Security guard beaten at SF Black Rock

[charade]

I think the extra angle will just ruin this situation more for Jesse. If you've seen the news videos, you should know by now the court, news, and family/friends of Dan are against him and the dudes with him. They don't care who did what first, cause it was on the business property. They're just going to be more devastated seeing a closer HD angle of the guy getting knocked out. We'll see how things go when another news article gets out though

Had been thinking about that last night. The current footage is so distant that it's like we're all taking-apart a clip of the JFK assassination.

If the filmer's clip shows anything less than Jansen acting like a total lunatic it's going to be very painful for the family and won't help the accused. I was curious why the defense lawyer seemed so jovial about it.

Obviously this thread will be massive leading up to the trial but any minute dissection on our part will be pointless. This incident will be looked at very dispassionately by the authorities. Any kind of 'I dunno, it looked like he grabbed a board there' is just like...vapor to the law. It's nothing.

As someone touched on earlier, I don't think it's going to be the referendum on skateboarding in SF some think it will. There hopefully will be some interesting dialogue in the community but to the media and the average person the skateboarding angle won't be a big deal. It could basically be used as shorthand for 'young punks' if you know what I mean.

[DannyDee]

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I think the extra angle will just ruin this situation more for Jesse. If you've seen the news videos, you should know by now the court, news, and family/friends of Dan are against him and the dudes with him. They don't care who did what first, cause it was on the business property. They're just going to be more devastated seeing a closer HD angle of the guy getting knocked out. We'll see how things go when another news article gets out though

[close]

Had been thinking about that last night. The current footage is so distant that it's like we're all taking-apart a clip of the JFK assassination.

If the filmer's clip shows anything less than Jansen acting like a total lunatic it's going to be very painful for the family and won't help the accused. I was curious why the defense lawyer seemed so jovial about it.

Obviously this thread will be massive leading up to the trial but any minute dissection on our part will be pointless. This incident will be looked at very dispassionately by the authorities. Any kind of 'I dunno, it looked like he grabbed a board there' is just like...vapor to the law. It's nothing.

As someone touched on earlier, I don't think it's going to be the referendum on skateboarding in SF some think it will. There hopefully will be some interesting dialogue in the community but to the media and the average person the skateboarding angle won't be a big deal. It could basically be used as shorthand for 'young punks' if you know what I mean.

I don't think the defense is actually the security guard started attacking them. My reading of it was, that the defense lawyer was claiming it was another skater who hit the security guard first, then in a state of confusion or unawareness, the security guard attacked Jesse, and Jesse defended himself. This results in the traumatic brain injury. I don't really think it will fly that well though, they had ample time to leave to avoid being in the situation. This seems to get built up considering he was already putting barricades up, and they were getting moved. So, you gotta think there is 10 to 15 minutes building to the clip we saw.

Given Jesse had ample time to leave, and then originally denied even being there to cops (atleast according to the Judge), I can't see this going too well for him.

[nopes]

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I think the extra angle will just ruin this situation more for Jesse. If you've seen the news videos, you should know by now the court, news, and family/friends of Dan are against him and the dudes with him. They don't care who did what first, cause it was on the business property. They're just going to be more devastated seeing a closer HD angle of the guy getting knocked out. We'll see how things go when another news article gets out though

[close]

Had been thinking about that last night. The current footage is so distant that it's like we're all taking-apart a clip of the JFK assassination.

If the filmer's clip shows anything less than Jansen acting like a total lunatic it's going to be very painful for the family and won't help the accused. I was curious why the defense lawyer seemed so jovial about it.

Obviously this thread will be massive leading up to the trial but any minute dissection on our part will be pointless. This incident will be looked at very dispassionately by the authorities. Any kind of 'I dunno, it looked like he grabbed a board there' is just like...vapor to the law. It's nothing.

As someone touched on earlier, I don't think it's going to be the referendum on skateboarding in SF some think it will. There hopefully will be some interesting dialogue in the community but to the media and the average person the skateboarding angle won't be a big deal. It could basically be used as shorthand for 'young punks' if you know what I mean.

[close]

I don't think the defense is actually the security guard started attacking them. My reading of it was, that the defense lawyer was claiming it was another skater who hit the security guard first, then in a state of confusion or unawareness, the security guard attacked Jesse, and Jesse defended himself. This results in the traumatic brain injury. I don't really think it will fly that well though, they had ample time to leave to avoid being in the situation. This seems to get built up considering he was already putting barricades up, and they were getting moved. So, you gotta think there is 10 to 15 minutes building to the clip we saw.

