring people, its 1st degree- even f he had no idea who his victims were. He planned on going to that square and kill whoever was there, so its premeditated. Its very possible this cop wante to work in the ghetto so he could wear a badge and kill whoever he wanted? You don't know shit about this situation, but you defend the murderer. And why are you defending a cop who is obviously either corrupt or incompetent, and either way unfit for the job? Why do you defend a man in a situation you obviously know nothing about, Don't call other people on here stupid, because its willfull ignorance on the behalf of people like you that lets peop;e get away with doing evil. You care more about the cop than the people of Oakland. Sorry, but I am one of the people of Oakland, and the police need to be fixed here.

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Are the Bart stops so bad they need armed employees?

[close]

Some of them. I used to live in West Oakland and there was always crazy shit going on. Also most large transit systems have their own police force. Which I am not saying in an attempt to justify their necessity, but rather point out that BART is not an exception.

Where in West Oakland? I just moved to the lower bottoms and am right near the west Oakland stop.
And Bart employees don't have guns, bart cops do.
The biggest call aside from the guilty officer getting arrested is to reform or disband BART police, who virtually answer to nobody. As vegan and others have pointed out, this isn't the first time they have acted in this way.

[RightCoastBiased]

So really you should all calm down because there's no way he's going to walk away from this unscathed.

There were a lot of good points in your post, but I don't think the above quoted statement should be said with such certainty.

Here is one example: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sean_Bell

Cops fired 50 fucking shots, and killed this guy for no reason. Granted the Oscar incident has been caught on video multiple times, I still think there is a good chance this guy walks.

I honestly wish I could agree with your statement, but seeing what cops get away with I would not be surprised. But maybe the fear of LA riots 2.0 will make the judge impose a sentence.

[RightCoastBiased]

Hey gravel pitch, did you intentionally ignore my explaination of how it absolutely is possible for it to be first degree murder out of ignorance, or would you prefer not to address the obvious fact that it could be based on what I am saying? He didn't have to know anything about Oscar Grant  for it to be premeditated. If a guy goes out to a public square armed to the teeth and starts massacring people, its 1st degree- even f he had no idea who his victims were. He planned on going to that square and kill whoever was there, so its premeditated. Its very possible this cop wante to work in the ghetto so he could wear a badge and kill whoever he wanted? You don't know shit about this situation, but you defend the murderer. And why are you defending a cop who is obviously either corrupt or incompetent, and either way unfit for the job? Why do you defend a man in a situation you obviously know nothing about, Don't call other people on here stupid, because its willfull ignorance on the behalf of people like you that lets peop;e get away with doing evil. You care more about the cop than the people of Oakland. Sorry, but I am one of the people of Oakland, and the police need to be fixed here.

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Are the Bart stops so bad they need armed employees?

[close]

Some of them. I used to live in West Oakland and there was always crazy shit going on. Also most large transit systems have their own police force. Which I am not saying in an attempt to justify their necessity, but rather point out that BART is not an exception.

[close]

Where in West Oakland? I just moved to the lower bottoms and am right near the west Oakland stop.
And Bart employees don't have guns, bart cops do.
The biggest call aside from the guilty officer getting arrested is to reform or disband BART police, who virtually answer to nobody. As vegan and others have pointed out, this isn't the first time they have acted in this way.

I lived on 8th between Campbell and willow.  Lower bots as well. My house got robbed twice (within a month) and last February it burnt down under sketchy circumstances. Where in Woakland do you live?

[Ronald Wilson Reagan]

Near 9th and pine- we would have been neighbors! Lower  bottoms are definitely sketchy, though I'm hearing its a lot better than it used to be. Am I  confused though? Isn't 8th between willow and campbell the campbell village projects? Or did you live across the street from them? You were right up in it either way. I'm kind of tucked away, but still wouldn't live here if it weren't for the fact that two loud dogs live here too.

