Author Topic: Wheels Thread  (Read 777641 times)

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tzhangdox

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Re: Wheels Thread
« Reply #4950 on: May 12, 2022, 03:31:36 PM »
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How are they for nose/tail/blunt/noseblunt slides on ledges compared to f4 99a?

I found the f4 97as to be great on rough concrete ledges but on metal coping they definitely stuck more
[close]

Haven't been able to skate anywhere with something to grind yet (and I can't blunt anyways, lol).

I've skated the F4 97a a ton, and those are definitely a bit more "sticky" than these. Its hard to estimate how they will grind based on sliding on road surfaces... if I had to GUESS, I bet the SSF 97a slide better compared to F4 97a (just a hunch). The SSF 95a also slide on the ground better than F4 97a for what its worth. Someone else would have to chime in for blunts.

I could see it being something weird with this formula like they bluntslide well with speed (if you are going fast enough for them to "vibrate") but maybe really stick at lower speeds. But I am talking COMPLETELY out of my ass.

Sorry I couldn't help.

No worries thank you anyway. Sounds like it should be fine

FuzzGNU

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Re: Wheels Thread
« Reply #4951 on: May 12, 2022, 06:01:37 PM »
Zach Doelling skating the new 95a bones:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=28_A_7Zap5I

He confirms it in the comments

Sounds like he is having some issues with nose/tail slides from what he is saying... its expected with this durometer... but its hard to say if its any better or worse than other wheels in that durometer range.
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minilogoflow

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Re: Wheels Thread
« Reply #4952 on: May 12, 2022, 09:42:38 PM »
Got to try the new Bones/PP formula in 95a (I'll call it SSF). I definitely like these more than the 97a (which were too hard for me).

In terms of what they feel like:
SSF 97a = ~103a
SSF 95a  = ~101a
SSF 93a = ???? (guessing they will feel like 98-99a?)
SSF 90a = ???? (guessing they will feel like 95-96a?)

The SSF 95a are definitely slightly harder than F4 99a. The 95a is where it starts to become a bit more versatile for skating streets (unlike the 97a in my opinion). If I had to guess, the 93a is probably going to be the wheel that catches on as it will probably feel a lot more like a 99a.

All the good attributes of the 97a still apply to the 95a, except the wheel can handle a bit more crust. Still a very fast wheel on smooth streets. Still powerspins/reverts really nicely (with slightly more grip than the 97a). Super fun revert with a satisfying vibrating "bark" that is really addictive. You have to try them to feel what I'm talking about.

While F4s have the slide we all are familiar with, these new wheels have a more fun vibrating bark to them while reverting that feels smooth while still biting the ground with traction. The powerslide is still a bit hard to initiate though.

My main complaint about the 95a (and 97a) is that while they maintain speed on street SURFACES better than the hard wheels they mimic, they struggle with sidewalk cracks and foreign objects the same as a hard wheel. I think the 95a does a sufficient job with that stuff, but still not quite as good as F4 99a. F4 99a sort of "bounce" up cracks, while these "clack" up them.

I think the SSF 93a will be my wheel personally. I'm so excited to eventually try it. I'm a huge fan of Bones wheels, and I'm glad they are finally making some decent wheels again that are under 103a.

As an overview of the SSF 95a:

+ Feels exactly like a hard 100-101a wheel
+ Rides smooth streets fast like a hard Bones wheel
+ Maintains speed on rough SURFACES slightly better than a hard wheel
+ Grips better than a hard wheel, but can still powerslide
+ Does not slip out or lose traction during powerslides
+ Has a brilliant spin/revert that feels and sounds amazing
- Vibrates your feet on rough surfaces the same as a 100-101a wheel (again, it feels exactly like a hard durometer)
- Handles cracks/objects (rolling over things) the same as a hard wheel
- Takes more effort to initiate powerslides than I would like

I'm starting to learn to powerslide these a bit better. I feel like you can slide F4 99s and STF 103s with whatever form you want... these feel like you actually have to dig your heels in a bit and maybe widen your stance (proper form, I guess).

But yeah... Generally what I am trying to say is don't be scared off by the durometers that they list for the wheels, because they are essentially inaccurate to what they feel like. Its a bit of a mindfuck for finding the right durometer, but if we can figure out the general consensus on each durometer it will make things easier. I think these wheels will have a good following if they can get the right durometers in the right hands.

----------

OH also **major disclaimer**. The wheels I've been skating have been the Bones ATF shape (with the hard black hub core in the center). The actual release will NOT be hubbed, so they might feel pretty different from what I am describing. No idea if they will make them feel softer or what, but honestly feeling softer would probably benefit the 97a and 95a in my eyes.

Let me know if anyone has any questions about the 95a or 97a.


Have you got any word on if the shapes and sizes in this new line are gonna be the same as the current line up or if they're switching it up. I'd love for some more options in the 56-60mm range from Bones in this new line of wheels. A 58mm V5 in the 95a would be perfect.

layzieyez

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Re: Wheels Thread
« Reply #4953 on: May 13, 2022, 08:49:45 AM »
What if I told you wheels for a skateboard enthusiast is like a fine wine pairing. Some urethane improve vastly over new formulations through aging. Holding onto some for longer results in a mature wheel. But you have to skate them to really make them great. Like stirring a kettle.