Given Jesse had ample time to leave, and then originally denied even being there to cops (atleast according to the Judge), I can't see this going too well for him.

yeah i think the video is being used to snitch on one of the others. interesting play

i feel so bad for the security guards family.

[Chapingro]

I appreciate you acknowledging further evidence and shifting your position. I hope that more people do the same.

Hey everyone, I've missed about 10 pages of this because I've been out of town. I've been critical of those immediately pointing the finger at the skaters from the start simply because I hadn't seen any evidence proving this.

I have gotten shit for this and a few days ago I saw security video footage that showed the guard making the first attack. But today I saw the security footage uncut:

https://twitter.com/nbcjeanelle/status/1081003009847418882

The clip shows the guard taking a skater's board and the skater lunging at him (which I assume was to reach to grab his board back), but it turns out looking more like the first act of a physical attack on another human.

My outlook on this has changed unless I see other video evidence showing the guard making the first attempt at a physical attack on someone else.

Thanks to those of you on here who responded to my views with insight instead of hate or claiming I had some motive for how I was seeing things. I just want to see the evidence before making a decision, which I think is pretty logical.

If it hasn't already been shared in here, this article by Jenkem should be re read by us often:

http://www.jenkemmag.com/home/2016/12/19/the-skateboarders-guide-to-getting-arrested/

I feel bad for everyone involved in this. I think we can all collectively agree we don't go out skateboarding with the intention of it creating violence.

[Monkey_Mcpott]

The uncut video kinda gives you a better perspective of the whole thing:

I'm assuming Jesse is the one in the black hoodie with the white tee sticking out. He came after the fact. There was somebody else that initially pushed him to the ground. The first person was a goofy skater (Might have been Delatorre) that got his board taken away first. As he was trying to take his board back it looked like he either pushed him to the ground or Dan might have fell from letting go of the board. Then Jesse came out of nowhere to punch him as he was getting up but kinda looked like he missed. Dan then came right at him to grab him and Jesse's first reaction is to swing his board toward his head. Dan still has a hold on Jesse and Jesse then either shoves or punches himself off of him. That's when he falls then hits his head on the floor and is out cold. I wish i could see the rest, according to somebody here they mentioned that someone stayed behind to call for help. If that's the case id like to see that unless all they did was run away.

[Makaveli]

I dont see anything in that video other than some skaters instigating some shit, jesse punching the security guard on the ground, the guy drop cold, and dudes fleeing...looks pretty incriminating

[charade]

The uncut video kinda gives you a better perspective of the whole thing:

I'm assuming Jesse is the one in the black hoodie with the white tee sticking out. He came after the fact. There was somebody else that initially pushed him to the ground. The first person was a goofy skater (Might have been Delatorre) that got his board taken away first. As he was trying to take his board back it looked like he either pushed him to the ground or Dan might have fell from letting go of the board. Then Jesse came out of nowhere to punch him as he was getting up but kinda looked like he missed.

The court will so DGAF about Jansen grabbing anyone's board that it will make the typical skaters head spin.

They will SO NOT CARE.

(That not a dig at you in case it looked like it. I know you're just trying to give a blow-by-blow)

But yeah, any kid who thinks it's fair-game if a guard grabs your bag or board is going to get a freezing cold bucket of ice-water dumped on their head when all is said and done (possibly).

[full of jerks]

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DGKalis, is Damon Way still paralyzed? It is crazy how fragile we can be while Jaws and Heath show how tough we can be. These are all horrible stories but I try not to judge too hard. Most everyone has been in a fight here or there and you don't expect them to end this badly. I think a Pal or 2 might have some experiences like this. Hope the Pals are not on Jesse V's jury.

[close]

Yeah. He's been for years. Ever since I've known him.. and thats been 20+ years.

Don't want to derail, but are you mixing up who you are thinking of?  He can still skate, use a computer etc.

[CraneStyle]

My take on the uncut video, not looking good though...

THIS VIDEO IS PURE SPECULATION AND SHOULD NOT BE TAKEN AS FACT

https://www.liveleak.com/view?t=lYzA_1546919390

[Fifty8mm]

Sucks somebody got hurt like that over skateboarding. Seems like kids like these only step up to people who they see as weak or when they're in big groups.
Case in point Alex Olson. I can't remember what video, but he goes crazy on an older, nerdy looking man. Screams at him and throws his shit to the ground. But on his Nine Club he talks about that cholo tweaker looking guy and how he was screaming at them over an alarm or some shit. He didn't do shit about that guy though. He also said the cholo told him to shut the fuck up and he obliged like a bitch.

Also the irony of Kelch comment in Mckenzie's IG post. Not that I don't believe this dudes should get time, they should, they fucked up. But Kelch used to rob kids and fuck up people all the time.