[jrock]

my old rehearsal studio was in west Oakland and it was a pretty sketchy neighborhood. As a matter of fact, a young woman was kidnapped from the west Oakland bart station, gang raped, and left for dead on the street.  So I could see the need for police on the Bart. You also have to take into account  that any mass transit system post 9 11 is going to be monitored by police.  I don't think they should be arresting people for arguing, and they certainly shouldn't be shooting people like that, but they are needed.

[vegan*shawn]

They need some sort of security on BART, the problem is that the police do not have public oversight and so they only answer to other cops, which means they get a way with stuff like this.

[Battle]

Hey gravel pitch, did you intentionally ignore my explaination of how it absolutely is possible for it to be first degree murder out of ignorance, or would you prefer not to address the obvious fact that it could be based on what I am saying? He didn't have to know anything about Oscar Grant  for it to be premeditated. If a guy goes out to a public square armed to the teeth and starts massacring people, its 1st degree- even f he had no idea who his victims were. He planned on going to that square and kill whoever was there, so its premeditated. Its very possible this cop wante to work in the ghetto so he could wear a badge and kill whoever he wanted? You don't know shit about this situation, but you defend the murderer. And why are you defending a cop who is obviously either corrupt or incompetent, and either way unfit for the job? Why do you defend a man in a situation you obviously know nothing about, Don't call other people on here stupid, because its willfull ignorance on the behalf of people like you that lets peop;e get away with doing evil. You care more about the cop than the people of Oakland. Sorry, but I am one of the people of Oakland, and the police need to be fixed here.

so your saying he became a cop so he could kill random people without the fear of retribution? and on this specific night he went out thinking he was going to shoot someone? even if this were the case(which is unlikely) it would be hard to prove unless he told someone his intentions beforehand.

[gravel pitch]

Hey gravel pitch, did you intentionally ignore my explaination of how it absolutely is possible for it to be first degree murder out of ignorance, or would you prefer not to address the obvious fact that it could be based on what I am saying? He didn't have to know anything about Oscar Grant  for it to be premeditated. If a guy goes out to a public square armed to the teeth and starts massacring people, its 1st degree- even f he had no idea who his victims were. He planned on going to that square and kill whoever was there, so its premeditated. Its very possible this cop wante to work in the ghetto so he could wear a badge and kill whoever he wanted? You don't know shit about this situation, but you defend the murderer. And why are you defending a cop who is obviously either corrupt or incompetent, and either way unfit for the job? Why do you defend a man in a situation you obviously know nothing about, Don't call other people on here stupid, because its willfull ignorance on the behalf of people like you that lets peop;e get away with doing evil. You care more about the cop than the people of Oakland. Sorry, but I am one of the people of Oakland, and the police need to be fixed here.

You're a joke dude. Do you buy into other conspiracy theories too? Like that the goverment is putting fluoride in the water to control your mind? I guess I'm ignorant because it's easier for me to believe the guy made a stupid mistake, rather then a man with a secret murderous agenda, signed up to be a police officer just so he could execute minorities in broad daylight and get away with it, and it just so happens on this night his victim of choice was Oscar Grant.

Get a grip. Aren't you a teacher or something? I hope you don't spout this bullshit to impressionable kids at school. Also, I'm not defending him. I've already said he should be charged with manslaughter - which again, is a serious crime - but what I am defending is this little thing called the eighth amendment. This looks like an accident, not a murder. Therefore he should not be charged with murder. And besides, even if he was charged with murder, he'd never be convicted, because there's another little something called reasonable doubt. No DA would ever be able to prove this was an execution beyond reasonble doubt. If he was charged with murder like you wanted, then he'd really walk free.

[sweets]

Shouldn't the people in our society (who aren't elected, BTW) who are supposed to keep law and order be held to a higher standard? Why the fuck was he even trying to taze him? It looks to me like the guy was subdued and begging for mercy. Stop defending the motherfucker. You don't make mistakes like this when you can take someone's life. Not only the victim's life but his daughter is now another child growing up without a father. It clearly looks like a case of police brutality gone too far. Another one. The people defending this cop should feel responsible for perpetuating the actions of rogue cops and the good old boys club that protects them.

/rant.