Then you put them on your ground powered foot massager and go nuts outside because they feel so good. Collectors who skate know.

Also, some go bad. The savier version of some wheels are sad.

ferraveemo

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Re: Wheels Thread
« Reply #4954 on: May 13, 2022, 10:49:58 AM »
What if I told you wheels for a skateboard enthusiast is like a fine wine pairing. Some urethane improve vastly over new formulations through aging. Holding onto some for longer results in a mature wheel. But you have to skate them to really make them great. Like stirring a kettle.

Then you put them on your ground powered foot massager and go nuts outside because they feel so good. Collectors who skate know.

Also, some go bad. The savier version of some wheels are sad.

I have a set of Non-F4 OG Classics that started out as 60mm's and probably around 58-57'ish by now and they have yellowed and going on 2-2.5 years now. the ride also has gotten better on them as if they've hardened but still goes thru rough roads very smoothly. they also got a much louder bark on slides. it so nice that it's been able to do that and i try to savor them as much. Got another Set on ice!

FuzzGNU

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Re: Wheels Thread
« Reply #4955 on: May 13, 2022, 11:14:35 AM »
Have you got any word on if the shapes and sizes in this new line are gonna be the same as the current line up or if they're switching it up. I'd love for some more options in the 56-60mm range from Bones in this new line of wheels. A 58mm V5 in the 95a would be perfect.

From what I know it will be V1 and V4 shapes. Most likely in the 52-56mm range? Sounds like Powell Peralta branding on the 90a and 93a and Bones branding for the 95a and 97a.

That's literally all I know in terms of that stuff though. I don't even know if any of that stuff is set in stone.
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beandemon

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Re: Wheels Thread
« Reply #4956 on: May 13, 2022, 11:28:52 AM »
Got to try the new Bones/PP formula in 95a (I'll call it SSF). I definitely like these more than the 97a (which were too hard for me).

In terms of what they feel like:
SSF 97a = ~103a
SSF 95a  = ~101a
SSF 93a = ???? (guessing they will feel like 98-99a?)
SSF 90a = ???? (guessing they will feel like 95-96a?)

The SSF 95a are definitely slightly harder than F4 99a. The 95a is where it starts to become a bit more versatile for skating streets (unlike the 97a in my opinion). If I had to guess, the 93a is probably going to be the wheel that catches on as it will probably feel a lot more like a 99a.

All the good attributes of the 97a still apply to the 95a, except the wheel can handle a bit more crust. Still a very fast wheel on smooth streets. Still powerspins/reverts really nicely (with slightly more grip than the 97a). Super fun revert with a satisfying vibrating "bark" that is really addictive. You have to try them to feel what I'm talking about.

While F4s have the slide we all are familiar with, these new wheels have a more fun vibrating bark to them while reverting that feels smooth while still biting the ground with traction. The powerslide is still a bit hard to initiate though.

My main complaint about the 95a (and 97a) is that while they maintain speed on street SURFACES better than the hard wheels they mimic, they struggle with sidewalk cracks and foreign objects the same as a hard wheel. I think the 95a does a sufficient job with that stuff, but still not quite as good as F4 99a. F4 99a sort of "bounce" up cracks, while these "clack" up them.

I think the SSF 93a will be my wheel personally. I'm so excited to eventually try it. I'm a huge fan of Bones wheels, and I'm glad they are finally making some decent wheels again that are under 103a.

As an overview of the SSF 95a:

+ Feels exactly like a hard 100-101a wheel
+ Rides smooth streets fast like a hard Bones wheel
+ Maintains speed on rough SURFACES slightly better than a hard wheel
+ Grips better than a hard wheel, but can still powerslide
+ Does not slip out or lose traction during powerslides
+ Has a brilliant spin/revert that feels and sounds amazing
- Vibrates your feet on rough surfaces the same as a 100-101a wheel (again, it feels exactly like a hard durometer)
- Handles cracks/objects (rolling over things) the same as a hard wheel
- Takes more effort to initiate powerslides than I would like

I'm starting to learn to powerslide these a bit better. I feel like you can slide F4 99s and STF 103s with whatever form you want... these feel like you actually have to dig your heels in a bit and maybe widen your stance (proper form, I guess).

But yeah... Generally what I am trying to say is don't be scared off by the durometers that they list for the wheels, because they are essentially inaccurate to what they feel like. Its a bit of a mindfuck for finding the right durometer, but if we can figure out the general consensus on each durometer it will make things easier. I think these wheels will have a good following if they can get the right durometers in the right hands.

----------

OH also **major disclaimer**. The wheels I've been skating have been the Bones ATF shape (with the hard black hub core in the center). The actual release will NOT be hubbed, so they might feel pretty different from what I am describing. No idea if they will make them feel softer or what, but honestly feeling softer would probably benefit the 97a and 95a in my eyes.

Let me know if anyone has any questions about the 95a or 97a.