[BacksideWallride]

seeing the GX raw footage would tell us:

-what led up to the incident
-what words were exchanged
-who all was there and which ones were the actual assaulters
-whether he was hit with a fist or a skateboard
-whether he hit his head on the ground
-the immediate aftermath


Black Rock has been skated for 25+ years(especially the last few) and it said he has been a security guard there for 10 years -- surely he was a known entity

That raw footage is deleted and the hard drive thrown in the ocean. You think he's holding that with how serious this is?

[thebaggy]

I have gotten shit for this and a few days ago I saw security video footage that showed the guard making the first attack

I feel the need to clarify what I see as a common misunderstanding. The security role is to guard ( defend ) the property with which your assigned to. If, in doing so, a person (or group of people) physically prevent you from doing so ( moving your barriers ) in an aggressive manner you are legally justified to reflect that level of aggression via the use of force continuum. If you are alone and are working against an assumed group of 7 ( because they were all working in unison as skateboarders ) you are typically justified in making the first "attack" because it's being done defensively by virtue of your role and the circumstances, in this case.

[fongool]

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seeing the GX raw footage would tell us:

-what led up to the incident
-what words were exchanged
-who all was there and which ones were the actual assaulters
-whether he was hit with a fist or a skateboard
-whether he hit his head on the ground
-the immediate aftermath


Black Rock has been skated for 25+ years(especially the last few) and it said he has been a security guard there for 10 years -- surely he was a known entity

[close]

That raw footage is deleted and the hard drive thrown in the ocean. You think he's holding that with how serious this is?

his defense attorney has referenced it multiple times claiming it exonerates him and intends to submit it as evidence

[DannyDee]

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seeing the GX raw footage would tell us:

-what led up to the incident
-what words were exchanged
-who all was there and which ones were the actual assaulters
-whether he was hit with a fist or a skateboard
-whether he hit his head on the ground
-the immediate aftermath


Black Rock has been skated for 25+ years(especially the last few) and it said he has been a security guard there for 10 years -- surely he was a known entity

[close]

That raw footage is deleted and the hard drive thrown in the ocean. You think he's holding that with how serious this is?

I'm pretty sure the defence lawyer has it. And, if he did as you said, he'll probably catch an obstruction charge.

[Style Police]

The uncut video kinda gives you a better perspective of the whole thing:

I'm assuming Jesse is the one in the black hoodie with the white tee sticking out. He came after the fact. There was somebody else that initially pushed him to the ground. The first person was a goofy skater (Might have been Delatorre) that got his board taken away first. As he was trying to take his board back it looked like he either pushed him to the ground or Dan might have fell from letting go of the board. Then Jesse came out of nowhere to punch him as he was getting up but kinda looked like he missed. Dan then came right at him to grab him and Jesse's first reaction is to swing his board toward his head. Dan still has a hold on Jesse and Jesse then either shoves or punches himself off of him. That's when he falls then hits his head on the floor and is out cold. I wish i could see the rest, according to somebody here they mentioned that someone stayed behind to call for help. If that's the case id like to see that unless all they did was run away.

Pretty sure the board cracks the security guy in the head. Looks like an unfortunate sequence of events either way in the heat of the moment. Jesse (who assume swung the board) will have plenty of time to think about his actions.

[nasalcrilltobackpaddle]

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The uncut video kinda gives you a better perspective of the whole thing:

I'm assuming Jesse is the one in the black hoodie with the white tee sticking out. He came after the fact. There was somebody else that initially pushed him to the ground. The first person was a goofy skater (Might have been Delatorre) that got his board taken away first. As he was trying to take his board back it looked like he either pushed him to the ground or Dan might have fell from letting go of the board. Then Jesse came out of nowhere to punch him as he was getting up but kinda looked like he missed. Dan then came right at him to grab him and Jesse's first reaction is to swing his board toward his head. Dan still has a hold on Jesse and Jesse then either shoves or punches himself off of him. That's when he falls then hits his head on the floor and is out cold. I wish i could see the rest, according to somebody here they mentioned that someone stayed behind to call for help. If that's the case id like to see that unless all they did was run away.

[close]

Pretty sure the board cracks the security guy in the head. Looks like an unfortunate sequence of events either way in the heat of the moment. Jesse (who assume swung the board) will have plenty of time to think about his actions.

