McSame picked a women VP

[Sleazy]

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Dagger- I consider Bush conservative economically in the sense that he did very little in terms of regulating the market. The bail outs and all of that made him seem... I don't know how to say it. Very pro corporate. He stacked the deck for large corporations so they would be allowed to run wild, and I guess that is where it came from. In my head conservative means allow corporations to run wild. Traditionally this has been done with Laisse Faire economic policies, which tended to help those already in power. Bush took it even further by not only letting corporations run wild, but also by bailing them out every time they got fucked up from going wild. Its not traditionally "conservative," but the meaning of political affiliations shifts over time, and now "conservative" seems to becoming synonymous with the Bush style pro-corporate agenda.

[close]

I reject very much the idea that Bush or Mccain are conservative, but I accept your description here, and it is what is accepted now in America as conservative. A shame.

well there's social conservatis

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Dagger- I consider Bush conservative economically in the sense that he did very little in terms of regulating the market. The bail outs and all of that made him seem... I don't know how to say it. Very pro corporate. He stacked the deck for large corporations so they would be allowed to run wild, and I guess that is where it came from. In my head conservative means allow corporations to run wild. Traditionally this has been done with Laisse Faire economic policies, which tended to help those already in power. Bush took it even further by not only letting corporations run wild, but also by bailing them out every time they got fucked up from going wild. Its not traditionally "conservative," but the meaning of political affiliations shifts over time, and now "conservative" seems to becoming synonymous with the Bush style pro-corporate agenda.

[close]

I reject very much the idea that Bush or Mccain are conservative, but I accept your description here, and it is what is accepted now in America as conservative. A shame.

what do you think represent conservatism best? goldwater?

[Ronald Wilson Reagan]

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Dagger- I consider Bush conservative economically in the sense that he did very little in terms of regulating the market. The bail outs and all of that made him seem... I don't know how to say it. Very pro corporate. He stacked the deck for large corporations so they would be allowed to run wild, and I guess that is where it came from. In my head conservative means allow corporations to run wild. Traditionally this has been done with Laisse Faire economic policies, which tended to help those already in power. Bush took it even further by not only letting corporations run wild, but also by bailing them out every time they got fucked up from going wild. Its not traditionally "conservative," but the meaning of political affiliations shifts over time, and now "conservative" seems to becoming synonymous with the Bush style pro-corporate agenda.

[close]

I reject very much the idea that Bush or Mccain are conservative, but I accept your description here, and it is what is accepted now in America as conservative. A shame.

[close]

well there's social conservatis

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Dagger- I consider Bush conservative economically in the sense that he did very little in terms of regulating the market. The bail outs and all of that made him seem... I don't know how to say it. Very pro corporate. He stacked the deck for large corporations so they would be allowed to run wild, and I guess that is where it came from. In my head conservative means allow corporations to run wild. Traditionally this has been done with Laisse Faire economic policies, which tended to help those already in power. Bush took it even further by not only letting corporations run wild, but also by bailing them out every time they got fucked up from going wild. Its not traditionally "conservative," but the meaning of political affiliations shifts over time, and now "conservative" seems to becoming synonymous with the Bush style pro-corporate agenda.

[close]

I reject very much the idea that Bush or Mccain are conservative, but I accept your description here, and it is what is accepted now in America as conservative. A shame.

[close]

what do you think represent conservatism best? goldwater?

I'd say so. Coincidentally, his last name makes me think of urine.

[NickDagger]

I like this strand:

Lysander Spooner->Murray Rothbard->Ron Paul

(Austrian economics, Libertarianism, etc)

and this strand:

Adam Smith->Bertrand Russell->Noam Chomsky

(Libertarian socialism, anarchism, etc)

The Goldwater movement in the Republican party and the McGovern movement in the Democratic party both represent high moments for their respective parties.

Both ended quickly.

[Ronald Wilson Reagan]

Goldwater was a nutcase. Reagan was like a milder version of Goldwater.

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I know who ignorant people are.  People who align themselves with McCain when McCain's campaign manager himself says, "The election is not about issues, it's about personalities."  People who would vote for a candidate because they would rather have a beer with x rather than y candidate is an ignorant way to vote because they dont CHOOSE to find about the issues. 