[RightCoastBiased]

Near 9th and pine- we would have been neighbors! Lower  bottoms are definitely sketchy, though I'm hearing its a lot better than it used to be. Am I  confused though? Isn't 8th between willow and campbell the campbell village projects? Or did you live across the street from them? You were right up in it either way. I'm kind of tucked away, but still wouldn't live here if it weren't for the fact that two loud dogs live here too.

I lived across the street above what is now Popos pizza and La Esperanza Market. Our landlord was suspect, and right before out house burnt down he was having troubles opening his restaurant (actually since we moved in 11 months earlier he had been having problems). Then after the fire he got shit loads of insurance money and in a month his restaurant was open and we never recieved out 3k in deposits back.

And 9th and pine, i think there is some punk rocker kids house I went to a party at closer to you, think it was on 12th and willow. I'd always see random white people in the neighborhood. And that would then result in screaming from our upstairs apartment window (think safe) "WHITE PEOPLE!". Always a fun thing to do. Our house there used to be bad ass, me and my 3 best friends and a huge house in the ghetto where no one cared what we did. Playing guitar, drums, bass at 3 am. Shit was awesome for the first 6 months there.

[Ronald Wilson Reagan]

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Hey gravel pitch, did you intentionally ignore my explaination of how it absolutely is possible for it to be first degree murder out of ignorance, or would you prefer not to address the obvious fact that it could be based on what I am saying? He didn't have to know anything about Oscar Grant  for it to be premeditated. If a guy goes out to a public square armed to the teeth and starts massacring people, its 1st degree- even f he had no idea who his victims were. He planned on going to that square and kill whoever was there, so its premeditated. Its very possible this cop wante to work in the ghetto so he could wear a badge and kill whoever he wanted? You don't know shit about this situation, but you defend the murderer. And why are you defending a cop who is obviously either corrupt or incompetent, and either way unfit for the job? Why do you defend a man in a situation you obviously know nothing about, Don't call other people on here stupid, because its willfull ignorance on the behalf of people like you that lets peop;e get away with doing evil. You care more about the cop than the people of Oakland. Sorry, but I am one of the people of Oakland, and the police need to be fixed here.

[close]

so your saying he became a cop so he could kill random people without the fear of retribution? and on this specific night he went out thinking he was going to shoot someone? even if this were the case(which is unlikely) it would be hard to prove unless he told someone his intentions beforehand.

Your missed my point entirely.
My point is, you came out all matter-of-factly talking about how there is no way he could be charged with first degree murder, and then actually referenced a TV show (Law and Order) as the place where you get your knowledge of the court system. My point is, there are a thousand different reasons this could have been first degree murder, and to say in such certain terms that it can not be first degree murder is untrue for countless reasons.
I don't see any purpose to come up with all sorts of reasons that a murderer who killed an innocent man shouldn't be arrested and tried.
Oh, and before you come up with "just manslaughter," 99% of the time a person is killed violently they arrest you for 1st degree murder, and in the trial decide your intent.
THIS COP NEEDS TO BE ARRESTED AND TRIED
In all reality, the police would look a lot better if the guy did get arrested. It would tell everybody that this is not the standard, and this is not acceptable. By not arresting him they virtually say that they don't care- and that is the problem.
If he is innocent as you say, it will come up at the trial. If not, then justice will be served. Either way, there is absolutely nothing to lose by trying him, and a lot to lose if they don't.
Oh, and that was a cute comment about "teaching kids this stuff," its become the standard generic insult to me whenever things get political. Usually I let it go, but this time it is particularly weak. Did you miss the part where I told you that the shooting occured in the community that I teach in? What do I have to teach these kids about police brutality when shit like this happens in their own neighborhood? They are far more frightened and angry than me. Look at the coverage of the riots, its high school kids doing it. Trust me, they teach me far more about what happens in their neighborhood than I could ever teach them.

And to say that believing that there is police overuse of force is equivalent to flouride water conspiracy theories is quite a stretch. You really think that all police are knights in shining armor and that they never abuse power? Police corruption has been something that has existed since police have, and them using excessive force is so common they have a special department called "internal affairs" that is supposed to keep them in line. Since
Please note, that while you only argued about me, calling me stupid and ignorant and paranoid and all that, while basically ignoring every point I had, I stuck to facts, and attacked your arguments, not your mindset.