He'll have plenty of time to think about it while he's getting piped down by the snuggle bandits in county

[Kill_Yourself_Now]

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I have gotten shit for this and a few days ago I saw security video footage that showed the guard making the first attack

[close]

I feel the need to clarify what I see as a common misunderstanding. The security role is to guard ( defend ) the property with which your assigned to. If, in doing so, a person (or group of people) physically prevent you from doing so ( moving your barriers ) in an aggressive manner you are legally justified to reflect that level of aggression via the use of force continuum. If you are alone and are working against an assumed group of 7 ( because they were all working in unison as skateboarders ) you are typically justified in making the first "attack" because it's being done defensively by virtue of your role and the circumstances, in this case.

Stop being so brutally honest about this, you’re gonna hurt someone’s feelings with those kind of hard truths.  No jury is going to side with the skaters over this, anyone whose head isn’t in the sand knows how things will go now.

[BacksideWallride]

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seeing the GX raw footage would tell us:

-what led up to the incident
-what words were exchanged
-who all was there and which ones were the actual assaulters
-whether he was hit with a fist or a skateboard
-whether he hit his head on the ground
-the immediate aftermath


Black Rock has been skated for 25+ years(especially the last few) and it said he has been a security guard there for 10 years -- surely he was a known entity

[close]

That raw footage is deleted and the hard drive thrown in the ocean. You think he's holding that with how serious this is?

[close]

his defense attorney has referenced it multiple times claiming it exonerates him and intends to submit it as evidence

Not GX footage but someones cellphone

[Donkey Lips]

My outlook on this has changed unless I see other video evidence showing the guard making the first attempt at a physical attack on someone else.

Thanks to those of you on here who responded to my views with insight instead of hate or claiming I had some motive for how I was seeing things. I just want to see the evidence before making a decision, which I think is pretty logical.

Nice to see you changing your stance on it with further evidence, but please don't pretend like you didn't come on here playing the what-if game when you assumed how the guard approached the skateboarders. You attempted to show the guard as the aggressor with the "if he had worked there for 10 years dealing with skateboarders, do you really think he would've been calm and cool" bullshit. You absolutely had a motive.

[cherry]

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I have gotten shit for this and a few days ago I saw security video footage that showed the guard making the first attack

[close]

I feel the need to clarify what I see as a common misunderstanding. The security role is to guard ( defend ) the property with which your assigned to. If, in doing so, a person (or group of people) physically prevent you from doing so ( moving your barriers ) in an aggressive manner you are legally justified to reflect that level of aggression via the use of force continuum. If you are alone and are working against an assumed group of 7 ( because they were all working in unison as skateboarders ) you are typically justified in making the first "attack" because it's being done defensively by virtue of your role and the circumstances, in this case.

Absent the security officer’s lawful determination that a citizen arrest is warranted for an observation of a felony or breach of the peace in his or her presence, no physical action is authorized.

 if the security guard made first physical contact then their lawyer could argue self defense but apparently the unedited video shows skaters pushing him first to get their board.

verbal non-compliance only warrants soft touch(garner vs Tennessee) I had thought he told them to leave, they wouldn’t, they moved barriers and he made first physical contact.

Haven’t watched the un edited video and don’t want to it’s the court decision. If they pushed him and ran at him then he def was in the clear to use force....

[art hellman]

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seeing the GX raw footage would tell us:

-what led up to the incident
-what words were exchanged
-who all was there and which ones were the actual assaulters
-whether he was hit with a fist or a skateboard
-whether he hit his head on the ground
-the immediate aftermath


Black Rock has been skated for 25+ years(especially the last few) and it said he has been a security guard there for 10 years -- surely he was a known entity

[close]

That raw footage is deleted and the hard drive thrown in the ocean. You think he's holding that with how serious this is?

[close]

his defense attorney has referenced it multiple times claiming it exonerates him and intends to submit it as evidence

where are you getting this information re: the defense attorney? 

[tkp]

Nice to see you changing your stance on it with further evidence, but please don't pretend like you didn't come on here playing the what-if game when you assumed how the guard approached the skateboarders. You attempted to show the guard as the aggressor with the "if he had worked there for 10 years dealing with skateboarders, do you really think he would've been calm and cool" bullshit. You absolutely had a motive.

I should have clarified my motive comment as it was more towards the person who said I was posting on here to promote / attempt to revive a brand, which is not the case.

When I look at how you and others will interpret it, I agree with your conclusion and apologize for not clarifying it. In that case yes, I had a motive to present the side that maybe the guard had a role in the escalation.

Looking back at following this, I've learned to not make any assumptions until presented full evidence because everyone has different experiences in life and will pull off of those situations to form a judgement about the parties involved in an incident.

I hope people on all sides of the issue are looking at this to prevent it from happening again.