Oof.  Cores are a wild card. I’d totally love a cored wheel - like the rough rider shape with conical edges- but it definitely affects the feel. I think vibrations and feeling cracks could likely be due as much to the cores as the formula, and they may be even harder to powerslide without a core.

Murge

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Re: Wheels Thread
« Reply #4957 on: May 13, 2022, 11:56:31 AM »
Why get a 95a wheel if it feels and acts like a 99a?
Why skate a 97a if it’s basically a 101a?

What am I missing? Because it just sounds like the same shit but the duro number will change wrote on the wheel but will act the same.

FuzzGNU

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Re: Wheels Thread
« Reply #4958 on: May 13, 2022, 01:16:13 PM »
Why get a 95a wheel if it feels and acts like a 99a?
Why skate a 97a if it’s basically a 101a?

What am I missing? Because it just sounds like the same shit but the duro number will change wrote on the wheel but will act the same.

Its a subtle difference, for sure. It maintains speed on rough surfaces better than the duro it feels like.

So if it feels like a 101a wheel, when you hit those shitty streets it will still FEEL like a 101a wheel... BUT your speed won't grind to a halt like a 101a wheel.

So again, I was testing these on a really shitty street doing a 1:1 comparison between F4 99a and these new wheels. The road "feels" better on the F4 99a (because it absorbs the vibration better), but I was slowing down very quickly. I've got to push my ass off to get down the street. Meanwhile, the really hard SSF 97a wheels were vibrating like crazy. Despite being the type of road that turns your feet numb on 103a wheels... I wasn't grinding to a halt. I was able to push down the street easier than the F4 99. While tactile-wise it was unpleasant, the speed it was maintaining was better than the F4 99a.

In addition to that, these wheels killed the F4 99a on smooth streets. They felt like 103a wheels in terms of speed on smoother terrain.

Personally, the 97a were too hard for me, and the 95a are just on the brink of too hard for me... but my guess is the 93a is possibly going to be the F4 99a competitor, and the 90a might be on the brink between cruiser/trick wheel? No idea.
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braksabbath

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Re: Wheels Thread
« Reply #4959 on: May 13, 2022, 01:32:24 PM »
Interested in hearing how they are on slippery wood/skatelite

layzieyez

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Re: Wheels Thread
« Reply #4960 on: May 13, 2022, 01:55:39 PM »
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What if I told you wheels for a skateboard enthusiast is like a fine wine pairing. Some urethane improve vastly over new formulations through aging. Holding onto some for longer results in a mature wheel. But you have to skate them to really make them great. Like stirring a kettle.

Then you put them on your ground powered foot massager and go nuts outside because they feel so good. Collectors who skate know.

Also, some go bad. The savier version of some wheels are sad.
[close]

I have a set of Non-F4 OG Classics that started out as 60mm's and probably around 58-57'ish by now and they have yellowed and going on 2-2.5 years now. the ride also has gotten better on them as if they've hardened but still goes thru rough roads very smoothly. they also got a much louder bark on slides. it so nice that it's been able to do that and i try to savor them as much. Got another Set on ice!
That's rad you have another set.

I had some Cardiels that sound like those wheels. When they started to look potato and yellowed a bit, they were the best non f4 spitfires I had skated. Started at 60mm, too.

Murge

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Re: Wheels Thread
« Reply #4961 on: May 14, 2022, 05:16:55 AM »
@FuzzGNU oh okay I get it now. Thank you for explaining. Really curious about the 93a now but 95a don’t sound bad at all

FuzzGNU

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Re: Wheels Thread
« Reply #4962 on: May 18, 2022, 08:46:10 PM »
Finally got to try the Bones/PP 95a in a slippery blacktop parking lot. Its a parking lot I've slipped out on F4 99a many times before.

Seemed to handle it better than my F4 99a. Grips a bit better in that regard. I didn't put it to any major tests like really powersliding hard, but for going around pretty fast and taking medium turns I wasn't having any problems. I had to leave fairly quickly so no major testing.

I do have to reiterate though, these things really struggle with pebbles more than F4 99a. I've gotten thrown forward off my board several times on these things. Again, its like a 101a wheel. I'm sure the softer duros are probably more suited for the areas I skate.

I actually should be getting my hands on some 90a and 93a soon. I'm really hoping those are a bit more of ATV wheels. I've been enjoying the formula aside from them being overly hard, so I've got high hopes for the 93a... but I have no idea what to expect from the 90a. I wonder if that's where the wheels start to feel a bit bouncy/cruisery.
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yep yep

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Re: Wheels Thread
« Reply #4963 on: May 19, 2022, 10:13:54 AM »
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They are the AG, best I know.  From the Still Life series which I'm almost positive are AG. I do wish their wheels were labeled a little more clearly. Also just spent like 20 minutes rolling around earlier and they're gooooood.
[close]

You are correct, tho I've seen some still life wheels labeled as OG, so I've held off. FFS print AG/OG on the wheel so we know what we're getting...smi
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They are the AG, best I know.  From the Still Life series which I'm almost positive are AG. I do wish their wheels were labeled a little more clearly. Also just spent like 20 minutes rolling around earlier and they're gooooood.
[close]