[close]

But it's you that admits to being "uninformed" about conservative positions -- YOU are the one that is ignorant. Hell, it's ignorant to just assume that all McCain voters are voting on personalities.

[close]

of course they aren't all uniformed but it's hard to deny that a big part of their base is "uniformed" about economic issues and foriegn policy if you define "uniformed" as voting against your own interest and not being able to articulate your stance.

the rich base of the republican party are certainly informed as they party caters too them. no mystery there.

for the non-rich voters you have group that only cares about polerizing social issues (evangelicals and rednecks) and whether it's a matter of political priority for these people or actual ignorance, the fact that they continually vote against their own economic interest, that they don't give coherent well thought out answers about policy and don't seem to notice that they are being taken advantage of by the republican party who never changes any of the policies surronding these social issues that they care so much about makes that base seem uninformed. they also seem to be illogical because they are motivated by bigotry on a lot of their stances which is something that you can't talk about these days and when asked about these issues they of course have a hard time articulating their stance because it's not PC to talk about their motives. all of this makes them seem uniformed.

so then it becomes a situation where even if they are informed, how's anyone too know? i'd guess that they are actually uninformed based on my time in small towns though, eventhough my post is diplomatically giving them the benifit of the doubt.

[close]

I hate to break this to you, but a large portion of the DNC's voter base is uneducated, criminally active, and living off of the government.... are these people 'informed' somehow?

You just said this so people would say "that's such an ignorant thing to say, and there is absolutely no proof to back up what you are saying." And then you could respond by saying "now you understand why I find it ignorant that you call all republicans ignorant hicks!" Right?
If not we got some hardcore hypocrisy.

[sebastian toombs]

Dagger- I consider Bush conservative economically in the sense that he did very little in terms of regulating the market. The bail outs and all of that made him seem... I don't know how to say it. Very pro corporate. He stacked the deck for large corporations so they would be allowed to run wild, and I guess that is where it came from. In my head conservative means allow corporations to run wild. Traditionally this has been done with Laisse Faire economic policies, which tended to help those already in power. Bush took it even further by not only letting corporations run wild, but also by bailing them out every time they got fucked up from going wild. Its not traditionally "conservative," but the meaning of political affiliations shifts over time, and now "conservative" seems to becoming synonymous with the Bush style pro-corporate agenda.

youve pretty much written the definition of liberalism...   ie: you are free to do as you please when it comes to making money, so long as you dont hurt anyone else.  competition, innovation, unfettered trade, individualism -- that is all liberalism.  no interference from the church or the king or the great landholders or the holders of royal charters (monopolies).  those who support these latter interests would be termed conservatives. 

[Wizard Fuck]

small gov. small taxes

[Ronald Wilson Reagan]

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Dagger- I consider Bush conservative economically in the sense that he did very little in terms of regulating the market. The bail outs and all of that made him seem... I don't know how to say it. Very pro corporate. He stacked the deck for large corporations so they would be allowed to run wild, and I guess that is where it came from. In my head conservative means allow corporations to run wild. Traditionally this has been done with Laisse Faire economic policies, which tended to help those already in power. Bush took it even further by not only letting corporations run wild, but also by bailing them out every time they got fucked up from going wild. Its not traditionally "conservative," but the meaning of political affiliations shifts over time, and now "conservative" seems to becoming synonymous with the Bush style pro-corporate agenda.

[close]

youve pretty much written the definition of liberalism...   ie: you are free to do as you please when it comes to making money, so long as you dont hurt anyone else.  competition, innovation, unfettered trade, individualism -- that is all liberalism.  no interference from the church or the king or the great landholders or the holders of royal charters (monopolies).  those who support these latter interests would be termed conservatives. 