Rightcoast- was it possible it was at a yellow house at 11th and willow? If so those guys are friends of mine! A couple of them skate. I actually live with one of them, they got evicted from the spot a month ago. They were fucking crazy in that house though, a lot of hallucinogens and art and music and shit.  Super fun place to hang out.

And yeah, living in the Ghetto has its positives as well as negatives. On one side, very few people care what you do, on the other side, very few people care what happens to you.  Its insane, but awesome too.
I drove down 8th past willow and campbell today, and there are just all sorts of people lurking there by the market, and you did live across from Campbell Village. I think your old house is an open lot or some boarded up abandoned building now.

And with the "disband the bart police" argument, nobody is arguing that police shouldn't be on Bart or in stations, as many people have brought up, some aren't the safest places to be. What people are saying is that local law enforcement that is accountable to the people should be there instead.
Others say to keep bart police, but to reform it so that there is more accountability.

[RightCoastBiased]

Gripper-My house was above the pizza place there. Its the house with the car painted on the fence. And next to that is an abandoned lot that a church uses for parking. And if you are heading to SF or back to the east bay you can see the advert for Popo's pizza on the back of the building. I am very glad to be out of west oakland after the experience I had there. South Berkeley is a fucking palace compared to west oakland.

[gravel pitch]

Gipper, you quoted the wrong person 

[Ronald Wilson Reagan]

My mistake.
Still, I addressed both of you.
Thats just a technical thing anyway. You just got nothing else to say huh?

[Wizard Fuck]

Gravel Pitch is fucking terrible.
You don't have to know someone for it to be premeditated... You can say, hey lets arrest this guy then I'm going to kill him.
Wait, that's way to simple for your dumb ass.

I still love how you buy the whole "accident" thing. Do you ever look into anything you pour out?
Like, I don't know.... WHY WAS THE FUCKING SAFETY OFF OF HIS PISTOL AND WHY WAS IT LOADED. WHICH GUESS WHAT??? THAT MEANS THAT HE WAS FUCKING THINKING ABOUT KILLING HIM. WHICH IS FUCKING PREMEDITATED.  OH YEAH, THAT MAKES WAY TOO MUCH SENSE BECAUSE YOUR FUCKING regular.

People like you shouldn't be allowed access to the internet.

[danker peaches]

I have a feeling that the people of the us are going to start trusting the people in power less and less.

[Battle]

I still love how you buy the whole "accident" thing. Do you ever look into anything you pour out?
Like, I don't know.... WHY WAS THE FUCKING SAFETY OFF OF HIS PISTOL AND WHY WAS IT LOADED. WHICH GUESS WHAT??? THAT MEANS THAT HE WAS FUCKING THINKING ABOUT KILLING HIM. WHICH IS FUCKING PREMEDITATED.  OH YEAH, THAT MAKES WAY TOO MUCH SENSE BECAUSE YOUR FUCKING regular.

I'm pretty sure all cops keep their guns loaded. that doesn't mean they are just waiting to shoot someone, it means that they don't have time to load a gun in an emergency situation.  
and Gipper, I agree with you that he needs to be arrested and tried but to throw around the term first degree murder implies that this was premeditated and I don't believe that's that case.
also about the protests: those people are idiot's. protests have never solved shit. has he been arrested in response to the protests? no. they are pointless and these people hurt their own communities more than they are helping.