 

If it wasn't for a post from ages back about AG being (Austin G's) need for an OG spit feel, I'd have never known what the real difference is.
[close]

We appreciate the support and feedback. The card stock in the back of the packaging is different for OG and AG. The AG has a quote from Austyn himself. That being said we should do a better job of identifying what they are and are looking into maybe a little round sticker with AG and OG so it's more clear.
[close]

Looks like my set are OG them... Mine just had the "these wheels don't suck" card.  Oh well.
From what I've heard the OG's feel line Bones/ old Darkstar and the AG's feel like Spits. I'm riding some OG's and love them!

goodatmeth

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Re: Wheels Thread
« Reply #4964 on: May 19, 2022, 02:17:22 PM »
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They are the AG, best I know.  From the Still Life series which I'm almost positive are AG. I do wish their wheels were labeled a little more clearly. Also just spent like 20 minutes rolling around earlier and they're gooooood.
[close]

You are correct, tho I've seen some still life wheels labeled as OG, so I've held off. FFS print AG/OG on the wheel so we know what we're getting...smi
Expand Quote
They are the AG, best I know.  From the Still Life series which I'm almost positive are AG. I do wish their wheels were labeled a little more clearly. Also just spent like 20 minutes rolling around earlier and they're gooooood.
[close]

 

If it wasn't for a post from ages back about AG being (Austin G's) need for an OG spit feel, I'd have never known what the real difference is.
[close]

We appreciate the support and feedback. The card stock in the back of the packaging is different for OG and AG. The AG has a quote from Austyn himself. That being said we should do a better job of identifying what they are and are looking into maybe a little round sticker with AG and OG so it's more clear.
[close]

Looks like my set are OG them... Mine just had the "these wheels don't suck" card.  Oh well.
[close]
From what I've heard the OG's feel line Bones/ old Darkstar and the AG's feel like Spits. I'm riding some OG's and love them!

Could you or anybody give some examples what that really means? In the catalog it basically says:

OG: High quality, High rebound
AG: Less rebound, maximum slide. (Not high quality? lol)

I'm no wheel expert and I'm not even sure what rebound even really means in this case.

chris.

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Re: Wheels Thread
« Reply #4965 on: May 19, 2022, 07:23:29 PM »
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They are the AG, best I know.  From the Still Life series which I'm almost positive are AG. I do wish their wheels were labeled a little more clearly. Also just spent like 20 minutes rolling around earlier and they're gooooood.
[close]

You are correct, tho I've seen some still life wheels labeled as OG, so I've held off. FFS print AG/OG on the wheel so we know what we're getting...smi
Expand Quote
They are the AG, best I know.  From the Still Life series which I'm almost positive are AG. I do wish their wheels were labeled a little more clearly. Also just spent like 20 minutes rolling around earlier and they're gooooood.
[close]

 

If it wasn't for a post from ages back about AG being (Austin G's) need for an OG spit feel, I'd have never known what the real difference is.
[close]

We appreciate the support and feedback. The card stock in the back of the packaging is different for OG and AG. The AG has a quote from Austyn himself. That being said we should do a better job of identifying what they are and are looking into maybe a little round sticker with AG and OG so it's more clear.
[close]

Looks like my set are OG them... Mine just had the "these wheels don't suck" card.  Oh well.
[close]
From what I've heard the OG's feel line Bones/ old Darkstar and the AG's feel like Spits. I'm riding some OG's and love them!

I've put in some time on my "thought they were AG but probably are OG" SMLs now and I really dig them!  Happy with the wheels, and not missing F4s.

Ronnie Rodriguez

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Re: Wheels Thread
« Reply #4966 on: May 20, 2022, 07:25:58 AM »
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They are the AG, best I know.  From the Still Life series which I'm almost positive are AG. I do wish their wheels were labeled a little more clearly. Also just spent like 20 minutes rolling around earlier and they're gooooood.
[close]

You are correct, tho I've seen some still life wheels labeled as OG, so I've held off. FFS print AG/OG on the wheel so we know what we're getting...smi
Expand Quote
They are the AG, best I know.  From the Still Life series which I'm almost positive are AG. I do wish their wheels were labeled a little more clearly. Also just spent like 20 minutes rolling around earlier and they're gooooood.
[close]

 

If it wasn't for a post from ages back about AG being (Austin G's) need for an OG spit feel, I'd have never known what the real difference is.
[close]

We appreciate the support and feedback. The card stock in the back of the packaging is different for OG and AG. The AG has a quote from Austyn himself. That being said we should do a better job of identifying what they are and are looking into maybe a little round sticker with AG and OG so it's more clear.
[close]

Looks like my set are OG them... Mine just had the "these wheels don't suck" card.  Oh well.
[close]
From what I've heard the OG's feel line Bones/ old Darkstar and the AG's feel like Spits. I'm riding some OG's and love them!
[close]

Could you or anybody give some examples what that really means? In the catalog it basically says:

OG: High quality, High rebound
AG: Less rebound, maximum slide. (Not high quality? lol)

I'm no wheel expert and I'm not even sure what rebound even really means in this case.