I respectfully disagree. NOt necessarily with your definition- though I did earlier say that the meaning of political words shifts over time. I just don't think you analyzed what I wrote correctly. When did I say "so long as you don't hurt anyone else?" Hurting others is ok and even encouraged in Bush's policies based on the idea of "social darwinism." Basically, yeah, exploit them, kill them and give them nothing in return, because some people are losers and need to be killed off for the benefit of the winners, and fuck 'em for letting themselves be exploited. That is what Bush's policies represent. A modern liberal would do what they could back then to limit the role of the landowners. Bush's policies would do what is necessary to give landowners as much power as they need to maintain or increase their power over the land. Funny thing is-there are modern landowners, we call them mortgage banks. Under Bush they became far more powerful and exploitative.
Funny thing about the government's role in industry, is it tends to force powerful elites not to interfere with the rights of those working below them. Also, in the liberal sense- the government of a democratic-republic is a representation of the will of the people. In that sense, it is the government's job to stand up for the people it represents when they are upset about how they are being treated as consumers or workers.

[Dr Newton]

Goldwater was a nutcase. Reagan was like a milder version of Goldwater.

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I know who ignorant people are.  People who align themselves with McCain when McCain's campaign manager himself says, "The election is not about issues, it's about personalities."  People who would vote for a candidate because they would rather have a beer with x rather than y candidate is an ignorant way to vote because they dont CHOOSE to find about the issues. 

[close]

But it's you that admits to being "uninformed" about conservative positions -- YOU are the one that is ignorant. Hell, it's ignorant to just assume that all McCain voters are voting on personalities.

[close]

of course they aren't all uniformed but it's hard to deny that a big part of their base is "uniformed" about economic issues and foriegn policy if you define "uniformed" as voting against your own interest and not being able to articulate your stance.

the rich base of the republican party are certainly informed as they party caters too them. no mystery there.

for the non-rich voters you have group that only cares about polerizing social issues (evangelicals and rednecks) and whether it's a matter of political priority for these people or actual ignorance, the fact that they continually vote against their own economic interest, that they don't give coherent well thought out answers about policy and don't seem to notice that they are being taken advantage of by the republican party who never changes any of the policies surronding these social issues that they care so much about makes that base seem uninformed. they also seem to be illogical because they are motivated by bigotry on a lot of their stances which is something that you can't talk about these days and when asked about these issues they of course have a hard time articulating their stance because it's not PC to talk about their motives. all of this makes them seem uniformed.

so then it becomes a situation where even if they are informed, how's anyone too know? i'd guess that they are actually uninformed based on my time in small towns though, eventhough my post is diplomatically giving them the benifit of the doubt.

[close]

I hate to break this to you, but a large portion of the DNC's voter base is uneducated, criminally active, and living off of the government.... are these people 'informed' somehow?

[close]

You just said this so people would say "that's such an ignorant thing to say, and there is absolutely no proof to back up what you are saying." And then you could respond by saying "now you understand why I find it ignorant that you call all republicans ignorant hicks!" Right?
If not we got some hardcore hypocrisy.

Essentially, yes. While the GOP does love to flirt with the rural poor and the theocracy crowd, the DNC does the exact same thing with the equally ignorant urban poor. Both groups of voters often vote against there own self-interests, yet, for some reason, the party of college graduates, and the party that is overrepresented by those with post-graduate degrees is the one being cast down as the party of 'ignorance'?

[biggums mcgee]

Newton I'm curious, what political party do you affiliate with?

[NickDagger]

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Dagger- I consider Bush conservative economically in the sense that he did very little in terms of regulating the market. The bail outs and all of that made him seem... I don't know how to say it. Very pro corporate. He stacked the deck for large corporations so they would be allowed to run wild, and I guess that is where it came from. In my head conservative means allow corporations to run wild. Traditionally this has been done with Laisse Faire economic policies, which tended to help those already in power. Bush took it even further by not only letting corporations run wild, but also by bailing them out every time they got fucked up from going wild. Its not traditionally "conservative," but the meaning of political affiliations shifts over time, and now "conservative" seems to becoming synonymous with the Bush style pro-corporate agenda.

[close]

youve pretty much written the definition of liberalism...   ie: you are free to do as you please when it comes to making money, so long as you dont hurt anyone else.  competition, innovation, unfettered trade, individualism -- that is all liberalism.  no interference from the church or the king or the great landholders or the holders of royal charters (monopolies).  those who support these latter interests would be termed conservatives. 

America has different understood ideas behind the terms liberalism, libertarianism and conservative than most of the rest of the world.