[fongool]

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seeing the GX raw footage would tell us:

-what led up to the incident
-what words were exchanged
-who all was there and which ones were the actual assaulters
-whether he was hit with a fist or a skateboard
-whether he hit his head on the ground
-the immediate aftermath


Black Rock has been skated for 25+ years(especially the last few) and it said he has been a security guard there for 10 years -- surely he was a known entity

[close]

That raw footage is deleted and the hard drive thrown in the ocean. You think he's holding that with how serious this is?

[close]

his defense attorney has referenced it multiple times claiming it exonerates him and intends to submit it as evidence

[close]

where are you getting this information re: the defense attorney?

https://www.sfchronicle.com/crime/article/Security-guard-left-with-brain-injury-after-fight-13509942.php

"But Doug Rappaport, Vieira’s defense attorney, said in court Friday that he has evidence that proves his client was defending himself in the incident.

Video taken by a skateboarder from inside the fracas, he said, shows another man initially striking Jansen, who fell to the ground. Jansen then got up and started throwing punches at Vieira, Rappaport said.

Vieira defended himself, first swinging his skateboard toward Jansen before the two exchanged punches and Jansen fell to the ground unconscious, Rappaport said.

“Jesse was only defending himself here,” he said. “The security guard fell to the ground and hit his head,” he said. “It’s tragic for everybody. But for the second video, an innocent kid would be doing a lot of time.”"

He's essentially saying someone else in the crew hit the security guard first.

[Jim and Dan]

Holy shit, Jesse Vieira is so fucked! He'll be going to jail for a couple of years...

No bail? Christ, they give bail to murderers & child-molesters for christ-sakes, that's some serious shit.

Don't fucking hit people with skateboards in today's hyper-vigilant law enforcement day-&-age, didn't he ever watch 'Kids'? I mean, did they really fear for their lives? Punch him with your fucking hands & avoid serious assault charges, unless Jesse is a 5th degree blackbelt & his hands are registered lethal weapons; in that case it doesn't matter. 

[feedmeseymour]

quotes from a post on that security guard forum.

If I was the guard, I'd do the required minimum like post a sign, then kick back and enjoy the show, and maybe HOPE a skater falls and cracks his head open. Film it for MY YouTube $$$. Figure out a way for an air-horn to blast or blinding light to happen, just as they enter a tricky stunt.

https://youtu.be/H6DqWP733F4?t=38

If the skateboarders are regulars at the post after biz hours, invite over a few Pitbull owners of a certain demographic, of which their are many in 'Frisco.

Another angle, which would be tricky but could be powerful, is enlist a chick with a camera to get the "professional skater"s name and address, then sue him for "damages" to the property

[Jerkstore]

An interesting aspect of the story is that they took him to ER at General Hospital, which has a policy that states they don't accept any type of medical insurance (but that shit ain't free). This allows them to charge whatever they want for services, without being constrained by pre-negotiated deals between insurers and the hospital. This likely made the bill be orders of magnitude higher than it needed to be.

Jesus, no wonder people jump out of ambulances

[DCLOVE]

Damn I forgot about this thread till someone mentioned the delatorre thing in the Louie thread. It really did turn out to be GX. That’s crazy. This whole thing sad.

[weregoingunion]

a tragic

[potpie]

The uncut video kinda gives you a better perspective of the whole thing:

I'm assuming Jesse is the one in the black hoodie with the white tee sticking out. He came after the fact. There was somebody else that initially pushed him to the ground. The first person was a goofy skater (Might have been Delatorre) that got his board taken away first. As he was trying to take his board back it looked like he either pushed him to the ground or Dan might have fell from letting go of the board. Then Jesse came out of nowhere to punch him as he was getting up but kinda looked like he missed. Dan then came right at him to grab him and Jesse's first reaction is to swing his board toward his head. Dan still has a hold on Jesse and Jesse then either shoves or punches himself off of him. That's when he falls then hits his head on the floor and is out cold. I wish i could see the rest, according to somebody here they mentioned that someone stayed behind to call for help. If that's the case id like to see that unless all they did was run away.

it looks like whoever shoves him reaches down and picks their board off the ground to dan's right side

[DannyDee]

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An interesting aspect of the story is that they took him to ER at General Hospital, which has a policy that states they don't accept any type of medical insurance (but that shit ain't free). This allows them to charge whatever they want for services, without being constrained by pre-negotiated deals between insurers and the hospital. This likely made the bill be orders of magnitude higher than it needed to be.

[close]

Jesus, no wonder people jump out of ambulances

I always find that shit fucked. Like, when you hear of school shootings, and they pledge to cover the medical bills. Like, what the fuck, the person gets shot and now is in crippling debt unless charities step in?