Higher rebound means that when the urethane deforms, it returns to shape more quickly. The wheel has less give but is also less likely to flatspot.

The OGs are poured at Aend, who made Darkstar back when Darkstar was a legit and reputable wheel company. They're 99a, but due to the higher rebound formula they're harder to break into a slide (but are more flat spot resistant). The AGs are poured at Creative, who make Dialtone, Satori, Speedlab, Boardycakes, and a bunch of other small brands. They are more forgiving and have a better slide, but have more flatspot potential. For my money, they feel very similar to the classic Spitfire formula.

@Cliff has posted as much on here, but I can't find the quote. Sorry if I got anything wrong!

cliff

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Re: Wheels Thread
« Reply #4967 on: May 20, 2022, 09:42:25 AM »
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They are the AG, best I know.  From the Still Life series which I'm almost positive are AG. I do wish their wheels were labeled a little more clearly. Also just spent like 20 minutes rolling around earlier and they're gooooood.
[close]

You are correct, tho I've seen some still life wheels labeled as OG, so I've held off. FFS print AG/OG on the wheel so we know what we're getting...smi
Expand Quote
They are the AG, best I know.  From the Still Life series which I'm almost positive are AG. I do wish their wheels were labeled a little more clearly. Also just spent like 20 minutes rolling around earlier and they're gooooood.
[close]

 

If it wasn't for a post from ages back about AG being (Austin G's) need for an OG spit feel, I'd have never known what the real difference is.
[close]

We appreciate the support and feedback. The card stock in the back of the packaging is different for OG and AG. The AG has a quote from Austyn himself. That being said we should do a better job of identifying what they are and are looking into maybe a little round sticker with AG and OG so it's more clear.
[close]

Looks like my set are OG them... Mine just had the "these wheels don't suck" card.  Oh well.
[close]
From what I've heard the OG's feel line Bones/ old Darkstar and the AG's feel like Spits. I'm riding some OG's and love them!
[close]

Could you or anybody give some examples what that really means? In the catalog it basically says:

OG: High quality, High rebound
AG: Less rebound, maximum slide. (Not high quality? lol)

I'm no wheel expert and I'm not even sure what rebound even really means in this case.
[close]

Higher rebound means that when the urethane deforms, it returns to shape more quickly. The wheel has less give but is also less likely to flatspot.

The OGs are poured at Aend, who made Darkstar back when Darkstar was a legit and reputable wheel company. They're 99a, but due to the higher rebound formula they're harder to break into a slide (but are more flat spot resistant). The AGs are poured at Creative, who make Dialtone, Satori, Speedlab, Boardycakes, and a bunch of other small brands. They are more forgiving and have a better slide, but have more flatspot potential. For my money, they feel very similar to the classic Spitfire formula.

@cliff has posted as much on here, but I can't find the quote. Sorry if I got anything wrong!

This is 100% a spot on breakdown of our wheel formulas.

When I rode for Darkstar Wheels I loved the Duel Duros and we're hard to flat spot. When They started making boards I had to dip. Went to Bones and the STF's were the closes thing to the Darkstar's. After I got the boot from Bones I skated Spitfire classics and would flat spot them pretty easy in my heavy blunt slide days.

When we started Sml. I wanted high quality so we went with Aend (they're not the exact Darkstar formula but close). Eventually Austyn just wanted the Creative formula and thus the AG formula was born. 

Ronnie Rodriguez

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Re: Wheels Thread
« Reply #4968 on: May 20, 2022, 09:56:58 AM »
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They are the AG, best I know.  From the Still Life series which I'm almost positive are AG. I do wish their wheels were labeled a little more clearly. Also just spent like 20 minutes rolling around earlier and they're gooooood.
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You are correct, tho I've seen some still life wheels labeled as OG, so I've held off. FFS print AG/OG on the wheel so we know what we're getting...smi
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They are the AG, best I know.  From the Still Life series which I'm almost positive are AG. I do wish their wheels were labeled a little more clearly. Also just spent like 20 minutes rolling around earlier and they're gooooood.
[close]

 

If it wasn't for a post from ages back about AG being (Austin G's) need for an OG spit feel, I'd have never known what the real difference is.
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We appreciate the support and feedback. The card stock in the back of the packaging is different for OG and AG. The AG has a quote from Austyn himself. That being said we should do a better job of identifying what they are and are looking into maybe a little round sticker with AG and OG so it's more clear.
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Looks like my set are OG them... Mine just had the "these wheels don't suck" card.  Oh well.
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From what I've heard the OG's feel line Bones/ old Darkstar and the AG's feel like Spits. I'm riding some OG's and love them!
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Could you or anybody give some examples what that really means? In the catalog it basically says:

OG: High quality, High rebound
AG: Less rebound, maximum slide. (Not high quality? lol)

I'm no wheel expert and I'm not even sure what rebound even really means in this case.
[close]

Higher rebound means that when the urethane deforms, it returns to shape more quickly. The wheel has less give but is also less likely to flatspot.