[spungo]

He's too young to vote anyway.

[Dr Newton]

Newton I'm curious, what political party do you affiliate with?

None. I'm a libertarian, but I don't even identify with the Libertarian Party.

[Dr Newton]

He's too young to vote anyway.

Too young for what? Do you think that your "vote" actually matters, LOL?

[sweets]

I hate to break this to you, but a large portion of the DNC's voter base is uneducated, criminally active, and living off of the government.... are these people 'informed' somehow?

If you can't back this statement up with some sort of research (preferably from an independent source [WikiPedia doesn't count]), I'm calling bullshit.

[Dr Newton]

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I hate to break this to you, but a large portion of the DNC's voter base is uneducated, criminally active, and living off of the government.... are these people 'informed' somehow?

[close]

If you can't back this statement up with some sort of research (preferably from an independent source [WikiPedia doesn't count]), I'm calling bullshit.

Here's a quote from a political scientist:

Susan McManus, political science professor at the University of South Florida, said blacks and younger voters primarily prefer Barack Obama to John McCain in Florida.

But, “since generic thought is many ex-cons have less income and maybe lower education, (all felons) will probably vote Democratic, since that’s the makeup of the party.”

http://www.news-press.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080803/NEWS01/80802024

I'll try to find some real statistics when I have more time.

[sweets]

I wouldn't regard that as independent. She's a Republican. Very smart woman but I wouldn't say she's independent.

      Dr. MacManus headed up the Health Services Policy Transition Team for Florida Governor Jeb Bush and was appointed chair of the Florida Elections Commission by the Governor (1999-2003).    The Governor also has appointed her to his Council of Economic Advisors.

from:
http://64.233.169.104/search?q=cache:CHpAfwBb4LsJ:www.cea.fiu.edu/documents/bios/BIO-macmanus.doc+susan+mcmanus+political+scientist&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=7&gl=us&client=safari

[Dr Newton]

I wouldn't regard that as independent. She's a Republican. Very smart woman but I wouldn't say she's independent.

      Dr. MacManus headed up the Health Services Policy Transition Team for Florida Governor Jeb Bush and was appointed chair of the Florida Elections Commission by the Governor (1999-2003).    The Governor also has appointed her to his Council of Economic Advisors.

from:
http://64.233.169.104/search?q=cache:CHpAfwBb4LsJ:www.cea.fiu.edu/documents/bios/BIO-macmanus.doc+susan+mcmanus+political+scientist&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=7&gl=us&client=safari

So the source cannot have any political affiliation AND it cannot be Wikipedia? In that case, good luck finding it yourself. It's common knowledge that felons are more likely to favor Democratic candidates, along with the urban poor and people that drop out of high school. One of the party's largest blocks is African-Americans, who vote DNC 91% of the time. They're disproportionately a part of all three groups.

[the j]

FUCK DR. NEWT YOU GOT ME TYPIN SO HARD IM FIXIN TO BREAK MY MACBOOK AIR!
GTFO HOW MANY TIMES I GOTTA TELL YOU

talk about issues ho like offshore drilling or the fact that his VP is an inexperienced bitch, stupid cunt stop arguing for the sake of arguing godammit & finish high school first cuz believe it or not all the info you'll need to seem sligtly educated isnt on wikipedia

see how dumb you look

[NickDagger]

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I wouldn't regard that as independent. She's a Republican. Very smart woman but I wouldn't say she's independent.

      Dr. MacManus headed up the Health Services Policy Transition Team for Florida Governor Jeb Bush and was appointed chair of the Florida Elections Commission by the Governor (1999-2003).    The Governor also has appointed her to his Council of Economic Advisors.

from:
http://64.233.169.104/search?q=cache:CHpAfwBb4LsJ:www.cea.fiu.edu/documents/bios/BIO-macmanus.doc+susan+mcmanus+political+scientist&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=7&gl=us&client=safari

[close]

So the source cannot have any political affiliation AND it cannot be Wikipedia? In that case, good luck finding it yourself. It's common knowledge that felons are more likely to favor Democratic candidates, along with the urban poor and people that drop out of high school. One of the party's largest blocks is African-Americans, who vote DNC 91% of the time. They're disproportionately a part of all three groups.