[crunk juice]

Gravel Pitch, please never talk about criminal law or the Constitution again.  Every post you’ve ever made has annoyed me.  Look inside your ignorant little soul and wonder why after watching someone ruthlessly execute another human being you immediately and dutifully jumped to the pig’s defense.  You are a slave.  Imagine if it’d been a group of adult black males who grabbed a young white cop, pinned him to the ground, and executed him.  You think there’d be calls for restraint? Paid administrative leave? Investigations?  Patience? Calm? Intentions?  Mens rea discussions?  Fuck no.  Every racist kook in this country would be screaming for the electric chair/lynchings (that would include all of the corporate media and yourself).  Followed quickly by endless tear-jerking media stories with the dead cops family/friends about what a hero he was/how much he loved puppies, and probably topped off with some new draconian legislation increasing the punitive consequences for violence against cops.  Instead we get non-stop 'analysis' of what the cop was thinking, and reports about what a bad guy Oscar Grant was (as if that makes it okay to murder him).

You or I shoot someone = immediate arrest.
Cop shoots someone = paid administrative leave until it blows over.  I doubt they teach that on Law and Order though.

As others have explained, the Taser/accidental discharge excuse is total bullshit.  The cop’s gun weighs 3 times as much as a Taser, is a completely different shape, and is located on the opposite side of the belt.  Also, some of the videos show that the cop had already pulled the Taser out earlier, re-holstered it, and then reached for his gun.

Of course the corporate media (and those that do their bidding) immediately try to marginalize the rioters and protestors like they do whenever there is any kind of protest.  The truth is that the rioters behavior is entirely rational in light of the racist, violent, unpunished history of 'law enforcement' accompanied by media ambivalence.  The reasoning = something has to be done to draw attention to repeated and widespread police lawlessness and violence with no consequences, and this is all we can do.  Nothing would be more irrational than a blind faith that the police/da will do the right thing, given all the historical evidence to the contrary (feel free to google Sean Bell, Gary King, Jarrold Hall, Amadou Diallo, etc., if you don't believe me).  The district attorney responsible for bringing charges against the police works closely with these same police on a daily basis in a shared purpose of delivering convictions.  Have you ever met a district attorney?  I have.  Let’s just say that it takes a distinct personality/world view to seek out a job in which you gleefully imprison poor people often for non-violent offenses.  Maybe this is why it is extremely rare for there to even be any disciplinary action when police murder people.

Finally, your idiotic ramblings about ‘reasonable doubt’, etc., are just another example of you shooting your mouth off about something you know absolutely nothing about.  Anyone who has had any experience with jury trials knows that burden of proof standards are largely meaningless to most juries.  The jury members simply decide which side they believe more, go that way, and report that they have ‘no doubts’ about the defendant’s guilt/innocence.

I’d also like to add, that shit like this happens all the time in Iraq, Gaza, etc.  The difference is that several videos managed to break through the insanely sanitized and censored corporate media and make it into the public domain.  Real, uncensored images of the insane carnage in Gaza, Iraq, etc., are streamed 24/7 on Al Jazeera and other stations.  Something to think about next time someone poor is killed by those with power and there isn’t a busload of people filming it.

ps - flouride’s bullshit too faggot.

[google image search]

Glocks don't have safeties, they have a 2 trigger system that won't allow the gun to fire unless the first smaller trigger is depressed.  Sort of a safety, but not really

[RightCoastBiased]

I have a feeling that the people of the us are going to start trusting the people in power less and less.

And it only took 5,000 years!

"Anarchism is not a romantic fable but the hardheaded realization, based on five thousand years of experience, that we cannot entrust the management of our lives to kings, priests, politicians, generals, and county commissioners." - Edward Abbey

(lets not turn this into an Anarchism discussion if possible. Take the rest of the quote for its value minus the Anarchism if needed.)

[RollinonFour]

Man that's shitty. I cant believe they just shot him like that. very true, they can and want to kill you.

Police are a phenomenon unto themsevles.



2012 is coming. then Rage Zombie time on all their asses

[NickDagger]

Listen, first off, I agree that regardless of intent the cop should at least be charged with manslaughter.

But let's get serious. Does anyone here REALLY think that this cop, in front of dozens of witnesses, purposely shot a man who was handcuffed on his stomach?

Why would he do that?

Reports have indicated he has lived a rather straight and narrow life thus far, so why, on one of the busiest nights of his year, would he purposely do something that would end his career, put himself in jail and probably ruin his family's lives?

Get serious.