The OGs are poured at Aend, who made Darkstar back when Darkstar was a legit and reputable wheel company. They're 99a, but due to the higher rebound formula they're harder to break into a slide (but are more flat spot resistant). The AGs are poured at Creative, who make Dialtone, Satori, Speedlab, Boardycakes, and a bunch of other small brands. They are more forgiving and have a better slide, but have more flatspot potential. For my money, they feel very similar to the classic Spitfire formula.

@cliff has posted as much on here, but I can't find the quote. Sorry if I got anything wrong!
[close]

This is 100% a spot on breakdown of our wheel formulas.

When I rode for Darkstar Wheels I loved the Duel Duros and we're hard to flat spot. When They started making boards I had to dip. Went to Bones and the STF's were the closes thing to the Darkstar's. After I got the boot from Bones I skated Spitfire classics and would flat spot them pretty easy in my heavy blunt slide days.

When we started Sml. I wanted high quality so we went with Aend (they're not the exact Darkstar formula but close). Eventually Austyn just wanted the Creative formula and thus the AG formula was born.

You're a national treasure. Should have asked above but always wanted to know: who pours the 92a cruiser wheels?Haven't tried them yet but have been tempted as of late.

cliff

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Re: Wheels Thread
« Reply #4969 on: May 20, 2022, 11:17:09 AM »
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They are the AG, best I know.  From the Still Life series which I'm almost positive are AG. I do wish their wheels were labeled a little more clearly. Also just spent like 20 minutes rolling around earlier and they're gooooood.
[close]

You are correct, tho I've seen some still life wheels labeled as OG, so I've held off. FFS print AG/OG on the wheel so we know what we're getting...smi
Expand Quote
They are the AG, best I know.  From the Still Life series which I'm almost positive are AG. I do wish their wheels were labeled a little more clearly. Also just spent like 20 minutes rolling around earlier and they're gooooood.
[close]

 

If it wasn't for a post from ages back about AG being (Austin G's) need for an OG spit feel, I'd have never known what the real difference is.
[close]

We appreciate the support and feedback. The card stock in the back of the packaging is different for OG and AG. The AG has a quote from Austyn himself. That being said we should do a better job of identifying what they are and are looking into maybe a little round sticker with AG and OG so it's more clear.
[close]

Looks like my set are OG them... Mine just had the "these wheels don't suck" card.  Oh well.
[close]
From what I've heard the OG's feel line Bones/ old Darkstar and the AG's feel like Spits. I'm riding some OG's and love them!
[close]

Could you or anybody give some examples what that really means? In the catalog it basically says:

OG: High quality, High rebound
AG: Less rebound, maximum slide. (Not high quality? lol)

I'm no wheel expert and I'm not even sure what rebound even really means in this case.
[close]

Higher rebound means that when the urethane deforms, it returns to shape more quickly. The wheel has less give but is also less likely to flatspot.

The OGs are poured at Aend, who made Darkstar back when Darkstar was a legit and reputable wheel company. They're 99a, but due to the higher rebound formula they're harder to break into a slide (but are more flat spot resistant). The AGs are poured at Creative, who make Dialtone, Satori, Speedlab, Boardycakes, and a bunch of other small brands. They are more forgiving and have a better slide, but have more flatspot potential. For my money, they feel very similar to the classic Spitfire formula.

@cliff has posted as much on here, but I can't find the quote. Sorry if I got anything wrong!
[close]

This is 100% a spot on breakdown of our wheel formulas.

When I rode for Darkstar Wheels I loved the Duel Duros and we're hard to flat spot. When They started making boards I had to dip. Went to Bones and the STF's were the closes thing to the Darkstar's. After I got the boot from Bones I skated Spitfire classics and would flat spot them pretty easy in my heavy blunt slide days.

When we started Sml. I wanted high quality so we went with Aend (they're not the exact Darkstar formula but close). Eventually Austyn just wanted the Creative formula and thus the AG formula was born.
[close]

You're a national treasure. Should have asked above but always wanted to know: who pours the 92a cruiser wheels?Haven't tried them yet but have been tempted as of late.

Thanks but I'm just a guy who loves this shit ha!

All cruisers are Aend urethane. They make a great cruiser and we've experimented a bit. 

texasplant

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Re: Wheels Thread
« Reply #4970 on: May 21, 2022, 01:45:26 AM »
What are the smallest, but widest wheels on the market? I just put on a friends old wheels for a bit of fun - Conical Fulls that are about 46mm and I didn’t realise how much I would love it. I know the boardycakes are out there but I kinda want to stay around 50ish because I still skate a lot of transition. Started in the mid 2000s but loving the early 90s setup with a football and ventures.

edit: I somehow missed the spitfire “lil smokies”. 50mm Conical Full. Please disregard the above (or not)
« Last Edit: May 21, 2022, 02:55:38 AM by texasplant »

Mbrimson88

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Re: Wheels Thread
« Reply #4971 on: May 21, 2022, 05:41:13 AM »
What are the smallest, but widest wheels on the market? I just put on a friends old wheels for a bit of fun - Conical Fulls that are about 46mm and I didn’t realise how much I would love it. I know the boardycakes are out there but I kinda want to stay around 50ish because I still skate a lot of transition. Started in the mid 2000s but loving the early 90s setup with a football and ventures.

edit: I somehow missed the spitfire “lil smokies”. 50mm Conical Full. Please disregard the above (or not)


Even the Lil Smokies are proportionate, as in the smaller the diameter, the more narrow the width too, I think the 50mm are only 30 or 31 at most wide, so checking with local skate shops (in their left overs bin) or trying to deal with friends or others who have old worn down wider wheels might be a lot easier to get what you want.