Um you know in most states felons lose the right to vote for years right? And in a few states, namely Kentucky and Virginia they lose the right to vote for life...you know this right?

So no, most of the democratic base are not armed BLACK felons.

Also, stop posting.

P.S. If you fancy yourself any sort of libertarian you should be against the drug war, right? You know the thing that causes many non-violent blacks to pick up felonies?

[sebastian toombs]

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Dagger- I consider Bush conservative economically in the sense that he did very little in terms of regulating the market. The bail outs and all of that made him seem... I don't know how to say it. Very pro corporate. He stacked the deck for large corporations so they would be allowed to run wild, and I guess that is where it came from. In my head conservative means allow corporations to run wild. Traditionally this has been done with Laisse Faire economic policies, which tended to help those already in power. Bush took it even further by not only letting corporations run wild, but also by bailing them out every time they got fucked up from going wild. Its not traditionally "conservative," but the meaning of political affiliations shifts over time, and now "conservative" seems to becoming synonymous with the Bush style pro-corporate agenda.

[close]

youve pretty much written the definition of liberalism...   ie: you are free to do as you please when it comes to making money, so long as you dont hurt anyone else.  competition, innovation, unfettered trade, individualism -- that is all liberalism.  no interference from the church or the king or the great landholders or the holders of royal charters (monopolies).  those who support these latter interests would be termed conservatives. 

[close]

I respectfully disagree. NOt necessarily with your definition- though I did earlier say that the meaning of political words shifts over time. I just don't think you analyzed what I wrote correctly.

laissez faire = liberalism.   me right.  look it up if you must.  bush could be termed a social conservative, but theres no mistaking that he (and mccain, and obama, and clinton) are economic liberals.  america has been the world's most hyper liberal economy (and perhaps society) in all history.

[sweets]

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I wouldn't regard that as independent. She's a Republican. Very smart woman but I wouldn't say she's independent.

      Dr. MacManus headed up the Health Services Policy Transition Team for Florida Governor Jeb Bush and was appointed chair of the Florida Elections Commission by the Governor (1999-2003).    The Governor also has appointed her to his Council of Economic Advisors.

from:
http://64.233.169.104/search?q=cache:CHpAfwBb4LsJ:www.cea.fiu.edu/documents/bios/BIO-macmanus.doc+susan+mcmanus+political+scientist&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=7&gl=us&client=safari

[close]

So the source cannot have any political affiliation AND it cannot be Wikipedia? In that case, good luck finding it yourself. It's common knowledge that felons are more likely to favor Democratic candidates, along with the urban poor and people that drop out of high school. One of the party's largest blocks is African-Americans, who vote DNC 91% of the time. They're disproportionately a part of all three groups.

There are independent sources and when you get to college, you'll have to find them. I don't know of any professor that will accept WikiPedia as a reference. Any jackass can post an article there and call it truth. "Common knowledge" won't cut it, either.

If you want to make claims such as those above, I would like to know you have some proof. Your argument could use some more fact and less belief. I can see where you're basing your opinion but that is certainly not factual.

PS- I'm seriously looking in to moving to Canada. I'm losing faith in America and it's proposed dream.

[sebastian toombs]

"life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness [ie: property" vs. "peace, order, and good government"

[NickDagger]

http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5iKt4CePAt-tJqdPld1mZxbC4nsXwD9342G2G2
Quote:

Gov't officials probed about illicit sex, gifts

By DINA CAPPIELLO – 8 hours ago

WASHINGTON (AP) — Government officials handling billions of dollars in oil royalties improperly engaged in sex with employees of energy companies they were dealing with and received numerous gifts from them, federal investigators said Wednesday.

The alleged transgressions involve 13 former and current Interior Department employees in Denver and Washington. Their alleged improprieties include rigging contracts, working part-time as private oil consultants, and having sexual relationships with — and accepting golf and ski trips and dinners from — oil company employees, according to three reports released Wednesday by the Interior Department's inspector general.

The investigations reveal a "culture of substance abuse and promiscuity" by a small group of individuals "wholly lacking in acceptance of or adherence to government ethical standards," wrote Inspector General Earl E. Devaney. Devaney's office spent more than two years and $5.3 million on the investigations.