It was New Years eve. Guns had been found earlier in the night on passangers. Everyone was on edge. A fight was reported....

Put yourself in his shoes.

With all of that going on, he had some kind of brain fuck. Like we all have. And thought he was doing something he wasn't or vice versa. Who knows, maybe he was thinking he was tazering him, maybe he was thinking he wasn't gonna pull the trigger.

No one knows but him.

The fact is, the guys life is ruined. He will spend some time in prison. As he should, but lets get serious with our armchair analysis and put ourselves there. It sucks for the victim and his family(who will and should get millions) and it sucks for the cop and his family.

The way the people in the mobs reacted by destroying innocent business and regular violence is fucking disgraceful and does nothing but make a bad situation ten times worse.




As a side note, cops go WAY too soon with the tazer. They pull it out and use it on almost anyone without even blinking. That shit has gotta stop.

[NickDagger]

And of course I agree in principal with the comments about police in general that have been made here, and about how much bullshit it is that so many literally get away with murder.

It's just in this particular case...the shocked looked on the officers face kind of seals the deal for me.

[gravel pitch]

Listen, first off, I agree that regardless of intent the cop should at least be charged with manslaughter.

But let's get serious. Does anyone here REALLY think that this cop, in front of dozens of witnesses, purposely shot a man who was handcuffed on his stomach?

Why would he do that?

Reports have indicated he has lived a rather straight and narrow life thus far, so why, on one of the busiest nights of his year, would he purposely do something that would end his career, put himself in jail and probably ruin his family's lives?

Get serious.

It was New Years eve. Guns had been found earlier in the night on passangers. Everyone was on edge. A fight was reported....

Put yourself in his shoes.

With all of that going on, he had some kind of brain fuck. Like we all have. And thought he was doing something he wasn't or vice versa. Who knows, maybe he was thinking he was tazering him, maybe he was thinking he wasn't gonna pull the trigger.

No one knows but him.

The fact is, the guys life is ruined. He will spend some time in prison. As he should, but lets get serious with our armchair analysis and put ourselves there. It sucks for the victim and his family(who will and should get millions) and it sucks for the cop and his family.

The way the people in the mobs reacted by destroying innocent business and regular violence is fucking disgraceful and does nothing but make a bad situation ten times worse.




As a side note, cops go WAY too soon with the tazer. They pull it out and use it on almost anyone without even blinking. That shit has gotta stop.

Yep, and I agree about the tazer thing. I've already said before in another thread that I think tazers should be outlawed. They use it as a crutch so they don't have to deal with people properly.

If some guy is pissed and the cops don't want to deal with an irrate man, they tazer him, then drag him off downtown. It shows in my opinion a big decline in the quality and skill of police officers, hence why bullshit like Oscar Grant happens. If that cop was only carrying a gun, there'd be no debate here. Cops need guns to defend themselves, but they did fine for years without tazers, and I think they should go back to not carrying them. Then they'd be forced to either learn how to deal with people, or find a new career.

[H8R part 4]

as much as i dislike them, the police is a necessary evil that exists so we can go about our lives.
if there was no police none of us could walk around outside, we wouldn't be able to skate, walk to the store, get something to eat, meet up with friends, get to our jobs/school, we wouldn't even be safe in our own homes.
everybody hates the cops but they forget that the reason for their existence is so that we can live and enjoy ourselves without fear of getting robbed/killed every time we step out our doors.


that said, i would guess this was an accidental discharge.  no one, would be dumb enough to shoot someone thats cuffed with so many witnesses standing around. 
i should add that i'm not down for rioters/rioting as theres never a good enough reason and the anger is usually diverted to parties that had nothing to do with nothing.   i can't think of 1 instance when rioting helped anyone.  its usually a bunch of assholes playing monkey see monkey do.  they don't even have a clue as to why they're doing it, they just see everyone else and join in which confirms my belief that stupid people group together(and stay multiplying).
protesting is one thing but rioting...pfft!  sorry of this is unpopular but i'd simply shoot every rioter and never give it a second thought.  if you're rioting in the streets you deserve to get shot.