That said I think besides Boardy Cakes, Prize Fighter Cutlery was another one that had small but wide wheels.  The three current options on their site were not that wide though.

I have a lot of smaller wider wheels, mainly Spitfire Conical Full 54mm 99 duro when new and am happy to share (in Brisbane, Australia) but there are so many people tossing good but small wheels all the time, if you are in the right place at the right time.


Just a sample:


https://www.instagram.com/p/CNzJryDlHbb/

I talk too much about skateboards.  Sorry.

texasplant

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Re: Wheels Thread
« Reply #4972 on: May 21, 2022, 06:04:08 AM »
Expand Quote
What are the smallest, but widest wheels on the market? I just put on a friends old wheels for a bit of fun - Conical Fulls that are about 46mm and I didn’t realise how much I would love it. I know the boardycakes are out there but I kinda want to stay around 50ish because I still skate a lot of transition. Started in the mid 2000s but loving the early 90s setup with a football and ventures.

edit: I somehow missed the spitfire “lil smokies”. 50mm Conical Full. Please disregard the above (or not)
[close]


Even the Lil Smokies are proportionate, as in the smaller the diameter, the more narrow the width too, I think the 50mm are only 30 or 31 at most wide, so checking with local skate shops (in their left overs bin) or trying to deal with friends or others who have old worn down wider wheels might be a lot easier to get what you want.

That said I think besides Boardy Cakes, Prize Fighter Cutlery was another one that had small but wide wheels.  The three current options on their site were not that wide though.

I have a lot of smaller wider wheels, mainly Spitfire Conical Full 54mm 99 duro when new and am happy to share (in Brisbane, Australia) but there are so many people tossing good but small wheels all the time, if you are in the right place at the right time.


Just a sample:


https://www.instagram.com/p/CNzJryDlHbb/

Thanks for the suggestions, they all look great… unfortunately I jumped the gun on the spitfires and bought them anyways. that tiny bit of width difference is okay, I’m moreso worried about having conical sides so it’ll keep me happy. The second hand ones I’m skating now just aren’t quite big enough to lock nicely on transition

Mbrimson88

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Re: Wheels Thread
« Reply #4973 on: May 21, 2022, 06:14:20 AM »

Thanks for the suggestions, they all look great… unfortunately I jumped the gun on the spitfires and bought them anyways. that tiny bit of width difference is okay, I’m moreso worried about having conical sides so it’ll keep me happy. The second hand ones I’m skating now just aren’t quite big enough to lock nicely on transition


New wheels always feel nicer anyway.

I get you too with the lock in on transition.  I find newer wheels (or those machined ones in the middle board of that last lot) that are more rounded on the edge, no matter how wide, definitely lock in a lot better, even going as far as saying that slightly bigger wheels are easier even on my 2 ft mini ramp in my shed, with the smaller ones usually being best on curb or carpark session boards.  I guess I have a few too many setups though, so I have something specific for the ramp, something setup just for carpark curbs and something else for park and transition skating round here.  Not that I couldn't skate any of them on any terrain, but some things are nicer with specific setups.



I talk too much about skateboards.  Sorry.

realbasedgod112

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Re: Wheels Thread
« Reply #4974 on: May 23, 2022, 06:34:44 PM »
What are the smallest, but widest wheels on the market? I just put on a friends old wheels for a bit of fun - Conical Fulls that are about 46mm and I didn’t realise how much I would love it. I know the boardycakes are out there but I kinda want to stay around 50ish because I still skate a lot of transition. Started in the mid 2000s but loving the early 90s setup with a football and ventures.

edit: I somehow missed the spitfire “lil smokies”. 50mm Conical Full. Please disregard the above (or not)
checking around facebook marketplace or whatever for old wheels could prove useful, as a lot of people sell their old worn down shit
y’all not fuckin with what i’m fuckin with

FuzzGNU

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Re: Wheels Thread
« Reply #4975 on: May 23, 2022, 09:50:02 PM »
I gotta get to bed, so this is going to be short. I'll follow up tomorrow.

The past two days I've been skating the new formula PP/Bones wheels in 93a duro V6 shape 56mm.

I don't want to overhype these but... They are personally my favorite skate wheels I've ever ridden.

I was shocked to find out these 93a V6 actually break into powerslide EASIER than the 97a and 95a cored ATF shape I was skating. Whoever in this thread said "cores can be a wildcard" must be right, because I was not expecting these to be easier to slide than the harder duros. The cores had to be affecting things.

The best I can describe these wheels is its if Bones made Spitfire F4 99a's, but slightly better in almost every way. I'm sure they probably have some issues with grind friction, but I haven't been able to test them yet.