The reports describe a fraternity house atmosphere inside the Denver Minerals Management Service office responsible for marketing the oil and gas that energy companies barter to the government instead of making cash royalty payments for drilling on federal lands. The government received $4.3 billion in such royalty-in-kind payments last year. The oil is then resold to energy companies or put in the nation's emergency stockpile.

Between 2002 and 2006, nearly a third of the 55-person staff in the Denver office received gifts and gratuities from oil and gas companies, including Chevron, Shell, Hess Corp. and Denver-based Gary-Williams Energy Corp. the investigators found. Two oil marketers who received gifts and gratuities on at least 135 occasions displayed no remorse when confronted with their activities, Devaney said. He singled out Chevron as refusing to cooperate with the investigation.

Don Campbell, a Chevron spokesman, said Wednesday that the company "produced all of the documents that the government requested months ago."

The reports also said former head of the Denver Royalty-in-Kind office, Gregory W. Smith, used cocaine and had sex with subordinates. The report said Smith also steered government contracts to a consulting business that was employing him part-time.

Smith, contacted by e-mail by The Associated Press, said he had not seen the report and could not respond. He and nine other employees in the Denver office are mentioned in the reports.

MMS Director Randall Luthi, in an interview with the AP, said the agency was taking the report "extremely seriously" and would review the allegations and weigh taking appropriate action in coming months. The Inspector General is recommending that current employees implicated be fired and be barred for life from working within the royalty program.

House Natural Resources Chairman Nick Rahall, D-W.Va., said "this whole IG report reads like a script from a television miniseries and one that cannot air during family viewing time. It is no wonder that the office was doing such a lousy job of overseeing the RIK program; clearly the employees had 'other' priorities in that office."

One of the employees named in the investigation, Jimmy Mayberry, has already pleaded guilty in U.S. District Court in Washington to violations of conflict-of-interest laws. The Justice Department declined to prosecute Smith and former Associate Director of the Minerals Revenue Management program Lucy Querques Denett, who the report says manipulated contracts to ensure they were awarded to former Interior employees.

The findings are the latest sign of trouble at the Minerals Management Service, which has already been accused of mismanaging the collection of fees from oil companies and writing faulty contracts for drilling on government land and offshore. The charges also come as lawmakers and both presidential candidates weigh giving oil companies more access to federal lands, which would bring in more money to the federal government.

"This all shows the oil industry holds shocking sway over the administration and even key federal employees," said Sen. Bill Nelson, D-Fla. "This is why we must not allow Big Oil's agenda to be jammed through Congress."

While most government royalties for drilling on federal lands are paid in cash, the government in recent years has been receiving a greater share of its oil and gas royalties in the actual product. More of that oil is also being sold on the open market, versus being deposited in the Strategic Petroleum Reserve, the nation's emergency oil stockpile. Congress earlier this year passed a law halting deposits of oil to the reserve to alleviate high gasoline prices.

Interior Secretary Dirk Kempthorne, who was asked about the reports earlier in the day before they were given to him and congressional offices, said the investigation was prompted by a 2006 phone call from anemployee who said there were ethical lapses in the Denver office.

"I look forward to having the opportunity to review the inspector general's findings so we can take the appropriate actions," Kempthorne said.

http://thinkprogress.org/

[Samuel L Jackson]

Normally, both your asses would be dead as fucking fried chicken, but you happen to pull this shit while I'm in a transitional period so I don't wanna kill you, I wanna help you. But I can't give you this case, it don't belong to me. Besides, I've already been through too much shit this morning over this case to hand it over to your dumb ass.

[NickDagger]

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Dagger- I consider Bush conservative economically in the sense that he did very little in terms of regulating the market. The bail outs and all of that made him seem... I don't know how to say it. Very pro corporate. He stacked the deck for large corporations so they would be allowed to run wild, and I guess that is where it came from. In my head conservative means allow corporations to run wild. Traditionally this has been done with Laisse Faire economic policies, which tended to help those already in power. Bush took it even further by not only letting corporations run wild, but also by bailing them out every time they got fucked up from going wild. Its not traditionally "conservative," but the meaning of political affiliations shifts over time, and now "conservative" seems to becoming synonymous with the Bush style pro-corporate agenda.