Really stoked about these. I hope the official release has them in V6 because these are amazing.
Skateboarding is the ultimate challenge.

goodatmeth

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Re: Wheels Thread
« Reply #4976 on: May 25, 2022, 12:02:14 PM »
I gotta get to bed, so this is going to be short. I'll follow up tomorrow.

The past two days I've been skating the new formula PP/Bones wheels in 93a duro V6 shape 56mm.

I don't want to overhype these but... They are personally my favorite skate wheels I've ever ridden.

I was shocked to find out these 93a V6 actually break into powerslide EASIER than the 97a and 95a cored ATF shape I was skating. Whoever in this thread said "cores can be a wildcard" must be right, because I was not expecting these to be easier to slide than the harder duros. The cores had to be affecting things.

The best I can describe these wheels is its if Bones made Spitfire F4 99a's, but slightly better in almost every way. I'm sure they probably have some issues with grind friction, but I haven't been able to test them yet.

Really stoked about these. I hope the official release has them in V6 because these are amazing.

I need more please. You've sent me to wheel horny jail

FuzzGNU

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Re: Wheels Thread
« Reply #4977 on: May 25, 2022, 11:22:28 PM »
I need more please. You've sent me to wheel horny jail

I'm sorry! Okay, I will give these a full review.

As I've said earlier in this thread, I had some issues with the 97a (and to a lesser extent 95a) which both had the hard core ATF hub. I have no idea which issues I had were related to the durometer being too hard, and which were related to the hub. However, I now suspect the power slide initiation issues must have been related to the hard inner hub. It may have caused those wheels to feel overly vibratey on rough streets too(?), but that could easily just be the durometer. There is a pretty big leap in vibration reduction from the 95a hubbed to these 93a unhubbed though, so I think the hub is probably to blame for the vibrations as well.

With that being said, these wheels basically solved all the issues I had with the 97a and 95a hubbed versions.

Bones/PP Experimental Formula 93a V6 56mm:

+ Feel like 99a or 98a. Not bouncy or muted feeling. Definitely a street skating trick wheel. Doesn't feel "heavy" or "delayed" doing tricks.
+ Vibrate less on rough surfaces and maintain speed on rough surfaces better than F4 99a.
+ Handle cracks/pebbles/twigs a bit better than F4 99.
+ Revert/spin better than F4.
+ Break into powerslide way better than the 97a/95a hubbed version, and are a bit more controllable once sliding than F4 99a.
+ Haven't slipped out yet while riding or sliding. They grip very well. Requires a bit more intentional action to initiate a powerslide but not an excessive amount. Large margin of error in terms of force you can apply for powerslides since they don't slip out as easily during slides.
+ Can break into powerslides even at low speeds.
+ V6 shape is better than Conical Full in my opinion. Deeper cut that goes all the way down to the bearing. Actually weighed 56mm CFs and these were ~10% lighter (~275g vs. ~305g)

+/- Has a slightly different slide feel than F4. They have about the same amount of friction overall. I personally prefer this slide, it just took a bit of adjustment to get used to the initiation. It feels like while F4 rely a bit more on being rubbery friction, these use vibration to regulate slides. It somehow feels like it slides easier once sliding but also more controlable during slides.
+/- About the same top speed as F4 99a, maybe these are a bit faster but its pretty close... but I've been swapping around bearings and such so I wasn't able to get a precise 1:1 comparison for this.

- Very slightly less groundfeel than F4 99a. Its subtle. That is part of the trade off for it handling rough roads better I guess. Its not very noticeable, but I've been doing 1:1 comparisons back to back so I can tell.
- Take slightly more effort to break into a powerslide than F4 99a. Its not a huge issue, I've already gotten used to it, and it makes up for it by being harder to slip out on.
- The hubbed 97a and 95a felt a bit faster than this duro... to be expected, but its worth mentioning because those other wheels were so fast.
- I've heard they are sticky for slides and pinched grinds. I haven't gotten to try myself, but could be a dealbreaker for some I'm sure if its bad enough. I have no idea to what extent... and if its something that you can get used to or not.

I honestly have got to give these a 9.5/10 for my purposes. These wheels are pretty fucking awesome and sort of a dream wheel for me.

I've got some of these in 90a on the backburner, but I honestly don't want to take these off my board to try them. I'll have to grab some new bearings so I can go back and forth between the two.

I'm also now curious about how those 95a would feel WITHOUT the hub... if they aren't as vibratey and initiate slides better, those could be a really solid wheel too.
Skateboarding is the ultimate challenge.

manysnakes

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Re: Wheels Thread
« Reply #4978 on: May 26, 2022, 06:13:16 AM »
You can just mail the 90a wheels to me for testing.
This is not my SOTY. I'm telling my kids there was no SOTY for 2021

fernando the skater

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Re: Wheels Thread
« Reply #4979 on: May 26, 2022, 09:52:47 AM »
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I need more please. You've sent me to wheel horny jail
[close]

Bones/PP Experimental Formula 93a V6 56mm:


I guess these are the wheels that && was going on about on his Instagram the other day. Softer, but slide easier. Sounds like a good combination.