[close]

youve pretty much written the definition of liberalism...   ie: you are free to do as you please when it comes to making money, so long as you dont hurt anyone else.  competition, innovation, unfettered trade, individualism -- that is all liberalism.  no interference from the church or the king or the great landholders or the holders of royal charters (monopolies).  those who support these latter interests would be termed conservatives. 

[close]

I respectfully disagree. NOt necessarily with your definition- though I did earlier say that the meaning of political words shifts over time. I just don't think you analyzed what I wrote correctly.

[close]

laissez faire = liberalism.   me right.  look it up if you must.  bush could be termed a social conservative, but theres no mistaking that he (and mccain, and obama, and clinton) are economic liberals.  america has been the world's most hyper liberal economy (and perhaps society) in all history.

You guys are both correct-the terms meanings are unique in America-virtually everyone else uses the terms as you describe.

[Gatoraids]

Dr.Newton the majority of people who get welfare are white southern women in rural areas, places where people are most likely to vote republican.

[NickDagger]

[NickDagger]

I think I might be able to explain some of Sarah Palin's appeal. She's the "American Idol" candidate. Consider. What defines an "American Idol" finalist? They're good-looking, work well on television, have a sunny personality, are fierce competitors, and so talented, why, they're darned near the real thing. There's a reason "American Idol" gets such high ratings. People identify with the contestants. They think, Hey, that could be me up there on that show!

My problem is, I don't want to be up there. I don't want a vice president who is darned near good enough. I want a vice president who is better, wiser, well-traveled, has met world leaders, who three months ago had an opinion on Iraq. Someone who doesn't repeat bald- faced lies about earmarks and the Bridge to Nowhere. Someone who doesn't appoint Alaskan politicians to "study" global warming, because, hello! It has been studied. The returns are convincing enough that John McCain and Barack Obama are darned near in agreement.

I would also want someone who didn't make a teeny little sneer when referring to "people who go to the Ivy League." When I was a teen I dreamed of going to Harvard, but my dad, an electrician, told me, "Boy, we don't have the money. Thank your lucky stars you were born in Urbana and can go to the University of Illinois right here in town." So I did, very happily. Although Palin gets laughs when she mentions the "elite" Ivy League, she sure did attend the heck out of college.

Five different schools in six years. What was that about?

And how can a politician her age have never have gone to Europe? My dad had died, my mom was working as a book-keeper and I had a job at the local newspaper when, at 19, I scraped together $240 for a charter flight to Europe. I had Arthur Frommer's $5 a Day under my arm, started in London, even rented a Vespa and drove in the traffic of Rome. A few years later, I was able to send my mom, along with the $15 a Day book.

You don't need to be a pointy-headed elitist to travel abroad. You need curiosity and a hunger to see the world. What kind of a person (who has the money) arrives at the age of 44 and has only been out of the country once, on an official tour to Iraq? Sarah Palin's travel record is that of a provincial, not someone who is equipped to deal with global issues.

But some people like that. She's never traveled to Europe, Asia, Africa, South America or Down Under? That makes her like them. She didn't go to Harvard? Good for her! There a lot of hockey moms who haven't seen London, but most of them would probably love to, if they had the dough. And they'd be proud if one of their kids won a scholarship to Harvard.

I trust the American people will see through Palin, and save the Republic in November. The most damning indictment against her is that she considered herself a good choice to be a heartbeat away. That shows bad judgment.

[NickDagger]

[grimcity]

Why in the hell don't third parties win local elections before they try to become Presidents?

Also, I like Ralph (even gave him a vote once) and I like Dr. Paul, but they're not supporting a third party, they're both ensuring a Republican win... Ralph with the lefties, Ron with the centrists and privatize-everythingers. I'm glad they're telling people to vote, but really, a third party Presidential vote is nothing more than symbolism (or a waste of a perfectly fine vote should you look at things strategically).

Third parties:
Win city local seats, then win seats in State legislature. then on to the Feds, then go as high up as you can. Establish your parties and you won't be the "he's neat, but a novelty" candidate anymore.